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had an A6 TDI loaner today

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Old 07-15-2014, 08:24 PM   #1
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Default had an A6 TDI loaner today

And hated it.

had my A6 in for its 15,000 service - was given a 2014 TDI premium plus as a loaner. Damn, it made me appreciate my 3.0T SO MUCH MORE.

Sorry for all the diesel fans, but to me it is quite sluggish. So slow off the line. Add in the Bose stereo which is weak IMO and I needless to say I was very happy to pick up my 3.0T when it was done at the end of the day
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:30 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Maverick61 View Post
And hated it.

had my A6 in for its 15,000 service - was given a 2014 TDI premium plus as a loaner. Damn, it made me appreciate my 3.0T SO MUCH MORE.

Sorry for all the diesel fans, but to me it is quite sluggish. So slow off the line. Add in the Bose stereo which is weak IMO and I needless to say I was very happy to pick up my 3.0T when it was done at the end of the day
I had a test drive with TDI. Yes not the same in power delivery but I am pleased the new TDI does not have the idle clatter typically associated with Diesel engines.
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:38 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Maverick61 View Post
And hated it.

had my A6 in for its 15,000 service - was given a 2014 TDI premium plus as a loaner. Damn, it made me appreciate my 3.0T SO MUCH MORE.

Sorry for all the diesel fans, but to me it is quite sluggish. So slow off the line. Add in the Bose stereo which is weak IMO and I needless to say I was very happy to pick up my 3.0T when it was done at the end of the day
I had the same reaction.
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:47 PM   #4
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Has been explained to me that it is the torque in the diesel that the transmission can't quite handle so when you ask it to shift it might take a moment to spin down the engine into a range that's safe. To me that was a deal breaker and I ordered the 3.0.
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Old 07-16-2014, 05:34 AM   #5
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I've had my 3.0T for 18 months and it's in the shop for repairs as well and I was given a Prestige TDI to drive. I disagree with the above statements. This car is powerful and fast off the line as well as cruising with ease and powering through traffic with no problem. It's not sluggish at all. Driving a diesel is about the torque and knowing where it is in the powerband.

I've been driving it for a week now and in all the shifting it has never hesitated or spun down to shift. It's been clean and flawless the entire time.

It is a different type of power but I'd take it and the fuel mileage over the 3.0T for sure. Considering a trade right now.
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Old 07-16-2014, 08:41 AM   #6
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Considering a trade right now.
Would def jump on it now, Audi is throwing an unusual (for Audi) amount of incentives right now on the A6 and the TDI adds a bit more:

3k loyalty
1k Premium Plus Discount
700 bose/side assist allowance

Add that to the 3-4k you can easily negotiate on a '14 since the '15 are already coming in and you are at almost 9k off sticker without breaking a sweat.

I just traded in for the TDI and couldn't be happier. I prefer the power band/power delivery of the TDI over the 3.0T in my everyday driving on the interstate. 3.0T is a phenomenal engine, but I prefer my power without having to wind out the engine. Now if I lived somewhere I could track every so often or enjoy some real 2 lane open road visceral motoring I would probably pick the 3.0T, but I don't so TDI it is for me. Never dipping below 30 MPG is a plus too, drove 130 miles before the first tick even comes off the gas gauge.
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Old 07-16-2014, 01:08 PM   #7
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Would def jump on it now,
Sorry, but when I read this I said "Would diesel exhaust fluid jump on it?"
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Old 07-16-2014, 05:46 PM   #8
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I've been driving it for a week now and in all the shifting it has never hesitated or spun down to shift. It's been clean and flawless the entire time.
Interesting the different driving experience. I noticed it most when I was using the paddle shifters and pushing things during my test drive. Where in the 3.0 I would click the paddle and the car would have shifted before I could release, on the TDI I noticed as much as a 3/4 second delay. IIRC it was in the 3rd to 4th gear transition that was the worst.

Maybe it could be mitigated with practice and choosing different shift points. I must admit it was my first diesel experience in 15 years or more.

Off the line I did find the torque equivalent. But I do enough highway merging that I wanted the midrange acceleration to be as quick as possible and hence my alternate choice based on my experience from the test drive.
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:48 PM   #9
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Default 0.1 sec difference from 0 to 60 mph!

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Originally Posted by Maverick61 View Post
And hated it.

Sorry for all the diesel fans, but to me it is quite sluggish. So slow off the line.
Hmmm. A surprise. The acceleration to 60mph has been measured repeatedly by US car magazines and AUDI to be 0.1sec slower for the TDI vs. the TFSI. The German car magazine reviews often indicate a faster mid-range acceleration due to the higher torque at lower RPM as well so .... a bit surprised.
Most people that do not like the TDI complain that "it runs out of power" at the high RPMs as the max RPM is lower for TDI and thus understandable if you like high RPMs and drive frequently between 4000 and 6000 RPM.
TDIs are not for everyone. Happy you like your choice.
Put the TDI in S mode, keeping the RPMs between 2000 and 3000 RPM and you never ever feel like taking it out of Automatic (with the 8 speed)!
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Old 07-16-2014, 07:24 PM   #10
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Most people that do not like the TDI complain that "it runs out of power" at the high RPMs as the max RPM is lower for TDI and thus understandable if you like high RPMs and drive frequently between 4000 and 6000 RPM.
Good discussion. I've learned something. I was pushng the car in the high 4xxx to maybe 5xxx range and using paddle shifters to keep it in that range. I naively thought that would have better acceleration in that range but from what you've just said that was a mistake. And perhaps pushing it into that range is why it had the shift lag. Would be an interesting experiment if I ever drive one again to keep it between 2000 and 3000 and see how it behaved.

Thanks for the info
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Old 07-16-2014, 07:59 PM   #11
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Hmmm. A surprise. The acceleration to 60mph has been measured repeatedly by US car magazines and AUDI to be 0.1sec slower for the TDI vs. the TFSI. The German car magazine reviews often indicate a faster mid-range acceleration due to the higher torque at lower RPM as well so .... a bit surprised.
Well the German magazines are likely measuring time for the German version of the TDI - which is different from the US version (I believe in Germany it is a dual turbo)

And you can't rely on car magazines IMO because they sometimes use aggressive launch control techniques to measure times. I prefer real world driving experiences and I guess what some like to call - the seat of your pants test.

I just know how it felt to me - and the difference in acceleration between the TDI and the 3.0T was extremely noticeable

But everyone has their own likes and dislikes
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Old 07-17-2014, 02:24 AM   #12
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I agree that the TDI runs out of power at the top of the band. However, it does hold its own at the bottom of the band. Take a look at this article. http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...el-test-review
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Old 07-17-2014, 04:32 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Maverick61 View Post
Well the German magazines are likely measuring time for the German version of the TDI - which is different from the US version (I believe in Germany it is a dual turbo)
Actually in Germany you can purchase the A6 TDI with 5 different diesel engines with one of them being more powerful (313PS) than the US mode, one exactly the same and 3 with lower power (136, 190 and 204 PS).

The Car and Driver article just referenced on TDI: " .... Its smooth, immediate torque delivery and the eight-speed automaticís snappy shifts make the diesel an easy way to slither through traffic.
.... Its lag-free power delivery nicely complements the A6ís imperturbable feel and sense of unmatched solidity....

I think that has been most people's experience. Not sure where you found the lag in acceleration.
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Old 07-17-2014, 05:48 AM   #14
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Actually in Germany you can purchase the A6 TDI with 5 different diesel engines with one of them being more powerful (313PS) than the US mode, one exactly the same and 3 with lower power (136, 190 and 204 PS).

The Car and Driver article just referenced on TDI: " .... Its smooth, immediate torque delivery and the eight-speed automaticís snappy shifts make the diesel an easy way to slither through traffic.
.... Its lag-free power delivery nicely complements the A6ís imperturbable feel and sense of unmatched solidity....

I think that has been most people's experience. Not sure where you found the lag in acceleration.
This online magazine felt the same way as Maverick61 towards A6 TDI, so it is not just him. Previously another member posted European 10 best engine award which includes 3.0T engine as well as BMW TDI engine, but Audi TDI was left out.

http://www.autoguide.com/car-compari...535d-3756.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward%27s_10_Best_Engines

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Old 07-17-2014, 06:02 AM   #15
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I can say that once you learn the shifts and powerband of the TDI, it's so much fun to drive.

Someone mentioned traffic and getting in and out. I found the TDI in sport mode to be faster, more responsive, and agile when needing to get up and around other cars. Just seemed to have more pep in sport mode than my 3.0T car in sport mode.
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:46 AM   #16
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Default The 3.0T and 3.0TDI are apples and oranges

I've probably put 10k miles or more on A6 models with the 3.0T in the past 2.5 years, and have 21k miles on my 2014 3.0TDI. Performance characteristics are completely different, and the TDI does require a learning curve for most who are used to normally aspirated or supercharged gasoline engines.

The 3.0T has very good power throughout the RPM range, and the TDI has very good low end and midrange power, but runs out of breath as you get close to its redline. That being said, however, in its torque peak, the TDI becomes a very interesting car. As an example, at this years Quattro de Mayo, at varying times on different drives I was running with a TTS, a TTRS, an S7, and a new Corvette and all were being driven "enthusiastically" on great curvy roads and up and down hills. My TDI had absolutely no difficulty staying with any of them. Sport mode kept the engine in its power band and, while most drivers had to refuel after each drive to have enough fuel for the next drive, I was able to fill up every other day. While I realize that most of the aforementioned cars will walk away from the TDI in a race from 0 to top speed, as the TDI is not as fast over 100mph, there are many "normal" use situations where the TDI will walk most of the others.

Whenever one of my cars has gone in the shop, I've normally been given a 3.0T A6, and thoroughly enjoyed driving it. I love almost everything about the car and powerplant. What I'm not particularly fond of is refueling the 3.0T every 4 days when I'm able to refuel the TDI every 7 days with the identical driving style and use. Regardless of which engine you choose, Audi has given us an amazing car with great driveability.
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Old 07-17-2014, 10:06 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by perlfather View Post

I think that has been most people's experience. Not sure where you found the lag in acceleration.
Ummm, no if you look on this other threads there were many others who had the same experience I had

I know what I felt and experienced. The TDI was sluggish. Glad you like it and enjoy it but please do not try to dismiss my observations by insinuating because what one magazine wrote, I must be wrong. The difference is really noticeable IMO driving the TDI and 3.0T back to back
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:15 AM   #18
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please do not try to dismiss my observations by insinuating because what one magazine wrote, I must be wrong. The difference is really noticeable IMO driving the TDI and 3.0T back to back
Absolutely no insinuating that you are wrong. Simply surprised and thinking that perhaps there was something wrong. I have also driven each type back to back to back. Obviously they are great cars and some (like you) are lucky to have them in the best possible color combination!
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:18 AM   #19
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I think that has been most people's experience. Not sure where you found the lag in acceleration.
I had the same experiences as Maverick (see my separate thread) with my 2014 TDI loaner.
Start from a stop with half throttle, and the car moves leisurely for a second or two and then surges forward.
Make a tight turn, step on it, and not much happens for 2-3 seconds, and then the power kicks in. This is both in D and S mode, both in Comfort or Dynamic setting. There is no / very little lag when manually shifting down into 1st gear (so I guess it's not a turbo lag / spool issue, but a transmission issue).

I don't know how up to date my loaner was with software updates (2014 with 38xx miles on it).
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Old 07-17-2014, 03:15 PM   #20
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Ummm, no if you look on this other threads there were many others who had the same experience I had

I know what I felt and experienced. The TDI was sluggish. Glad you like it and enjoy it but please do not try to dismiss my observations by insinuating because what one magazine wrote, I must be wrong. The difference is really noticeable IMO driving the TDI and 3.0T back to back
I have no doubt that what you experienced happened to you and has happened to other posters here. But it also has not happened to many of us. Especially those of us who own TDIs and don't find them sluggish. That's a lot more valid than a test drive. I drove them both back to back before I went with the TDI. The 2014 TDI I drove did not lag even 0.2 sec let alone 2 or 3 seconds. In fact, as others have noted, when in motion in traffic I think the TDI is flat out quicker than the 3.0T.

I recently went on a long trip with several friends and the lead car was an Audi 3.0T. He could not shake me no matter what he did (at legal or near legal speeds). His comment at the end of the first day "you were like a bug splattered on my rear window." He couldn't believe he couldn't gain space on the TDI but he couldn't. I have no doubt that at higher speeds the 3.0T wins since it has more horsepower.

Which raises the question just what is wrong the the TDIs that several posters have driven that were slugs? There has to be some explanation. I believe others have experienced this but I know it's not normal. Can anyone explain the phenomenon? I can't.
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