jtolittle

Hello,
New to the forum and finally an Audi owner even though my whole family as been driving them for years! I just purchased a 2002 S6 Avant with 182000 miles and "transmission problems". It was said to slip when the trans gets warmer. After reading about the issue, I saw that failing Oring and thought that could be a cheap fix. So I bought the car, dropped the transmission in my driveway (12 hours!!) and opened the ZF5HP24A.. Sure enough, broken oring and worn bearing. I replaced them as well as the friction plates, put everything back together and mounted the trans back on the car.
Now for the problems... I put about 3 quarts of trans fluid in it and tried starting the car to cycle the fluid and add some but the car won't start at all!! Not even crank. In my opinion there could be 2 causes:
- electrical: the starter gets 12V of ignition signal but not 12V at the main/bigger in the back of the starter. I'm pretty sure I put it back correctly and wired it correctly as well.
- 2nd option which I strongly believe is the source: when I plug VCDS lite in the car and check the trans, it shows that the gear selected is 4 and the shift lever is in Park. So I think it doesn't want to start because it thinks it's in gear. Moreover, when I move the shifter to R, N , D, S, the gear selected stays on 4....Hmmmm Sometimes when I move to R, I get R as gear selected.
WHAT'S GOING ON??

Here's what I did so far:
- checked electrical at starter. The ignition signal sends juice. The starter doesn't move when I turn the key. I briefly shorted the starter and it moved.
- I can turn the crank with a 24mm wrench with the trans in P, R, N or D (since there is no fluid in it, I think it's normal)
- I called ZF!!! They told me to check that the shift lever was engaged in the valve body (triple checked!!, even drained again and checked again!). Made sure that the big round plug coming out of the trans pan is connected. Blew air in it, sprayed a bit of lube, wiggled it...
- I can turn the shaft by hand in any gear and see the internals of the trans (without the pan) moving.
- I moved the shifter indicator switch with a screwdriver and noticed on VCDS that the "shifter position" changes... Seems to be working.

I test drove the car before buying it! It was working fine besides the trans slipping. It sounds electrical/software...

Any thought would be appreciated please!
Thank you very much!
I'm a bit bummed to be stuck right now after spending so much effort dropping and fixing the trans!

Prospeeder

Wait wait. So you checked the small trigger wire and it gets 12V when you turn the key to start. But the big wire does not have 12V? The big wire, is a direct connection from the positive battery cable, down the right side, under the airbox, around the engine mount, and to the starter. then another cable goes from the starter to the alternator, so 2 lugs should be on the starter. Be careful! it sounds like your main lead is not hooked up and dangling somewhere, ready to arc to ground and catch fire!

jtolittle

Here is my starter:

jtolittle

One big wire goes to the solenoid.
The small wire is the ignition signal - yellow plug.
Another big wire is bolted on the engine itself (clearly seen in picture).
The back of the starter has a metal bracket that is bolted next to the big wire on the engine.

So I checked again right now. With the battery connected, I get 12V always at the big wire on the solenoid, 0V on the wire on the engine and 0V on the ignition signal (not turning key).
Maybe when I tested the big wire yesterday, the multi meter got disconnected. I did it alone and it's hard to turn the key and hold the leads at the same time!!

So I think the starter wiring is correct...

I have a new neutral safety switch on the way and will try that next...
Thank you for your attention!

Prospeeder

ok, So your missing the trigger. if you want to rule out the transmission range sensor and the anti theft system. Just find the starter interlock relay. Its in position 4 of the big relay panel behind the knee bolster. If you look at the side of the relay, it tells you how it works. If you jump terminal #2 from the ignition switch and #8 to the starter. The car should crank regardless of shifter position or alarm going off. You could at least get it going and figure it out later.

jtolittle

Hello Prospeeder, thanks for your input. I bypassed the starter relay and the car started. I mounted the original starter and neutral safety switch back on. I now have a different issue!!!

THE CAR IS NOT MOVING....

So I installed everything back on the car. Filled the trans pan until overflow (~3 quarts) and then started the car to circulate the fluid. Shifted to R and I had a weird/grindy noise that I didn't like... Back in P and ran it for 30 secs. Shut it off and kept filling another ~2 quarts until full. Started the car again to circulate and warm up the fluid but it stayed around 24C. Shifted through all gears for 3 seconds+. Shut it down. Opened up the fill plug and it was coming out. When in gear the car is not moving at all. I thought I was supposed to put ~11 quarts in but I can't add anymore after ~6/7 quarts. When the car is running, the engine sounds good, however I can "feel" and "hear" the transmission internals turning or the TQ. I have a very good feeling that it is missing oil but I can't add anymore. I raised the back up high to tilt the car and pour in another 3/4 qrt. Still nothing. now the car is on flat ground and nothing. Shifting through all gears. Nothing. Put it in D and pushed it... In R and pushed it. Nothing.
I don't know what else to do. No code on VCDS when idling. If I rev ~1.5k, I get P0730 incorrect gear ratio.

When I put back the TQ, I did not fill it. I couldn't empty it anyway, except what fell out by holding it upside down.

Any thought on what I could try to make it moving??

Thank you.
JT

Prospeeder

First off, terrible way to try and fill the trans, You should fill till it runs out engine off, then start it and continue filling until it runs out. (If you put in a new converter or suspect the converter drained itself, then start it for a few seconds, enough to fill the converter, and shut it off, continue filling, runs out, start it.) When it starts running out again, then run it through drive, reverse, drive, then park, Then if the fluid around 30C or so, and its slightly dripping out, its full.

Unfortunately if the trans is full, filter is seated correctly, and its making noise and not moving. The trans is bad. Either you didnt have the converter seated all the way and crushed the pump, or the trans just happened to be bad. I would doubt your fill procedure would have killed it, but is not healthy shifting gears 3-5 quarts low on fluid.