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Old 08-06-2014, 03:00 PM   #1
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Default Almost ready to pull the trigger on a used A8 L... any words of advice?

I've checked KBB and the Audi dealer's price is about $4000 less than "average" and about $2000 less than the minimum "fair market range". Dealer has all the service records (they are the original dealer) and the previous owners followed the schedules pretty exactingly from what I can tell.

The car has about 62,352 miles on the odometer. The price is a little over $30K.

I am coming from a 2012 model year vehicle that has tons of safety gizmos that I use all the time on my current vehicle. It's a mid-size luxury sedan, similar to the 5-series, A6, Infiniti M, Lexus GS, etc. I drive a lot on the interstate. Blind spot warning, adaptive cruise, etc. This vehicle has the tech package, so I've got those features. It also has the rear passenger climate control, the right color interior and exterior, etc. It's also full size and much quieter.

First, since this is coming from an Audi dealer, what should I ask of them about the car? It's not eligible for CPO. Carfax is completely clean and shows all the aforementioned service records.

Second, I plan on getting an extended warranty. I want as close to a bumper-to-bumper experience as possible. Does anyone have any suggestions or recommendations?

Third, are the driving characteristics a lot different compared to a standard wheelbase 2011 A8? There are no D3's in my area to test drive, so I can only compare it to 2011.

Fourth, and I could search for this answer but since I'm posting, can the windows be upgraded aftermarket to the dual-pane glass?

Thanks everyone! I hope to join the Audi family soon.
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Old 08-06-2014, 03:01 PM   #2
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I should add that this is a 2009 model year A8 L that I am looking at.
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Old 08-06-2014, 04:36 PM   #3
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1: Ask them whatever comes to mind. The A8 has never sold at KBB or valued price, it is always below as the depreciation on these cars is astronomical. Ask what inspection they did as well as ask them what upcoming maintenance needs to be done on the car within the next 50k. Since the 07+ don't have a timing belt you can pass on that. What is recommended if I recall correctly is a new water pump, serpentine belt, air and cabin filter and oil change soon. Might need to do new spark plugs if they weren't already changed. Have the dealer inspect the condition of the control arm bushings as well as this is a common replacement item. If the tires are really worn or need replacing soon, negotiate that into the price. I'd also change the fuel filter, $20. Test the trans and make sure it doesn't have a "hoot" noise under full throttle when shifting gears when the car is warmed up. I believe it was resolved in the later years, but still worth a check as its a $2k flush at the dealer.

2. I don't mess with aftermaket warranties. They are super expensive up front for most and they can be a heart attack to understand and get anything covered under it. Some have had it save them a lot of money, some have had it be a nightmare to even understand and use.

3. I have a short wheelbase 2005 A8 and a 2007 long wheelbase W12. I've also driven many other long wheelbase A8s and can say that there isn't a large difference in regards to driving characteristics. It doesn't feel overly large and the benefited space from the long wheelbase is really nice. If any difference the car may hop a bit more over rough roads if your control arm busings are worn.

4. No, they cannot. Well never say never as if you want to security guard your car for $$$$$ you could always do that. But no, every aspect of the doors, and windows would have to be modified, programming would have to be done, and it really isn't worth it. It is a nice feature if you have it, but definitely not worth retrofitting. My 05 A8 doesn't have it and the W12 does. I don't notice a major difference at all, maybe a tad but it was defeated by the larger 20" stock wheels on the W12 that made the ride rougher and louder. The A8 I have has 18" and the road noise is nothing to be concerned about. If you want to start worrying or wanting to retrofit large items like that think of getting an S8 or W12 that has those features standard. The features that are not worth or way too difficult to retrofit: bang and olufsen, full leather package (leather on dashboard), alcantara headliner and lining of the car, and soft close doors. If you want to see a fully spec'd A8 look at mine:

http://forums.audiworld.com/a8-s8-d3...-sale-2853165/

For what it's worth, I'd be glad to welcome you to the D3 A8 club. Too few members are looking for an A8 for its drive, attention to detail, and overall beautiful looks of the car. If you were a new guy looking to drop it on springs, throwup chrome all over, and put 22" wheels on the car I'd say get out! But hey, hope your purchase goes well, maybe another member can check it out for you, but given you live in Nebraska, good luck lol
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Old 08-06-2014, 06:10 PM   #4
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Price doesn't sound too bad not sure about maintenance schedules with this model. I got my 09' S8 with 61, xxx on the clock and it had received the 55,000mi major maintenence.
Quirky issues since I have had it: Front air shocks have a minor leak at lower that 60F, left front would deflate partially at night. Door handle button iffy at times (simple reset with VCDS cures that).
If you are somewhat inclined (or handy) and have a laptop, do invest in a VCDS cable for self diagnosis. Best bet would take the car for a test ride and do a scan on your own, as there are many other areas that will not be detected by a MIL or CEL going off in the dash.
Good luck with your purchase, hope to see pictures of it soon.
__________________
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Video enabled
VIM enabled
Foglight ROW
VCDS Lowered
LED puddle/trunk lights
Keyfob/doorswitch window convenience mod

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Old 08-06-2014, 08:06 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Wasserwerks View Post
Front air shocks have a minor leak at lower that 60F, left front would deflate partially at night. Door handle button iffy at times
Both of these are very common issues. I've experienced shock issues on both of my cars as well as intermittent/loss of auto unlock ability on both cars as well. Not cheap fixes in either case. Shocks $$$$, door handle is $270+
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Old 08-07-2014, 02:31 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brozee View Post
1: Ask them whatever comes to mind. The A8 has never sold at KBB or valued price, it is always below as the depreciation on these cars is astronomical. Ask what inspection they did as well as ask them what upcoming maintenance needs to be done on the car within the next 50k. Since the 07+ don't have a timing belt you can pass on that. What is recommended if I recall correctly is a new water pump, serpentine belt, air and cabin filter and oil change soon. Might need to do new spark plugs if they weren't already changed. Have the dealer inspect the condition of the control arm bushings as well as this is a common replacement item. If the tires are really worn or need replacing soon, negotiate that into the price. I'd also change the fuel filter, $20. Test the trans and make sure it doesn't have a "hoot" noise under full throttle when shifting gears when the car is warmed up. I believe it was resolved in the later years, but still worth a check as its a $2k flush at the dealer.
I'll pass this along. The dealer is going to hate me, I am sure.

Looks like the previous owner did 15K, 35K, 45K, and 55K maintenance. Front and rear break pads and rotors replaced at 42K.

Tires are new and are pretty run-of-the-mill Continental ContiProContact. Cheap meat and potatoes all-season.

Here's what was done at 55K:

Maintenance inspection completed
55,000 mile service performed
Headlights adjusted
Air filter replaced
Engine/powertrain computer/module checked
Washed/detailed
Brakes checked
Axles checked
Cooling system checked
Exhaust system checked
Horns checked
Tire condition and pressure checked
Steering/suspension checked
Wipers/washers checked
Battery serviced
Body lubricated
Cabin air filter replaced/cleaned
Oil and filter changed
Spark plug(s) replaced
Maintenance reminder reset

Quote:
2. I don't mess with aftermaket warranties. They are super expensive up front for most and they can be a heart attack to understand and get anything covered under it. Some have had it save them a lot of money, some have had it be a nightmare to even understand and use.
Well, the only thing I'd consider is an exclusionary warranty. I feel very, very nervous about getting a 60K mile car without some form of coverage. This will be the first used-ish car I'll have owned since 1992. I know the Audi's can be incredibly expensive to repair and while I'm comfortable with some DIY, major powertrain or electrical issues are beyond what I want to cope with out of pocket.

Here's the list of what isn't covered, and it makes sense to me. Does any of this jump out to you as terribly awful?

components of electrically powered vehicles
paint
exhaust system
carpet
glass
upholstery
soft trim
weather-stripping
belts and hoses
moldings
bright metal
clutch disc
air bag sensors
non-OEM audio/navigation system components
battery and cables
lenses and bulbs
tires
brake drums
disc brake rotors
wheels
shock absorbers
MacPherson strut inserts
squeaks
rattles
water leaks
wind noise
constant velocity boots
maintenance services
pressure plate and throw out bearing (manual transmission)
any and all in-vehicle communications systems

Quote:
3. I have a short wheelbase 2005 A8 and a 2007 long wheelbase W12. I've also driven many other long wheelbase A8s and can say that there isn't a large difference in regards to driving characteristics. It doesn't feel overly large and the benefited space from the long wheelbase is really nice. If any difference the car may hop a bit more over rough roads if your control arm busings are worn.
Thanks! Glad to know the L isn't that much different. I love the adjustable suspension in these types of cars.

Quote:
4. No, they cannot. ... If you want to see a fully spec'd A8 look at mine:

http://forums.audiworld.com/a8-s8-d3...-sale-2853165/
Yep, I've seen the W12's. Love them. Just afraid about repairing them.

Quote:
For what it's worth, I'd be glad to welcome you to the D3 A8 club. Too few members are looking for an A8 for its drive, attention to detail, and overall beautiful looks of the car. If you were a new guy looking to drop it on springs, throwup chrome all over, and put 22" wheels on the car I'd say get out! But hey, hope your purchase goes well, maybe another member can check it out for you, but given you live in Nebraska, good luck lol
Nothing burns me more than seeing nice cars getting way too much aftermarketization on otherwise perfectly smart looking cars. A tasteful body kit is about all I would consider. Or some 20's without the drop. Something that looks plausibly OEM.

As for Nebraska, it's not unusual in Omaha to see exotics. I see Bentleys and Maybachs now and then. Ferraris are relatively common in the haute couture district. Tons and TONS of 5-series. Audis I see are mostly SUVs and A6/S6. It's called "being in a city with 500,000 people with an extremely low cost of living."

But make no mistake, I treat these old money tycoons with nothing but contempt. Money remaining dormant in the coffers of fourth or fifth generation families turns my stomach. The plutocracy is alive and well here. They've partially walled themselves off in a culturally secluded area of town, known as "Regency", since the late 1970's. Here you will find an enclave where wealth no longer has any meaning and no material possession is out of reach. The Nebraska aristocracy, also know as the "Knights of Aksarben" (long rumored to be a secret society where sons and daughters are traded for board memberships), clings to its hayseed roots as if a free press was never invented. But don't get me started on our local news media...

Still, I like it here. We have gangs and miscreants and hippies and hipsters. We elect idiots and push the envelope in mediocrity. It's a state desperately clamoring to be nationally relevant yet reels in horror in the face of any semblance of attaining that goal. We're a deeply cynical state with a football cult and a pack of radicals in charge who would rather see Google build their data centers in Iowa and Tesla build their factory in Texas than dare to erect a wind farm in God's Nebraska.

Anyway, sorry for the screed. Hope you got a chuckle! Thanks for all the help! I appreciate it.
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Old 08-07-2014, 02:36 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Wasserwerks View Post
Price doesn't sound too bad not sure about maintenance schedules with this model. I got my 09' S8 with 61, xxx on the clock and it had received the 55,000mi major maintenence.
Quirky issues since I have had it: Front air shocks have a minor leak at lower that 60F, left front would deflate partially at night. Door handle button iffy at times (simple reset with VCDS cures that).
If you are somewhat inclined (or handy) and have a laptop, do invest in a VCDS cable for self diagnosis. Best bet would take the car for a test ride and do a scan on your own, as there are many other areas that will not be detected by a MIL or CEL going off in the dash.
Good luck with your purchase, hope to see pictures of it soon.
VCDS cables look exactly like the OBD2 module I have already. Probably not the same thing, I am guessing. Looks like there's some custom VW/Audi software?
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Old 08-07-2014, 04:01 AM   #8
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QUOTE=needles;24593842]VCDS cables look exactly like the OBD2 module I have already. Probably not the same thing, I am guessing. Looks like there's some custom VW/Audi software?[/QUOTE]

A regular OBD2 cable might only allow you to check and clear certain codes. With VCDS you can modify different systems to your taste.
Small examples:
Suspension level mod.
Exterior lighting (fog lights ON with high beams)
Extensive diagnostics
Reset service reminder
Much much more.
It was my first purchase for the S8 and well worth it.

Http://www.ross-tech.com/index.html
__________________
2009 S8 Daytona grey, B/O, C/F
Video enabled
VIM enabled
Foglight ROW
VCDS Lowered
LED puddle/trunk lights
Keyfob/doorswitch window convenience mod

Chris Knox
President, Wasserwerks
Visit us at Wasserwerks.com or find us on facebook
@wasserwerks for instagram users
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Old 08-07-2014, 06:56 AM   #9
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Standard OBDII allows you to only control/reset things with the engine such as the engine light which almost never is the case when something is wrong with an Audi. It is almost always something that needs the dealer tool or in our case VCDS.

VCDS if you look it up will explain it much better than I can but it is essentially a diagnostic tool that allows you to adapt, change, customize, and configure just about every aspect of the car. It also allows you to get very indepth and see values of TPMS sensor life, cylinder compression, even the status of fuel injectors and fuel pressure senders ohms/resistance.

Hope it helps. I waited on getting the tool for two years after buying my first Audi. In the first year alone if I learned how to use it properly, it would have saved me easily in the price of the tool. I've now used it to help out guys at car meets, traded my time and skill with the tool for lunches from various people , as well as helping customizing and diagnosing my own personal cars. It also helped me get $800 worth of otherwise invisible broken components on my W12 at time of purchase of the vehicle. I used it a few times on Audis before friends or members have bought their car. Dealers always look at me funny when I break out my laptop and diagnostic cable, that or they cringe!
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Old 08-07-2014, 08:53 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by needles View Post
I'll pass this along. The dealer is going to hate me, I am sure.
Based on what you said at the end of your post I doubt he will know.

Quote:
Maintenance inspection completed
55,000 mile service performed
Headlights adjusted
Air filter replaced
Engine/powertrain computer/module checked
Washed/detailed
Brakes checked
Axles checked
Cooling system checked
Exhaust system checked
Horns checked
Tire condition and pressure checked
Steering/suspension checked
Wipers/washers checked
Battery serviced
Body lubricated
Cabin air filter replaced/cleaned
Oil and filter changed
Spark plug(s) replaced
Maintenance reminder reset
This is good reason why not to go to a dealer. Noting done for a $$$.


Quote:
Here's the list of what isn't covered, and it makes sense to me. Does any of this jump out to you as terribly awful?

components of electrically powered vehicles
paint
exhaust system
carpet
glass
upholstery
soft trim
weather-stripping
belts and hoses
moldings
bright metal
clutch disc
air bag sensors
non-OEM audio/navigation system components
battery and cables
lenses and bulbs
tires
brake drums
disc brake rotors
wheels
shock absorbers
MacPherson strut inserts
squeaks

rattles
water leaks
wind noise
constant velocity boots
maintenance services
pressure plate and throw out bearing (manual transmission)
any and all in-vehicle communications systems
Items in red is all you need and they are not covered. I would just skip any warranty. For the money you save you can fix everything and go for nice vacation. This cars can run 300K miles without major problem. One you are looking at is almost new.

Quote:
Nothing burns me more than seeing nice cars getting way too much aftermarketization on otherwise perfectly smart looking cars. A tasteful body kit is about all I would consider. Or some 20's without the drop. Something that looks plausibly OEM.
Than you are on the right forum.

The rest of your post was really educational. I like it.
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Old 08-07-2014, 08:53 AM
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