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Deflector scheduling for the sunroof

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Old 09-25-2013, 05:35 AM   #1
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Default Deflector scheduling for the sunroof

Is there a way within VCDS to change the deflector scheduling for the sunroof? It's not a problem at highway speeds. but becomes very obnoxious at low speed. We are often in traffic that hovers just about at the change points and the often changing deflector is bothersome. I know that the motor probably needs to be serviced or replaced because of the level of noise during it's operation. I'd like to try and set the Audi up like the one on my bug....the deflector is either up or down.
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Old 09-25-2013, 10:07 AM   #2
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if you replace the electrical motor - the deflector will work properly.
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Old 09-25-2013, 04:06 PM   #3
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Default Small world, just now replacing mine...

when it gets here in a few days. Just did a thorough interior clean plus replaced some worn switch type items. Found the motor making a bunch of noise when I opened and closed roof to get all the rail and other areas up there. Since one of the things I replaced was the roof switch trim area (which is a distinct part from the switches underneath the trim in this one case, I already saw where the motor is--right above the center of that panel just in front of the sunroof itself.
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Old 09-25-2013, 05:02 PM   #4
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The wind deflector is motorized? Mine is either up or down and appears to be operated only by the motion of the roof panel in a conventional manner. What does the motor do? Is it an option or something.
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Old 09-25-2013, 05:28 PM   #5
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Default Yes, motorized

Basically moves it up and down more or less aggressively based on speed. Don't know about other markets, but standard on US ones AFAIK. If you put your hand on it while driving (w/ the other hand), or as a passenger and vary your speed some around town you sometimes feel it doing its thing movement wise. Not very apparent visually when sitting there driving, especially w/ it up above you.
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helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.

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Old 09-25-2013, 05:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvs_dave View Post
The wind deflector is motorized? Mine is either up or down and appears to be operated only by the motion of the roof panel in a conventional manner. What does the motor do? Is it an option or something.
While driving lightly hold your hand over it, as you slow down to a stop it should raise. As you speed up it should lower. It's a nice feature, unfortunately if you have the radio off or if it is quiet, the system get's quite annoying by the noise of it going up and down. I used to hate it when I lived in an apartment complex which had speed bumps; the thing would adjust about every 10 seconds. There has been threads on this actually making grinding noises if the motor goes.
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Old 09-26-2013, 06:01 AM   #7
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Mine just started to making noises. I rarely open my sunroof so maybe I didn't realize but it was making that creaky noise. Is it easy to replace the motor? Can I lubricate somewhere instead of replacing the motor?
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:37 AM   #8
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Vicl: The deflector goes up and down fine, it just that it's noisy while in motion and the speed set points that Audi has programmed in, are centered right at the traffic speeds that we run into. The other morning, we were in traffic with speeds moving a few mph either side of 40, which is the set point for the deflector to move from the intermediate position to the full up position. We probably crossed the set point at least 30 times in 10 minutes. After a number of cycles, I got frustrated and closed the sun roof. I simply want to change it so that when the sun roof opens, the deflector opens fully. If I can't find a way to reprogram it, then I'll have to settle for disconnecting the deflector motor. I want the sun roof without the noise.
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:46 AM   #9
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Default Same here

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Originally Posted by dvs_dave View Post
The wind deflector is motorized? Mine is either up or down and appears to be operated only by the motion of the roof panel in a conventional manner. What does the motor do? Is it an option or something.
After reading this post, I went out and open the roof while driving - It just popped up as spring loaded. Haven't noticed the motor running or noise even on freeway. At what speed does it start to operate?

Louis
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:54 AM   #10
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Default Not that I can tell

Before I realized it was the deflector motor, I thought the noise was actually the main roof motor. By coincidence I pulled off the front roof panel trim--where lighting, sunroof switch, etc. are. Audi sunroof motors (when they were less reliable in the 80's) used to be up there. Instead, that's where the deflector motor is--just in front of the roof opening and basically right above where the two rectangular front seat illumination lights are. After I heard the noise, I looked for anything obvious to lubricate or that was dirty, and nothing apparent. With that trim out and operating the sunroof, it became obvious the noise was right from the motor itself and I could feel the vibration on the motor case as it happened. Without it apart and especially from outside the car, I would have guessed the noise was coming from the two side rails of the sunroof and that it was some kind of friction/track noise.

I have yet to take the motor out, but the illustrations suggest it's a couple of screws and the wire connector. The overhead trim to get at it takes a few steps of carefully prying things out, which has to be done from the right places to avoid forcing/breaking something. Bentley shows it.
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helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.


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Old 09-27-2013, 09:38 AM   #11
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Louis: I'll have to go drive the car in the morning when I get home from work and I will check the set points.

It may be that only the cars that were equipped with the solar power panel in the sun roof have the motorized deflector. I know that I can't open the interior sun roof shade without opening the sun roof itself, as mine has the solar panel.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:54 AM   #12
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Default Solar and wind deflector are totally independent

All the A8's have the wind deflector stuff; the solar only means you can't slide the interior panel back independently, since you can't see out the solar panel obscured glass. Plus if it is like my old A6 with the same feature, the voltage converter board is probably under that interior trim panel.
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helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.


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Old 09-27-2013, 09:58 AM   #13
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My guess you have noise from the incorrect deflector position as motor can no longer push it up high enough (or from motor itself as MP4.2 mentioned earlier). In my case the electrical motor is about to gave up "it's position". On the low speed I can feel wind vibration. The "solution" I have for now is following. When the sunroof is opening I'm helping to motor to elevate the deflector. Once it is fully elevated no noise. Mine is still strong enough so it can pull it down and up depending from the speed. But on the low speed it cannot fully elevate it and I always have to help it

Eventually I'll have to research and replace that item.

Good luck!
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:34 PM   #14
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Ok, I tested the deflector at lunch, it does move up/down a little, not much, my friend was watching it. The movement wasn't significant.

Cheers,

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Old 09-27-2013, 01:13 PM   #15
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Yes, all the D3 have the motor to raise and lower the deflector. Mine also makes a lot of noise. There are some write ups for lubing the mechanism and some have fixed the noise issue with grease. I have not tried this yet. Here in ATL, I only use the sunroof in late fall when it's not hot.

The different angle of the deflector does do a good job of keeping the car from the wind buffeting. Another testament on how much engineering is built into our cars.
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Old 09-27-2013, 02:28 PM   #16
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Bentley chapter shows how to take it out for service. I have heard of another fix besides re-greasing, you shim the motor. This has worked for some people, but my fix cured it until I get another motor- Just remove the motor.
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Old 09-27-2013, 11:59 PM   #17
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Default Sunroof Deflector "Initialization" and "learning" (as in, Calibration)

Below the backgrounder are some tips all can follow to see if maybe they just need a calibration type adjustment on their sunroof air deflector, which Bentley calls "initialization." Frankly I had no idea it existed as an adjustment/calibration, though perhaps some of us have stumbled on the first phase of it before and thought we broke something (like me at times in past IIRC).

I replaced my sunroof deflector motor tonight, because as reported earlier it got quite noisy just recently when I closed the roof. Replacing it was some experience--T9 torx screw (one of two) through a tiny space where the deflector normally is with your head stuck out the opening to barely see the tiny hole for starters, let alone lucky I even had a T9 driver that was magnetized from a little PC/Mac type electronics tool kit I got some months ago.

As I pulled the motor out, it became clear the cam that drives the deflector movement just wasn't in the right position either, so mine was probably badly miscalibrated. That could possibly have been the issue that led to my noise to begin with. Since I had bought the replacement, I just kept going.

TIPS:

Initialization of the deflector and then learning consists of the following:

1. Switch ignition on so you can run sunroof.

2. Pull down on the sunroof control ****, like you are closing it if you had the back edge tilted. Keep holding it down until you hear some ratcheting/clicking noises. (this is the part I've done before at times, but figured in the past I was straining something and always let go). Per Bentley that is it for "initialization." It may be that gets the motor cam in the right position as far as how it is positioned when the motor gear box drive (that is part of the unit) positions it. I could see the cam of my my old one was clearly not positioned the same as the new one, which also made it a b$%#@ to get out.

3. Bentley makes you think the next step is separate, until you read it a couple times. Then you realize this is one continuous process really and continues from #2. Thus, once you hear the ratcheting sound in #2 let go of the switch, but only momentarily. Immediately pull it down and hold it, now for a good minute or so.

4. While you are holding it down again, it works its magic. The sunroof opens completely, then closes, then pops up in back, then lowers again. Only when the back lowers finally is it done and you let go of the switch. The manual says that is just to ensure pinch protection function, but it's just an easy continuation of #2 anyway. That's it!

5. Not part of those steps, but completely separately discussed in Bentley, you can both align your deflector and see if it is actually at the right baseline height fully extended. Mine was more than half an inch too low in retrospect, which I realized when it became apparent the motor cam was way out of position and I was struggling to lower the arm mechanism that works the deflector up and down (Bentley calls them bows) so I could get at the teeny tiny T9 buried behind them. To be clear, this next "alignment" will only deal with how close (front to back in the opening) the deflector gets to the opening edge itself, but where it lands vertically/height wise is a good reference point to see if you need "initialization" per the above or if something else is messed up. Look at the front lower edge of the deflector and you will see it is gasketed just like the sunroof. In six years I never noticed that before, even though I clean the whole opening at least a few times a year.

To align the deflector, you open the roof all the way. Then that gasket at the lower leading edge of the deflector should basically be touching the backward edge of the roof cut out (down toward the bottom of the edge--from memory the vertcal edge of the opening is maybe close to 3/8"/10mm --essentially it all forms a near air/breeze tight seal right there when the deflector is properly fully extended. Bentley actually says adjust it to be only single sheet of paper thickness apart from the gasket to the sheet metal. You can check it if you stand in the door jamb and look at it from well above. There are some 7mm screws (with an inaccessible Torx head too) along the side edge of the roof cutout; just use a 7mm open or box end) back at that deflector hinge point where you can slide the hinged mechanism forward or back some. Mine needed just a mm or so on the (North America) driver's side a bit more forward. Again, in retrospect, the biggie I caught was the whole deflector was too low and the gasketed lower leading edge of the deflector was somewhat below the side of the opening because the motor hadn't driven it up enough. I should have calibrated it before proceeding in the first place, both to diagnose it better but also make it a lot easier to get out--the cam position is also important for that to avoid forcing, scratching or bending anything.

There you go. If it still doesn't fly for both function and (no) noise, the deflector motor part # is 4E0 959 591 A. The calibration and initialization is maybe 15 minutes of playing with it, assuming you even adjust it slightly with the 7mm wrench. That and a piece of paper are all you should require, plus maybe a rag and detailing spray to clean the area up a bit if needed.
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helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.


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Old 09-28-2013, 10:03 AM   #18
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Default 40 MPH ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cvairwerks View Post
Vicl: The deflector goes up and down fine, it just that it's noisy while in motion and the speed set points that Audi has programmed in, are centered right at the traffic speeds that we run into. The other morning, we were in traffic with speeds moving a few mph either side of 40, which is the set point for the deflector to move from the intermediate position to the full up position. We probably crossed the set point at least 30 times in 10 minutes. After a number of cycles, I got frustrated and closed the sun roof. I simply want to change it so that when the sun roof opens, the deflector opens fully. If I can't find a way to reprogram it, then I'll have to settle for disconnecting the deflector motor. I want the sun roof without the noise.
On my 04 the speed for raising to the upper position is 20 MPH...does everybody else have 40MPH as the speed point ?
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Old 09-28-2013, 05:33 PM   #19
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Default Mine is 20MPH too

Knowing the Audi think, I bet it's actually 30kmh, which would be 18.6 MPH. Basically below about 20MPH it is at the first position--the same as when you "initialize" it per my recent reply w/lots of details there. At that point it is near the bottom of the front edge of the sunroof opening. Then when it hits about 20MPH, it moves up to the top of the opening so that the leading edge of the deflector where the rubber gasket is becomes just about flush to the roof surface, and now the whole thing is like a wedge driving the air flow upward from there.
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Current #2: 2013 Q5 2.0T hybrid; Scuba blue w/ chestnut sport interior; Euro delivery 7/2013 (pictured at Ingolstadt); RS5 front brakes
Prior (each modded): 2000 C5 A6 4.2 & '96 C4 A6 2.8Q, both still w/ family; '85 C3 5000S 5 sp FWD; '73 C1 100LS

helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.

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Old 09-28-2013, 05:38 PM   #20
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Default Confirming for others, only w/ motor out or working will it get to max height.

now having replaced mine and seeing how it works correctly, if the motor is either broken or miscalibrated, it will be only part way up. Same result logically if it is unplugged, since the baseline before it starts moving the deflector upward seems to be the 20MPH point, and the motor cam and gearbox system is such that (as I found fighting it to get the motor out), the motor doesn't want to move in response to manual movement of the cam or the deflector ams ("bows" per Bentley) connected to them.

The motor would have to be out to allow the spring effect of the deflector to pop it to the >20MPH position higher up from what I can see, and the way it seemed to work from just doing the deflector motor replacement. It can be checked in any case--if the deflector leading edge (where the gasket is) isn't basically flush to the roof surface and then the whole deflector is a triangular wedge upward from there, it isn't at its final high position, which is where wind noise at mid and higher speeds would be moderated better.
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Current #1: '06 D3 A8L W12 brilliant black w/ amaretto; 4 seat setup, CPO; modestly lowered, H&R 20mm rear and 12mm front DRs with 275/35 on OEM polished + forged 20's; S8 sway bars (see: rear bar and gen'l D3 bar info and front bar); tweaked 385mm front factory brake mod and matching rear brake mod; matching C6 A6 back headrests (better rear view: headrest tweak); owner installed AMI retrofit with part number details here. [pics now only in picture poster] Upper control arm reference (+ more info in replies) here. Lower cost D3 OES sway bar links here.
Current #2: 2013 Q5 2.0T hybrid; Scuba blue w/ chestnut sport interior; Euro delivery 7/2013 (pictured at Ingolstadt); RS5 front brakes
Prior (each modded): 2000 C5 A6 4.2 & '96 C4 A6 2.8Q, both still w/ family; '85 C3 5000S 5 sp FWD; '73 C1 100LS

helpful cross reference to a C6 post with MMI and other TSB's that also cover D3 A8's.


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