05audiman

I went to test drive a newer (2011) Audi recently and I wasn't impressed. It's basically my car with cooler gadgets inside, but not as good looking outside. I along with most ppl I know prefer D3 body styling over D4. Only upside to D4 are the gadgets and updates within. I journeyed on to another Audi and came across a monster... CL600 2008. This car is wayyyyy faster than any Audi I've driven, cool gadgets that are in newer Audi's, and just overall a nicer vehicle. At 25k, this car makes more sense than a w12 or s8. The power is up from the two, and the only thing I'll lose is room, 2 doors, and quattro. Room and doors can go as I have a 4 year old and she can undo her own safety belt and usually climbs up front to get out anyway. Really wouldn't be losing quattro because I don't plan on selling the Audi. My next car is coming soon, it will definitely be German, but which one?

05audiman

This is the CL600

Jack88

Oh, I like those. They're not faster than a D4 S8, but then again those run 70k or more used. Have you seen a CL65? Same thing, but an even bigger engine and bigger brakes. Those things are downright lethally fast.

05audiman

MB 510 HP, 612 lb/ft. S8 520hp, 479 lb/ft. These are numbers from this Benz (2008) and a 2013 S8. The Mercedes still wins as it is .2 tics away from the R8 in a quarter mile run. I just think the Benz is a lot more refined and put together better. The S8 would break the bank, this Benz is just under 27k with 60k miles. I test drove it also and it's a lot faster than almost everything I've ever driven. I have seen the cl65 and like a s8 it's extremely high. If you compare years, MB is years ahead. The 08 has everything the Audi had and more and it's 4 years older. The night vision didn't even come on Audi's til 2011.

05audiman

Jack88, with those torque numbers, the S8 doesn't really stand a chance. The guy was nice enough to let me take it for a spin for a hour and a half. You better believe I googled how to take all the driver help crap off and smoked the tires. The driver aid's really keeps it calm on take off, but it is still a beast, just harder to smoke the tires.

Jack88

Per Car and Driver:
2013 S8;
0-60: 3.6
1/4 mile: 11.9@118mph
2007 CL600;
0-60: 4.3
1/4 mile: 12.8@113
It's not even close. The CL600 is absolutely a fine car, and I do like them. Even the CL65 can't come close with a 12.6@120mph the best they could muster. The CL can't turn a corner, not at all. At it's heart, the CL is a muscle car from Deutschland. And it is wonderful for it, but it's not near the all around performer the S8 is. The CL600 is definitely the better value, and is certainly worth all consideration, with the faster S8 being off the table.

05audiman

You see the difference in years and price tho. And I'm sure that test was with the cl600 driving aids off. Besides, nobody is going to use the full HP and torque numbers. At least not I, it's about luxury for me. The cl can't turn corners lol, that's laughable. I turned them pretty easy on a real world street test at daily high speeds.

MP4.2+6.0

Yes, the D4 S8 is really really fast. AWD stickiness, 8 speeds, plus sense Audi power numbers are purposely low balled, maybe for insurance but who knows.

While I wouldn't chip any newer car, see interesting #'s on APR's web site, where they actually tested it stock. That was to validate Audi's numbers and then show what their incremental true add was. They got 577HP and 556 ft. lbs of torque, stock, with 93 octane fuel. Footnotes say 2013 S8 averaged over several runs. See: https://www.goapr.com/products/ecu_u...40tfsi_s8.html

Prices are still somewhat high on S8's but there are good number sold as a percentage of D4's. Should be rolling off leases now and D4 market should be starting to soften up more as D5 date approaches. Older D4 W12's have already slid a lot, but the performance specs ran away in favor of the S8. The 4.0T's (A8's) are also faster than either the D4 W12's or any of the big D3 motors, and pre-2016 the was also a SWB version.

05audiman

S8 is a beast, I know that, but we're talking about two cars that are 5 years apart. The point something second difference is kinda irrelevant since I doubt I'll take anything luxury to a track. The price difference is where it's at, and that's huge. I kinda opened up a can of worms when I mentioned a Mercedes in an Audi forum. It's like saying you prefer Smith and Wesson on a glock forum lol.

carl viking

They did the same thing with the S6. I recall that C&D tested the E63, the M5 and the S6 and the S6 ran away with the victory. They dynoed the car and found it have 60 or 70 more HP than what was listed. Crazy (good!).
For the D4 I would surely not go W12, you can do to much fun with turbos and chips.... Even a fully loaded regular D4 4.0T with a chip is really, really fast for a reasonable price tag.
Not sure why you wouldn't chip it? Some (esp vendors...) would argue it's safer to chip today than back in the last turbo wave.