Bang and Olufsen DAC bit depth?
05-12-2016, 05:57 AM
#11
AudiWorld Senior Member
As an audiophile with a lot of experience in car systems I can assure you that whatever DAC they used in the B&O system is not a great one. Car companies simply don't put good audio components into their cars, regardless of the price the customer pays.
Furthermore, the processing, amplifiers and speakers in a factory system are of such limited quality that having a good DAC would probably be a wasted effort.
I agree with the above statement that it's likely the MMI system is down-sampling the audio as it comes in. While it might accept a 24/192 FLAC file, my guess is the DAC is ultimately running at 24/48. This is an educated guess based on the fact that in the aftermarket car audio market there are no DSP processors that operate at 24/192. The best car audio processor currently is the Helix DSP Pro, which processes at 24/96. It will accept 24/192, but it down-samples to 96kHz.
Most of the other car audio DSP processors operate at 48kHz. The Helix was the first to get to 96, so I am very highly doubtful that an OEM system in an Audi is doing better.
I will say that if you are interested in an actual answer from Audi, I think you might be able to get one. I sent an email to Audi of North America asking about the DVD player, and whether it's a "player" or a "transport." I wasn't expecting to ever get an answer, but they did indeed contact the engineers in Germany and told me that the DVD player is connected to the MMI via SCSI cable, which means it's a transport device.
I'm going to send off a quick email to the guys at mObridge. They will probably have a definitive answer as to the resolution of the digital signal in the MMI. I'll report back if I find out anything.
Furthermore, the processing, amplifiers and speakers in a factory system are of such limited quality that having a good DAC would probably be a wasted effort.
I agree with the above statement that it's likely the MMI system is down-sampling the audio as it comes in. While it might accept a 24/192 FLAC file, my guess is the DAC is ultimately running at 24/48. This is an educated guess based on the fact that in the aftermarket car audio market there are no DSP processors that operate at 24/192. The best car audio processor currently is the Helix DSP Pro, which processes at 24/96. It will accept 24/192, but it down-samples to 96kHz.
Most of the other car audio DSP processors operate at 48kHz. The Helix was the first to get to 96, so I am very highly doubtful that an OEM system in an Audi is doing better.
I will say that if you are interested in an actual answer from Audi, I think you might be able to get one. I sent an email to Audi of North America asking about the DVD player, and whether it's a "player" or a "transport." I wasn't expecting to ever get an answer, but they did indeed contact the engineers in Germany and told me that the DVD player is connected to the MMI via SCSI cable, which means it's a transport device.
I'm going to send off a quick email to the guys at mObridge. They will probably have a definitive answer as to the resolution of the digital signal in the MMI. I'll report back if I find out anything.
05-12-2016, 12:23 PM
#12
AudiWorld Senior Member
Got a response from mObridge.
They said that the legacy MMI systems (meaning anything before 2016 model year) are all running on 16 bit, 44.1k sample rate.
The new MOST 150 system which is in the 2016 model years and newer has a 96k sample rate, but they are not sure of the bit depth.
They said that the legacy MMI systems (meaning anything before 2016 model year) are all running on 16 bit, 44.1k sample rate.
The new MOST 150 system which is in the 2016 model years and newer has a 96k sample rate, but they are not sure of the bit depth.
05-13-2016, 05:10 AM
#13
AudiWorld Junior Member
Thread Starter
Thanks. Great comments.
I'm glad my higher res files work -- even if downsampled -- but would like to know the info.
Also, I don't know why that information can't be pulled to the screen, eg:
- file type (FLAC, MP3, etc)
- bit depth
- sample rate
I emailed Audi, waiting for information back.
Mike
I'm glad my higher res files work -- even if downsampled -- but would like to know the info.
Also, I don't know why that information can't be pulled to the screen, eg:
- file type (FLAC, MP3, etc)
- bit depth
- sample rate
I emailed Audi, waiting for information back.
Mike
05-13-2016, 06:20 PM
#14
AudiWorld Junior Member
Thread Starter
This wasn't very helpful...
My response...
I wanted to thank you for your patience while looking into your question pertaining to the DAC characteristics in the B&O system. Below will include the information that I was able to obtain. Below will include an overview obtained for the Bang & Olufsen Sound System for the New Audi A4.
o Bang & Olufsen 3D Sound System- which takes any music of the user to the third dimension by a careful analysis, built on psycho-acoustic knowledge.
o Dynamic Lines Design- enhances the grill transparency in or to reach even higher sound quality levels than the previous generation of the Audi B&O sound systems.
o 16 amplifier channels with a total output power of 755 Watts
o 19 Speakers
Since we are not the manufacture of the sound system, we don’t have information readily available for the DAC Characteristics. However, it was recommended to contact Bang & Olsen directly.
Below will include the website and contact information.
Contact us - Bang & Olufsen
o Bang & Olufsen 3D Sound System- which takes any music of the user to the third dimension by a careful analysis, built on psycho-acoustic knowledge.
o Dynamic Lines Design- enhances the grill transparency in or to reach even higher sound quality levels than the previous generation of the Audi B&O sound systems.
o 16 amplifier channels with a total output power of 755 Watts
o 19 Speakers
Since we are not the manufacture of the sound system, we don’t have information readily available for the DAC Characteristics. However, it was recommended to contact Bang & Olsen directly.
Below will include the website and contact information.
Contact us - Bang & Olufsen
My response...
This is not an adequate response.
1. You have just given me the publicly available information
2. B&O directed me to you and now you are directing me to them.
3. "Since we are not the manufacture of the sound system..." You also don't manufacture tires or spark plugs, but you know the specifications of those items, correct?
4. Understanding the DAC is like understanding the type of engine or other mainstream parts of a car.
Please dig further.
1. You have just given me the publicly available information
2. B&O directed me to you and now you are directing me to them.
3. "Since we are not the manufacture of the sound system..." You also don't manufacture tires or spark plugs, but you know the specifications of those items, correct?
4. Understanding the DAC is like understanding the type of engine or other mainstream parts of a car.
Please dig further.
05-26-2016, 10:48 AM
#15
AudiWorld Junior Member
Thread Starter
24bit/48kHz
From Audi (truncated, formatted for easier forum reading):
I want to thank you for your patience while looking into your request. I do apologize in regards to your dissatisfaction in the response. You are correct, we do need to know the technical data of our mechanical components which allows our vehicles to run. However, when it comes to the elected features such as the B&O, Homelink, etc, we rely on that particular manufacturer in providing in any technical specific questions. Below will include the information that we were able to obtain, as well as a link on FLAC (Free lossless audio codec). Please accept my written response.
The FLAC CODEC is handled by the multi-media chipset (NVIDIA).
The NVIDIA chipset is spec’d out to handle FLAC files that are encoded with a sampling rate of 8khz-48kHz and up to 8 separate channels (FLAC only supports 8 channels max).
We don’t have any information about the maximum resolution or bits depth, but the system can handle 24bit/48kHz FLAC files and the system was tested to work with a 24bit/48kHz specification.
The definitive guide to 24-bit FLAC | Society of Sound
The FLAC CODEC is handled by the multi-media chipset (NVIDIA).
The NVIDIA chipset is spec’d out to handle FLAC files that are encoded with a sampling rate of 8khz-48kHz and up to 8 separate channels (FLAC only supports 8 channels max).
We don’t have any information about the maximum resolution or bits depth, but the system can handle 24bit/48kHz FLAC files and the system was tested to work with a 24bit/48kHz specification.
The definitive guide to 24-bit FLAC | Society of Sound
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