pros-cons: open vs. enclosed trailer
12-09-2002, 11:53 AM
#11
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I vote enclosed
You can haul more crap around. Keep the crap you haul around out of the weather. A plain closed trailer attracts less unwanted attention than a bright yellow car with stickers and numbers on an open trailer. Also, I like racing in the rain, but I hate standing around in the rain.
Cons? Really it's price and storage. Oh, and that whole slippery slope thing with the options is true.
If I had a fleet of semi functioning vehicles, as John/TSR, I'd have one of each, 'cause sometimes it's just easier to throw a car on an open trailer and do a short trek with it.
We've been hauling this year with borrowed-from-Stasis enclosed 24' trailer (yes, with a weight distributing hitch). When we went out to nationals (Calif-to-Kansas and most of the way back), we figured the truck and loaded trailer was 17,000 lbs. I guess we need to start paying attention to those road signs about maximum vehicle weight. We're towing all this with a Chevy 2500HD. Diesel, definitely get a diesel.
If you've not read the popular series, Corey and Sharon's Adventures in Towing (TM, of course), please do a search. Lots of things to learn from there. :-/
Cons? Really it's price and storage. Oh, and that whole slippery slope thing with the options is true.
If I had a fleet of semi functioning vehicles, as John/TSR, I'd have one of each, 'cause sometimes it's just easier to throw a car on an open trailer and do a short trek with it.
We've been hauling this year with borrowed-from-Stasis enclosed 24' trailer (yes, with a weight distributing hitch). When we went out to nationals (Calif-to-Kansas and most of the way back), we figured the truck and loaded trailer was 17,000 lbs. I guess we need to start paying attention to those road signs about maximum vehicle weight. We're towing all this with a Chevy 2500HD. Diesel, definitely get a diesel.
If you've not read the popular series, Corey and Sharon's Adventures in Towing (TM, of course), please do a search. Lots of things to learn from there. :-/
12-09-2002, 02:35 PM
#12
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Who you calling a 'feature creep', Bozo ?????
A 26' with all that crap has got to be well over 5K empty. Muy gordo, senor. Does it have axles for over 12K ? If it's got 10K axles, walk away...it's a lightweight, masquerading as a big boy. Heat and air ? What...no tennis courts ??!?! Does it have 'living quarters' in the forward end ? Observation deck is popular with the circle track folks, but how much can you see from the paddock at most road courses ? Answer: not much. Lots of cushy options, but they won't make you any faster.
What do they consider a "racer package" ? Multiple tie downs fore and aft ? Horizontal and vertical E-trak, so you can move tire storage around as necessary ? Tie downs for nitrogen bottles ? Generator compartment ? Benches ? In-ground swimming pool ? That sounds like a lot of trailer, and probably more than you need. Try and balance your 'wants' with your 'needs'.
FYI - Beavertail - a slight drop angle to the rear section of the floor, beginning somewhere behind the axles. This allows vehicles with very low ground clearance to be rolled into the trailer without 'high-centering'. Ramp door is one of those rear doors that folds down to become the ramp for the trailer. You can have a beavertail trailer with a ramp door and ramp extensions (I do !). The longer the door and extentions and the longer the beavertail inside the trailer, the easier time you have loading really low crap inside. Also FYI - you can buy an open trailer with a beavertail (I have one of those, too).
If you're just getting started (and it sounds like you are), my advice is to find an open trailer - new or used - that meets your needs. Get a big enough one (18'-20') so you can build a tire rack on the front and add a BIG locking storage box to hold tools/parts/crud on the very front. Live with it for a while. If you decide you want an enclosed trailer, you can easily get rid of the open one. You probably won't have more than $2500 into the open trailer, even if you buy it new. The 'delta money' is better spent on cars, parts, entry fees, restaurants and bar bills. Storage space shouldn't be that big an issue at first, since your tow vehicle has lots of space. My rule of thumb: Tow vehicle and trailer can NEVER cost more than the race car. This should be an inviolate, universal rule but I see people show up at tracks with a $10K race car in/on a $60K rig. Hmmm...they've messed up their sybiotic balance - their kharmic dissonance - their etherial flatulence....they've messed up something - "Whoa baby...towing is just to get there, but it's not the destination".
I raced for years with an open trailer. Got snowed on, got rained on. So what ? I still occasionally run off to a race weekend with minimal crap and a car on an open trailer, just to simplify my life. Better mileage on the tow vehicle, and gets me back in touch with my racing roots as "rat-boy racer". I didn't buy an enclosed trailer until I had a race car with no roof/doors/windows, and I then went shopping for an enclosed with a well-sorted list of things I needed. I'm probably 1-2 years away from looking for something bigger than my current 24', but what will drive it isn't creature comforts but rather eliminating an aging trailer (mine is a '96 and does 30+K a year) and more capacity (i.e. 2 cars, either a stacker or a loooong goose-neck).
For the time being, I'll ignore Sharon's crack about my "fleet of semi functioning vehicles", posted above. Humfpf. 4 of the 5 race cars in the fleet are currently in running, and tech-legal racing condition. How's that Rabbit that you and Corey and Spandex-boy own, Sharon ??? I hope you can hear the razzberry from 3000 miles away !!!!!!!!
- Yet another short bit of advice from TSR Labs, where your reality is kinda strange, but not anywhere close to how strange OURS is....
What do they consider a "racer package" ? Multiple tie downs fore and aft ? Horizontal and vertical E-trak, so you can move tire storage around as necessary ? Tie downs for nitrogen bottles ? Generator compartment ? Benches ? In-ground swimming pool ? That sounds like a lot of trailer, and probably more than you need. Try and balance your 'wants' with your 'needs'.
FYI - Beavertail - a slight drop angle to the rear section of the floor, beginning somewhere behind the axles. This allows vehicles with very low ground clearance to be rolled into the trailer without 'high-centering'. Ramp door is one of those rear doors that folds down to become the ramp for the trailer. You can have a beavertail trailer with a ramp door and ramp extensions (I do !). The longer the door and extentions and the longer the beavertail inside the trailer, the easier time you have loading really low crap inside. Also FYI - you can buy an open trailer with a beavertail (I have one of those, too).
If you're just getting started (and it sounds like you are), my advice is to find an open trailer - new or used - that meets your needs. Get a big enough one (18'-20') so you can build a tire rack on the front and add a BIG locking storage box to hold tools/parts/crud on the very front. Live with it for a while. If you decide you want an enclosed trailer, you can easily get rid of the open one. You probably won't have more than $2500 into the open trailer, even if you buy it new. The 'delta money' is better spent on cars, parts, entry fees, restaurants and bar bills. Storage space shouldn't be that big an issue at first, since your tow vehicle has lots of space. My rule of thumb: Tow vehicle and trailer can NEVER cost more than the race car. This should be an inviolate, universal rule but I see people show up at tracks with a $10K race car in/on a $60K rig. Hmmm...they've messed up their sybiotic balance - their kharmic dissonance - their etherial flatulence....they've messed up something - "Whoa baby...towing is just to get there, but it's not the destination".
I raced for years with an open trailer. Got snowed on, got rained on. So what ? I still occasionally run off to a race weekend with minimal crap and a car on an open trailer, just to simplify my life. Better mileage on the tow vehicle, and gets me back in touch with my racing roots as "rat-boy racer". I didn't buy an enclosed trailer until I had a race car with no roof/doors/windows, and I then went shopping for an enclosed with a well-sorted list of things I needed. I'm probably 1-2 years away from looking for something bigger than my current 24', but what will drive it isn't creature comforts but rather eliminating an aging trailer (mine is a '96 and does 30+K a year) and more capacity (i.e. 2 cars, either a stacker or a loooong goose-neck).
For the time being, I'll ignore Sharon's crack about my "fleet of semi functioning vehicles", posted above. Humfpf. 4 of the 5 race cars in the fleet are currently in running, and tech-legal racing condition. How's that Rabbit that you and Corey and Spandex-boy own, Sharon ??? I hope you can hear the razzberry from 3000 miles away !!!!!!!!
- Yet another short bit of advice from TSR Labs, where your reality is kinda strange, but not anywhere close to how strange OURS is....
12-09-2002, 04:13 PM
#14
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Should I pick up crossword puzzles as a hobby instead?
Yes, it is apparent that I am just starting out. Thanks for the reality check.
Aluminium or otherwise? I've been keeping an eye for ads over the past few weeks, most car haulers listed have been either the enclosed racer package version or the I-beam/angle iron with oak deck monstrosities. Dry weight on these things is probably more than the car. Most seem to have dual 3500lb axles, the heavier the trailer, the less the payload capacity.
New Featherlite open trailers start at ~$4K with no options. Trailex's are even more. And they don't have beavertails.
Am I looking in the wrong places?
Aluminium or otherwise? I've been keeping an eye for ads over the past few weeks, most car haulers listed have been either the enclosed racer package version or the I-beam/angle iron with oak deck monstrosities. Dry weight on these things is probably more than the car. Most seem to have dual 3500lb axles, the heavier the trailer, the less the payload capacity.
New Featherlite open trailers start at ~$4K with no options. Trailex's are even more. And they don't have beavertails.
Am I looking in the wrong places?
12-09-2002, 04:58 PM
#16
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Aluminum....
To be honest with you, I haven't seen a single aluminum open trailer that I thought would last more than 2 or 3 years with frequent use. I checked 'em out quite a bit (yes, they do look flashy and nice), but the more I learned, the less I wanted one.
A friend we frequently caravan with, used one for the trip to Topeka last year, and I was less than impressed. It was one of the "nice" Featherlite open trailers, no beavertail, but rear pull-out ramps. He had his E46 M3 on there, and just the weight of the car made the decking of the trailer bow enough that you could see it. If you start loading up things like a tire rack and storage box, I don't think the welds would hold up very long! Not to mention if you tie down anywhere other than the 4 designated tow hooks, you bend the crap out of the rails.
They are definitely way overpriced.
If I were feeling rich, and spending $4k on an open trailer, I'd get one of those steel tilt-bed or kwik-load types. They are also a little overly expensive, but are nice if you have a really low car.
<a href="http://www.jim-glo.com/tilt.html">Jim-Glo tilt-bed</a>
<a href="http://www.kwikload.com/">Kwik-Load</a>
If you can find a decent used steel trailer, even with wood decking for $1500 or less, probably worth it just to get used to it. You won't lose a lot if you get rid of it in a couple years when you decide what you really want.
A friend we frequently caravan with, used one for the trip to Topeka last year, and I was less than impressed. It was one of the "nice" Featherlite open trailers, no beavertail, but rear pull-out ramps. He had his E46 M3 on there, and just the weight of the car made the decking of the trailer bow enough that you could see it. If you start loading up things like a tire rack and storage box, I don't think the welds would hold up very long! Not to mention if you tie down anywhere other than the 4 designated tow hooks, you bend the crap out of the rails.
They are definitely way overpriced.
If I were feeling rich, and spending $4k on an open trailer, I'd get one of those steel tilt-bed or kwik-load types. They are also a little overly expensive, but are nice if you have a really low car.
<a href="http://www.jim-glo.com/tilt.html">Jim-Glo tilt-bed</a>
<a href="http://www.kwikload.com/">Kwik-Load</a>
If you can find a decent used steel trailer, even with wood decking for $1500 or less, probably worth it just to get used to it. You won't lose a lot if you get rid of it in a couple years when you decide what you really want.
12-10-2002, 07:28 AM
#17
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Origami. Then start a 'class-action suit' about all the paper cuts.
Are you looking in the wrong places ? Yes.
Everyone here in the northeast seems to have "Econo" brand trailers, built by Dively. I bought mine years ago, but I know they're still around and have a big dealer network. There are other manufacturers with similar trailers, too.
Mine is an 18' open deck (no wood decking, just steel ramp sections). It has a beavertail, fairly long pull out loading ramps (not those stupid 'ladder-style' loading ramps), 7000 lb. Dexter axles...a really solid open trailer. It weighs around 1500 lbs. empty, so that leaves you 5500 lb. load capacity before you start to push it. It pulls straight and comfy, been from Canada to Florida to Maine to Missouri etc. with it, and never had a problem. They're still available new for around $1800, IIANAAP. 15's are a little cheaper.
Aluminum ? You're not worried about GVCRWRCVWRWetc., since you've already got a diesel tow vehicle. How much money will you spend to save 700 lbs. trailer weight ? If you ding it or want to mod it, you've got to find somebody with a TIG welder. With a steel trailer, you can fix it yourself with a cheap 'tombstone' stick welder or a MIG. Aluminum is great for beer cans and airplanes, but not my preferred material for car haulers.
Everyone here in the northeast seems to have "Econo" brand trailers, built by Dively. I bought mine years ago, but I know they're still around and have a big dealer network. There are other manufacturers with similar trailers, too.
Mine is an 18' open deck (no wood decking, just steel ramp sections). It has a beavertail, fairly long pull out loading ramps (not those stupid 'ladder-style' loading ramps), 7000 lb. Dexter axles...a really solid open trailer. It weighs around 1500 lbs. empty, so that leaves you 5500 lb. load capacity before you start to push it. It pulls straight and comfy, been from Canada to Florida to Maine to Missouri etc. with it, and never had a problem. They're still available new for around $1800, IIANAAP. 15's are a little cheaper.
Aluminum ? You're not worried about GVCRWRCVWRWetc., since you've already got a diesel tow vehicle. How much money will you spend to save 700 lbs. trailer weight ? If you ding it or want to mod it, you've got to find somebody with a TIG welder. With a steel trailer, you can fix it yourself with a cheap 'tombstone' stick welder or a MIG. Aluminum is great for beer cans and airplanes, but not my preferred material for car haulers.
12-10-2002, 09:04 AM
#18
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Hey....I have a car now..and just sold that BMW
I have paid my dues...I had to rebuilt TWO BMW engines...and am spending a bunch on the Miata...AND I own an open trailer..a tow vehicle...AND I don't wear spandex anymore....
"raspberry right back at ya"
"raspberry right back at ya"
12-12-2002, 06:03 AM
#19
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ramps or tilt
How bout them hydraulic tilt bed trailers versus a beavertail non-tilt flat bed? Which one is easier to load and unload a vehicle (operating or dysfunctional)?
With ramps, assuming a 20"-22" deck height, what minimum length ramps are needed for a low enough approach angle for low riders?
Thanks again.
With ramps, assuming a 20"-22" deck height, what minimum length ramps are needed for a low enough approach angle for low riders?
Thanks again.
