California bounces proposed 3.0 TDI fix...again
07-17-2016, 07:34 PM
#11
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Well, well. I came back from vacation to this happy news. On the up side, this continues to put the pressure on VW/Audi to settle with 3.0L owners in a fashion similar - if not identical - to the 2.0L owners. On the down side, we can look forward to months more of delay and obfuscation.
And I dearly hope that Judge Breyer holds Robert Giuffra in contempt of court or sanctions him for lack of candor to the tribunal for his deeply misleading statements on the record last month about the "simple software fix" for our cars. It beggars belief that Audi has known SINCE FEBRUARY that their plan is garbage and have refused to further negotiate in good faith toward a settlement with us 3.0L owners. Time for the Elizabeth Cabraser and crew to earn their fee. They should have a field day with the CARB letter. I expect nothing less.
Many of us have said repeatedly that there is nothing simple about this and it's nice to be vindicated in that.
And I dearly hope that Judge Breyer holds Robert Giuffra in contempt of court or sanctions him for lack of candor to the tribunal for his deeply misleading statements on the record last month about the "simple software fix" for our cars. It beggars belief that Audi has known SINCE FEBRUARY that their plan is garbage and have refused to further negotiate in good faith toward a settlement with us 3.0L owners. Time for the Elizabeth Cabraser and crew to earn their fee. They should have a field day with the CARB letter. I expect nothing less.
Many of us have said repeatedly that there is nothing simple about this and it's nice to be vindicated in that.
07-23-2016, 04:06 AM
#12
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From what I read today, Audi can fix the 3.0 by doubling the amount of urea used to clean the exhaust. Just seems they could find a way to put in a bigger urea tank in lieu of three trips a year to the dealer.
" Meanwhile, V-6 diesels can be brought within legal limits but require more than twice the amount of urea dosing (thereby necessitating additional tank refills)."
New York Supreme Court Complaint Blames Diesel Cheat on Audi ? News ? Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog
" Meanwhile, V-6 diesels can be brought within legal limits but require more than twice the amount of urea dosing (thereby necessitating additional tank refills)."
New York Supreme Court Complaint Blames Diesel Cheat on Audi ? News ? Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog
Last edited by gojones; 07-23-2016 at 04:10 AM.
07-23-2016, 09:14 AM
#14
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True...adding more urea will definitely reduce NOx, thus requiring more frequent refills within the service interval. Sadly, that's not the issue here. There's a chain reaction from that change.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
07-23-2016, 03:11 PM
#16
AudiWorld Super User
True...adding more urea will definitely reduce NOx, thus requiring more frequent refills within the service interval. Sadly, that's not the issue here. There's a chain reaction from that change.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
07-24-2016, 05:14 AM
#17
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True...adding more urea will definitely reduce NOx, thus requiring more frequent refills within the service interval. Sadly, that's not the issue here. There's a chain reaction from that change.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
The fragile adblue pump would have to work harder. There might be a need to increase the exhaust temperature to improve efficiency of the chemical reactions and the lifetime of the catalyst(s) in the SCR could be significantly reduced from these changes in order to meet emissions.
In other words, it's not that simple and they need to study or show that durability of the current hardware would not be significantly affected by changing any of the parameters controlling NOx treatment...thus the delay.
Last edited by diesel3; 07-24-2016 at 05:17 AM.
07-25-2016, 11:28 AM
#18
AudiWorld Member
And in addition, from reading the NY complaint it appears that the AdBlue fill MUST last for the 10,000 mile service interval without needing a refill in between, according to the regulations that the 3.0Ls were certified under. That means a bigger tank that there's no room for. It's an artificial problem but a problem nonetheless. I have no idea whether the regs give the parties the ability to negotiate compliance on that point.
07-25-2016, 11:40 AM
#19
I would even give up the proposed settlement compensation $ if they would do this. We bought ours with the intention of driving it for 200000 miles. Really don't want to have to buy a new vehicle and start over investing some of our own $ due to the scandal.
07-25-2016, 11:45 AM
#20
AudiWorld Member
Yeah, I'd expect that too. Some of the reports suggested part of the hold up was testing how the new software expected lifespan - Audi should take the risk that it will harm it, but I suppose it's reasonable for them to want some idea of how much it will increase the failure rate.