Serious braking issue in wet conditions
03-19-2015, 07:27 PM
#21
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I took it out last night to get the above youtube video. I tried what you were stating and the car stops without issue. So much so that at points the tires started screeching. Then it started to rain. I was able to replicate the issue 3 times after some highway driving. Once after going through a large puddle. The issue occurred and ABS also kicked in. Second time was entering the on ramp to return back to my area, occured and no abs. Third time (video) the issue occurred cleanly and no abs activated as well. This is what I've experienced before. During the video, the 'thud' is the release and reactivate of the breaks, and the gforce sensor in my camera actually picks up the change. The mount muffles the cam mic, its even louder in the car.
Did you brake slowly, or abruptly hit the break pedal. If you do it abruptly, the Braking Assist takes over will try to almost lock the wheels up instantly.
03-20-2015, 06:27 AM
#22
Went for a drive tonight and got it to replicate in the wet conditions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxk5...ature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxk5...ature=youtu.be
03-20-2015, 11:46 AM
#23
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That doesn't look normal at all. Are you sure it's the brakes? If it's always doing it at the same speed, it could be a rough downshift from the transmission.
03-20-2015, 01:12 PM
#24
AudiWorld Super User
And I didn't even notice anything odd in the video. Of course without knowing pedal application or seeing a lot of other stuff...I just see someone slowing down a car.
Since skids and brake fails can kill, I'd suggest contacting Transport Canada directly and on the record, and contacting Audi-Canada as well. And asking for a thorough brake system test. Sometimes, a manufacturer has techs who will examine a car at a dealership, directly, if the dealer doesn't have the appropriate specialist.
There are a total of 11 complaints in the NHTSA database for the 2014 Q5. None involve "skidding" similar to yours.
Since skids and brake fails can kill, I'd suggest contacting Transport Canada directly and on the record, and contacting Audi-Canada as well. And asking for a thorough brake system test. Sometimes, a manufacturer has techs who will examine a car at a dealership, directly, if the dealer doesn't have the appropriate specialist.
There are a total of 11 complaints in the NHTSA database for the 2014 Q5. None involve "skidding" similar to yours.
03-20-2015, 03:58 PM
#25
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Well, as i was leaving the office at noon, it happened again. This time in sunny, dry conditions. I drove straight to Audi.
The service manager climbed in with me and I was able to replicate it as soon as i pulled out of the dealership, however the ABS kicked in, but in clear dry conditions. He says he hasn't heard that noise before.
I've been booked in for a loaner swap next week so they can take it for 24 hours and see why it feels like when it occurs do they can diagnose it...
The service manager climbed in with me and I was able to replicate it as soon as i pulled out of the dealership, however the ABS kicked in, but in clear dry conditions. He says he hasn't heard that noise before.
I've been booked in for a loaner swap next week so they can take it for 24 hours and see why it feels like when it occurs do they can diagnose it...
03-21-2015, 07:22 AM
#26
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I have generated an addition video to provide with Audi when the vehicle goes in. At some points I am feeling the that thud brake release/engage almost causes the ABS to activate.
03-26-2015, 07:26 AM
#28
Good luck with it. I hope the dealer can get to the bottom of the issue. steve
03-28-2015, 05:52 AM
#29
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So I am still driving my dealer loaner vehicle...
After the service manager took the vehicle home, on the way to work he said he did experience exactly what I've described/recorded with the Q. Also, the ABS was kicking in, which he described as 'too soon'. This brake thud is causing the vehicle to go into a condition where the computer feels it needs to react and activating ABS. So the good news I that I'm not a crazy person.
Upon inspection of the brakes, there is uneven brake wear. The outside pads are at 6mm (which was stated to me at my last Audi Care service 40k at Christmas and was advised that i will probably need a brake job around the 70-80k mark. The INSIDE pads are at 8mm, and don't move freely. The conclusion is the inside pads have ceased to the caliper with a mixture of brake dust residue/salt/gunk. He believes that this is causing the outside pad to have some play, binding to the disc and causing the brakes to jolt. Apparently uneven brake wear is not common, so i'm not sure how that was missed on the last inspection. Its not as if the pad rebuilds 2mm.
First solution offered: "we recommend that you replace your front pads and discs, and service the rears as there's not more lubricants on them." Immediate i refused, and indicated that I don't feel I should have to replace brakes components that are not passed 50% wear, on a new vehicle barely past the halfway warranty period. I said i would contact Audi Canada to request something. The service manager said he had only ever experienced this once before, on a vehicle with 90k and a bunch of aftermarket parts, which was causing the issue. They would also contact audi regarding my case file. They will keep the vehicle on the hoist until Audi responds as it is deemed unsafe in current condition.
However, I am still not confident this is the root of the problem. Why is my car the only one with ceased pads? Can we be sure the caliper is working correctly? Why did my problem originate a year ago at 9k? Was there instantaneous build up and ceasing from new? Im definitely not willing the dish out $1100 on new parts, to find out its not the root of the issue, and then start having the change other components until its resolved.
In the event that Audi doesn't help, I have discussed with the service manager and concluded that as a start, the pads and calipers should be clean out since they are still okay, and when confident the caliper is working correctly, we continue to road test to see if the problem is still occurring. This seems like a much more logical solution than just having me start changing wear parts until its indicated its a warranty component causing my root issue.
If your reading this SM, I really do appreciate the through testing/inspection you have done, and hopefully Audi HQ steps up and solves the issue. I hope this isn't going to be a drawn out headache.
And the saga continues...
After the service manager took the vehicle home, on the way to work he said he did experience exactly what I've described/recorded with the Q. Also, the ABS was kicking in, which he described as 'too soon'. This brake thud is causing the vehicle to go into a condition where the computer feels it needs to react and activating ABS. So the good news I that I'm not a crazy person.
Upon inspection of the brakes, there is uneven brake wear. The outside pads are at 6mm (which was stated to me at my last Audi Care service 40k at Christmas and was advised that i will probably need a brake job around the 70-80k mark. The INSIDE pads are at 8mm, and don't move freely. The conclusion is the inside pads have ceased to the caliper with a mixture of brake dust residue/salt/gunk. He believes that this is causing the outside pad to have some play, binding to the disc and causing the brakes to jolt. Apparently uneven brake wear is not common, so i'm not sure how that was missed on the last inspection. Its not as if the pad rebuilds 2mm.
First solution offered: "we recommend that you replace your front pads and discs, and service the rears as there's not more lubricants on them." Immediate i refused, and indicated that I don't feel I should have to replace brakes components that are not passed 50% wear, on a new vehicle barely past the halfway warranty period. I said i would contact Audi Canada to request something. The service manager said he had only ever experienced this once before, on a vehicle with 90k and a bunch of aftermarket parts, which was causing the issue. They would also contact audi regarding my case file. They will keep the vehicle on the hoist until Audi responds as it is deemed unsafe in current condition.
However, I am still not confident this is the root of the problem. Why is my car the only one with ceased pads? Can we be sure the caliper is working correctly? Why did my problem originate a year ago at 9k? Was there instantaneous build up and ceasing from new? Im definitely not willing the dish out $1100 on new parts, to find out its not the root of the issue, and then start having the change other components until its resolved.
In the event that Audi doesn't help, I have discussed with the service manager and concluded that as a start, the pads and calipers should be clean out since they are still okay, and when confident the caliper is working correctly, we continue to road test to see if the problem is still occurring. This seems like a much more logical solution than just having me start changing wear parts until its indicated its a warranty component causing my root issue.
If your reading this SM, I really do appreciate the through testing/inspection you have done, and hopefully Audi HQ steps up and solves the issue. I hope this isn't going to be a drawn out headache.
And the saga continues...
03-28-2015, 10:45 AM
#30
AudiWorld Super User
Brake parts can seize for many reasons. Usually corrosion or dirt, and that can be a manufacturing defect, or pistons/cylinders rusting from moisture in the brake fluid (old problem, the metals are better these days) or something getting bent ever so slightly during a brake job, or from impact damage. Which is also why we're taught not to brake when going over potholes or RR tracks.
The question is, can Audi prove that your current brake failure is caused by something outside of their warranty, as opposed to bad parts or bad installation the last time around?
If they can't find a smoking gun that points to an outside problem, hopefully they'll just step up and do the right thing. If not, well, I imagine you've got options that may take a little longer but may get you more than just reimbursed.
Corporate probably needs a few days to speak to Germany about why brakes might seize, and a couple days more to decide what to do about it.
The question is, can Audi prove that your current brake failure is caused by something outside of their warranty, as opposed to bad parts or bad installation the last time around?
If they can't find a smoking gun that points to an outside problem, hopefully they'll just step up and do the right thing. If not, well, I imagine you've got options that may take a little longer but may get you more than just reimbursed.
Corporate probably needs a few days to speak to Germany about why brakes might seize, and a couple days more to decide what to do about it.