Snow - a little dissapointed
02-23-2014, 12:11 PM
#51
AudiWorld Super User
No, I don't work for them. I wouldn't call myself a huge fan, but I do respect a quality product from a reputable company, and that's what I've found them to be.
When folks go on the internet and post confused ramblings slamming a product that they can't even really identify...I think that's a disservice to everyone and quite often an intentional slam by someone being paid by a competitor. (And that's not just my opinion, that's already been confirmed by the NYS AG's office, among others, who found some 25% of online "reviews" to be totally bogus slams paid for by competitors.)
Maybe you bought their summer performance tires, comparable to Audi's "sport" tires, and you just didn't know those tires will burn up quickly. That's not the tire company's fault, if you don't know what you bought. Most companies try to benefit from confused customers.
Michelins are bad? Sure, and "water" can kill you.
When folks go on the internet and post confused ramblings slamming a product that they can't even really identify...I think that's a disservice to everyone and quite often an intentional slam by someone being paid by a competitor. (And that's not just my opinion, that's already been confirmed by the NYS AG's office, among others, who found some 25% of online "reviews" to be totally bogus slams paid for by competitors.)
Maybe you bought their summer performance tires, comparable to Audi's "sport" tires, and you just didn't know those tires will burn up quickly. That's not the tire company's fault, if you don't know what you bought. Most companies try to benefit from confused customers.
Michelins are bad? Sure, and "water" can kill you.
02-23-2014, 01:20 PM
#52
AudiWorld Member
No, I don't work for them. I wouldn't call myself a huge fan, but I do respect a quality product from a reputable company, and that's what I've found them to be.
When folks go on the internet and post confused ramblings slamming a product that they can't even really identify...I think that's a disservice to everyone and quite often an intentional slam by someone being paid by a competitor. (And that's not just my opinion, that's already been confirmed by the NYS AG's office, among others, who found some 25% of online "reviews" to be totally bogus slams paid for by competitors.)
Maybe you bought their summer performance tires, comparable to Audi's "sport" tires, and you just didn't know those tires will burn up quickly. That's not the tire company's fault, if you don't know what you bought. Most companies try to benefit from confused customers.
Michelins are bad? Sure, and "water" can kill you.
When folks go on the internet and post confused ramblings slamming a product that they can't even really identify...I think that's a disservice to everyone and quite often an intentional slam by someone being paid by a competitor. (And that's not just my opinion, that's already been confirmed by the NYS AG's office, among others, who found some 25% of online "reviews" to be totally bogus slams paid for by competitors.)
Maybe you bought their summer performance tires, comparable to Audi's "sport" tires, and you just didn't know those tires will burn up quickly. That's not the tire company's fault, if you don't know what you bought. Most companies try to benefit from confused customers.
Michelins are bad? Sure, and "water" can kill you.
02-23-2014, 03:05 PM
#53
AudiWorld Super User
One thing about wear ratings: they're meaningful only within a brand as there are no universally accepted standard. In other words, a 220 rating for a Michelin might be a 100 or a 400 in another brand.
02-27-2014, 07:52 AM
#54
AudiWorld Super User
Have you watched
admittedly six years old now, and comparing a Passat's AWD system to the Subaru, but a very interesting and objective comparison. They conclude that Subaru's symmetrical drive system (balanced left/right weight distribution and shaft lengths) is the key to getting power, even if there's only one wheel with traction, while the others require at least one axle pair to have traction.
Passat AWD different from Quattro? Quattro symmetrical?
admittedly six years old now, and comparing a Passat's AWD system to the Subaru, but a very interesting and objective comparison. They conclude that Subaru's symmetrical drive system (balanced left/right weight distribution and shaft lengths) is the key to getting power, even if there's only one wheel with traction, while the others require at least one axle pair to have traction.
Passat AWD different from Quattro? Quattro symmetrical?
02-27-2014, 12:17 PM
#55
AudiWorld Member
Ack! This thread is going the wrong direction.
Rule #1 when talking about tires that are good or bad: What model? Talking about brands says almost nothing. If you don't know what model tire you have on your car, you don't care enough about your rubber to have much say when comparing tires.
And as for the "roller" comparison of AWD vehicles, from what I understand, pretty much all of them are rigged tests with pulled fuses or ESP type systems on/off when they shouldn't be, purposeful driver error, etc. There are one or two unbiased roller vids out there but be careful when using that test to justify one system being better than the other.
Now my impression of my SQ5 in snow. I have Pirelli Scorpion Winter tires in 255/50/19 and find the snow traction to be phenomenal. I drive on snow into the mountains regularly for skiing and can confidently drive 2 to 3 times faster than the average car on the same road. A week ago when I went up, I was on snow for 90 miles continuous and the pass was treacherous. No problems. AWD is important for snow traction but the tires are more important.
Time to bump up the snow thread...
Rule #1 when talking about tires that are good or bad: What model? Talking about brands says almost nothing. If you don't know what model tire you have on your car, you don't care enough about your rubber to have much say when comparing tires.
And as for the "roller" comparison of AWD vehicles, from what I understand, pretty much all of them are rigged tests with pulled fuses or ESP type systems on/off when they shouldn't be, purposeful driver error, etc. There are one or two unbiased roller vids out there but be careful when using that test to justify one system being better than the other.
Now my impression of my SQ5 in snow. I have Pirelli Scorpion Winter tires in 255/50/19 and find the snow traction to be phenomenal. I drive on snow into the mountains regularly for skiing and can confidently drive 2 to 3 times faster than the average car on the same road. A week ago when I went up, I was on snow for 90 miles continuous and the pass was treacherous. No problems. AWD is important for snow traction but the tires are more important.
Time to bump up the snow thread...
Last edited by Transfer; 02-27-2014 at 12:21 PM.
02-27-2014, 02:44 PM
#56
Ok, to stop this nonsense. I'm comparing two Q5, 2012 and 21013. Both with 19" wheel with the factory tire.
2012 had Micheline. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but it came with the all season Latitude Tour HP.
2013 has all season contis Cross Contact LX sport.
I will take contis over michelines any day, at least compering the once that I had on both Q's.
I had 3 different sets of michelines on my passat, but it was a different wheel and a different car so let's leave this one out.
2012 had Micheline. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but it came with the all season Latitude Tour HP.
2013 has all season contis Cross Contact LX sport.
I will take contis over michelines any day, at least compering the once that I had on both Q's.
I had 3 different sets of michelines on my passat, but it was a different wheel and a different car so let's leave this one out.
03-01-2014, 11:35 AM
#57
Audiworld Junior Member
Bob, I've owned a few AWD cars and a bunch of different tires. '05 G35X with Toyo Observe G-02's was awful compared to my '11 A4 with Dunlop Wintersport 3D's. However, I disliked those tires so much I got rid of them and picked up some Primacy Alpin PA3's which were much better. All in all, that setup was nowhere near as good as my '13 Q5 with Latitude X-Ice 2's.
Comparing the G35X to the A4, traction control of the G35X was awful and it worked better with the damn thing off. The Wintersports I had on the A4 were great unless it was icy, traction control was a little less invasive than the Q5's, so it would let you have a little more fun with it. Car was much better with Primacy Alpin PA3's.
Comparing tires I'd say the Toyo G02's and both sets of Michelin's are similar, the wintersport 3D's are significantly below both.
In a bad storm, I'd take the Q5 with X-Ice's over any other car I've driven or owned.
I'm usually quick to take off winters and almost always get caught with all seasons in a late March storm. All vehicles feel incredibly pathetic in snow when you're used to running dedicated winters. Comparing the vehicles, the Q5 without winters was the best by a long shot. Mine came with the Goodyear Eagle LS2's.
My two cents.
Comparing the G35X to the A4, traction control of the G35X was awful and it worked better with the damn thing off. The Wintersports I had on the A4 were great unless it was icy, traction control was a little less invasive than the Q5's, so it would let you have a little more fun with it. Car was much better with Primacy Alpin PA3's.
Comparing tires I'd say the Toyo G02's and both sets of Michelin's are similar, the wintersport 3D's are significantly below both.
In a bad storm, I'd take the Q5 with X-Ice's over any other car I've driven or owned.
I'm usually quick to take off winters and almost always get caught with all seasons in a late March storm. All vehicles feel incredibly pathetic in snow when you're used to running dedicated winters. Comparing the vehicles, the Q5 without winters was the best by a long shot. Mine came with the Goodyear Eagle LS2's.
My two cents.
03-01-2014, 12:21 PM
#58
AudiWorld Super User
tomas, a fast look at tirerack.com reveals that both of those tires are manufactured in two or three different plants, and that the Audi-OEM tires are not the same as the retail product sold in the US. The differences are slight, but they are real. Among them, the Continentals do get better marks for snow handling, but the Michelins score higher for dry traction, less road noise, and greater comfort. All typical tradeoffs. And the US-made Michelins are counted as "green" low rolling resistance tires, while their Audi-OEM version are not. Oddly enough tirerack also shows a significant width difference in one of them. So, better? Worse? For snow driving apparently you've got the better tire, between these two (actually four) models. Does that make one brand or the other better? Of course not, it just means one particular model is better than another, for one particular purpose.
I'd still be loathe to use either one as a winter snow tire.
I'd still be loathe to use either one as a winter snow tire.
03-01-2014, 12:55 PM
#59
Redd, funny you said that because first thing I noticed when I got this Q5 was that the contis were quieter then Michelines. I dont care what you or others like. If you like Michelines more, enjoy them, im giving here one experience with both. Before I got to drive contis I swore by Michelines.
03-02-2014, 03:42 AM
#60
AudiWorld Super User
Bob, I've owned a few AWD cars and a bunch of different tires. '05 G35X with Toyo Observe G-02's was awful compared to my '11 A4 with Dunlop Wintersport 3D's. However, I disliked those tires so much I got rid of them and picked up some Primacy Alpin PA3's which were much better. All in all, that setup was nowhere near as good as my '13 Q5 with Latitude X-Ice 2's.
Comparing the G35X to the A4, traction control of the G35X was awful and it worked better with the damn thing off. The Wintersports I had on the A4 were great unless it was icy, traction control was a little less invasive than the Q5's, so it would let you have a little more fun with it. Car was much better with Primacy Alpin PA3's.
Comparing tires I'd say the Toyo G02's and both sets of Michelin's are similar, the wintersport 3D's are significantly below both.
In a bad storm, I'd take the Q5 with X-Ice's over any other car I've driven or owned.
I'm usually quick to take off winters and almost always get caught with all seasons in a late March storm. All vehicles feel incredibly pathetic in snow when you're used to running dedicated winters. Comparing the vehicles, the Q5 without winters was the best by a long shot. Mine came with the Goodyear Eagle LS2's.
My two cents.
Comparing the G35X to the A4, traction control of the G35X was awful and it worked better with the damn thing off. The Wintersports I had on the A4 were great unless it was icy, traction control was a little less invasive than the Q5's, so it would let you have a little more fun with it. Car was much better with Primacy Alpin PA3's.
Comparing tires I'd say the Toyo G02's and both sets of Michelin's are similar, the wintersport 3D's are significantly below both.
In a bad storm, I'd take the Q5 with X-Ice's over any other car I've driven or owned.
I'm usually quick to take off winters and almost always get caught with all seasons in a late March storm. All vehicles feel incredibly pathetic in snow when you're used to running dedicated winters. Comparing the vehicles, the Q5 without winters was the best by a long shot. Mine came with the Goodyear Eagle LS2's.
My two cents.
The latest Dunlop WinterSport 4Ds have additional siping and it makes a huge difference. I love them.
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