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q7-cold start noise

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Old 02-11-2014, 10:23 PM   #1
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Default q7-cold start noise

Hi there

hope you guys are well.

Having a nightmare with an Audi Dealer (London area) over the last few months, still having on going issues. Even after most recent repairs (door trims at bottom of door loose and not sure why they had to be painted and re fitted, re pads changed, inter cooler not switching off, cold start noise, Audi dealer stealing items from my vehicle), I have not really been given a written report on the outcome.

More insulting is that they are telling me that they wont sell me another car and question my trust in them. In addition, the 2 free services that were part of the promotion on purchase still have not been attached to my vehicle.

The question I have for you guys, is that when starting the Q7 from cold start or after several hours (3 Diesel Tdi 3.0 V6) as soon as the vehicle fires up, there is a noise that lasts about one second or 2, like a rattle/ticking noise. As if its like oil is delayed reaching the top of the engine. Its been with the Audi dealer for a week/2 weeks and they tell me its normal, even though I question oil levels and prove to them that it needed topping up after the alleged 145 point check.

Are there any common faults with this model or characteristic? Vehicle has only done 23k miles and is a 2010 model.

Your help will be much appreciated as don't know where to turn to.


Many thanks in advance

Regards
Nick

Last edited by q7nick; 02-11-2014 at 11:00 PM.
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Old 02-12-2014, 04:49 AM   #2
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I guess this is the replacement car after the first one you bought had a noise which was never traced/cured?

Does lightning strike twice?

The 3.0 V6 tdi is a pretty reliable engine. Some of the earlier ones - BUG code, had issues with the flaps in the inlet manifold failing and also there were some oil starvation issues affecting the crankshaft bearings, but I think these were all cured by the 2010 model you have.

I suspect you may be in a difficult position because of the history you have with the dealer and if you have now got suspicions they have removed items from your car without your permission, that cannot help.

I think you need an independent assessment of the engine - maybe a local VW/Audi specialist rather than a main dealer. That engine has been produced in many thousands and is fitted in everything from Skoda's to Porche's, so it is well known and any specialist should be familiar with it.
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:55 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edd W View Post
I guess this is the replacement car after the first one you bought had a noise which was never traced/cured?

Does lightning strike twice?

The 3.0 V6 tdi is a pretty reliable engine. Some of the earlier ones - BUG code, had issues with the flaps in the inlet manifold failing and also there were some oil starvation issues affecting the crankshaft bearings, but I think these were all cured by the 2010 model you have.

I suspect you may be in a difficult position because of the history you have with the dealer and if you have now got suspicions they have removed items from your car without your permission, that cannot help.

I think you need an independent assessment of the engine - maybe a local VW/Audi specialist rather than a main dealer. That engine has been produced in many thousands and is fitted in everything from Skoda's to Porche's, so it is well known and any specialist should be familiar with it.
Hi there

Thank you for the reply

Yes this is the second one and relationship with dealer is totally lost as comparing the vehicles from the first one, on cold start there was never this noise.

Its purely on start up for the initial second. How damaging is this and will it get worse if its the crankshaft bearings?

Audi making this very difficult and really cant believe my luck.

The items stolen from my car:

My own tyre compressor
few cleaning products from Auto Glym and Maguires


They gave me a cheque and some items but the trust is hard to be restored. Plus that at the same time, I have questioned the oil levels and took three readings and took pictures. All suggesting it needed topping up after an alleged 145 check.

More insulting I have the dealer telling me that they wont sell me another car!!

Not all my doing.

Any help and advise will be much appreciated if there any common faults with a 2010 model.

Regards
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Old 02-12-2014, 01:40 PM   #4
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I think that any oil related issues were resolved a long time before your car was manufactured.

Overall the 3.0 v6 tdi is a very sound engine and I don't know of any real problems with it, especially the later ones.

I think you should try to get the option of a good independent mechanic.
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-13-2014, 07:33 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edd W View Post
I think that any oil related issues were resolved a long time before your car was manufactured.

Overall the 3.0 v6 tdi is a very sound engine and I don't know of any real problems with it, especially the later ones.

I think you should try to get the option of a good independent mechanic.
Very concerned. and hate feeling like this.

Audi ignoring me as usual and seem to adds to my frustration. Hate chasing all the time.

The noise is not all the time. Like today on cold start, did not do it as vehicle was left for 2 days with out being fired up. Seem to get the noise more when vehicle used daily.

Vehicle only down 23k miles, so timing chain?

Your help will be much appreciated
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:38 AM   #6
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The noise could be the water pump bearings - they did have a lot of failures in Q5's built in late 2009 and 2010 but I think it was a fairly sudden loss of coolant caused by bearing/seal failures.

If your car makes a noise when first started especially after a couple of days not used, then that is what I would suspect. Is it loosing any coolant?
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:11 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edd W View Post
The noise could be the water pump bearings - they did have a lot of failures in Q5's built in late 2009 and 2010 but I think it was a fairly sudden loss of coolant caused by bearing/seal failures.

If your car makes a noise when first started especially after a couple of days not used, then that is what I would suspect. Is it loosing any coolant?
Hi there

When the car is not used for a few days, no noise. If used daily, then get the the noise. No sign of coolant issue.. starter motor?
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Old 02-14-2014, 02:28 PM   #8
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I think you need to see someone with experience with that engine - any good VW/Audi specialist should know what they are looking for.
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-17-2014, 10:57 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edd W View Post
I think you need to see someone with experience with that engine - any good VW/Audi specialist should know what they are looking for.
Hi there

just an update.

took the q7 to another main dealer today. They started another 3 q7's and all of them did not do the same noise.

i then left mine for 30 mins and turned it on in front of the service manager and their head technician. First thing they said was it sounds like the start of a chain problem.


I now have to take the vehicle back for them to do cold start check on the chain and tensioners.

what and how can this be done?

also, relunctant to use the vehicle as will this cause damage? Or because it's been reported back I December would of this cause damage? Cam?

Nightmare of an experience. Worth giving it back and running? Having to take several days off work now to sort out. Comparing this to mercedes I would of had the vehicle picked up and a courtesy car given with in the day.
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Old 02-17-2014, 12:52 PM   #10
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I would think it is safe to drive and apart from a minute possibility that the chain could break or jump, it will not do any harm to the camshafts or any other components.

I am surprised that the chain tensioner is failing at such a low mileage.
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-17-2014, 07:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edd W View Post
I would think it is safe to drive and apart from a minute possibility that the chain could break or jump, it will not do any harm to the camshafts or any other components.

I am surprised that the chain tensioner is failing at such a low mileage.
Can't believe my luck.

So cheesed of is an understatement.

Best to take money and run?
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Old 02-17-2014, 11:25 PM   #12
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Have to agree with Edd, your car is safe to drive...

On my second Q (2007, 2011 both S-Lines), both have a slight sound when starting under very cold conditions. Mine have not been Diesel, but to me the sound I hear sounds like a Diesel engine startup versus Gas engine, for maybe couple of seconds, I have always simply thought it was just an Audi characteristic. If something major you would know for sure....

At 23K is it still under Warranty ? If so just drive it, let Audi take care of it if and when something real breaks...

Just my two cents..
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Old 02-18-2014, 09:11 AM   #13
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I really cannot chip in with any more, you have to make your decision and go with it. If you like the car stick with it, if not, try to recoup your expenditure.....
__________________
Q7 4.2Tdi S-Line 2008 - another V8 diesel!
A8 4.2Tdi, 06, Grey/Grey - my new toy - how can a diesel be this fast? SOLD 21/06/2013
2010 A4 2.0tdi 6 spd SE Executive avant - dark blue & Vanilla - Wife's new one.
VW Touareg 06 30k 6spd 2.5Tdi - Wifey's new one, A4 was not big enough!
A6 2.7t 01my 6spd Avant 51k miles - Sold Dec 2011 - Gone to Banbury
A4 2.0FSi SE 03.8 22k miles - Wifey's new one - the golf was not luxurious enough. Sold 30/08/08 - gone to Heathrow.
Golf Tdi 03.08 130pd, 6spd, 19k miles - Sold 8th November 2006 - gone to Coventry!
A6 2.8q 98.11 115K miles - sold 20th Feb 2006 - gone to Kidderminster.
100 2.8q 92.1 147k miles - Sold 6th July 2004 - its new home is Edinburgh
A4 1.6 97.8 99k miles - Sold 12th Feb 03
VW Golf Gti 86 22k miles 2.0 Oettinger 190bhp, lowered, lightened and quick and sold 23/03/08. Gone to Coventry.
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Old 02-18-2014, 12:38 PM   #14
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This is a normal occurrence. Every car manufacture out there has engines that are noisy on startup and they state its totally normal, cars go 200k miles without any internal problems making the noise. Its just the seconds of no oil pressure and that the chain tensioners are pumping up at cold start. What oil are you using? Theres special 5w30 synthetic oil special for these TDI engines. Stop worrying about it, every VW Audi 1.8T, 2.8, 2.7, 3.2, 4.2, W8 makes this noise on cold start, if it has timing chains its going to make noise the first few moments of operation. Some manufactures use ratchet type tensioners that tend to not have this issue.

Noise doesnt mean damage or a problem. Example, Many American and Japanese engines have short piston skirts for better emissions but makes an ugly knocking on cold start for a few minutes. Engines go 200+k miles and never any cylinder wear.
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Last edited by Prospeeder; 02-18-2014 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 02-19-2014, 10:33 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prospeeder View Post
This is a normal occurrence. Every car manufacture out there has engines that are noisy on startup and they state its totally normal, cars go 200k miles without any internal problems making the noise. Its just the seconds of no oil pressure and that the chain tensioners are pumping up at cold start. What oil are you using? Theres special 5w30 synthetic oil special for these TDI engines. Stop worrying about it, every VW Audi 1.8T, 2.8, 2.7, 3.2, 4.2, W8 makes this noise on cold start, if it has timing chains its going to make noise the first few moments of operation. Some manufactures use ratchet type tensioners that tend to not have this issue.

Noise doesnt mean damage or a problem. Example, Many American and Japanese engines have short piston skirts for better emissions but makes an ugly knocking on cold start for a few minutes. Engines go 200+k miles and never any cylinder wear.
Hi there

Had confirmation from another main dealer chain and tensioners need changing. Chain had major slack.

Now this opens questions what the selling main dealer had checked for a week and a half.


Thinking of giving it back. Lost total trust of the initial dealer and whatever they did or said they did.

Regards
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Old 02-19-2014, 11:22 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by q7nick View Post
Hi there

Had confirmation from another main dealer chain and tensioners need changing. Chain had major slack.

Now this opens questions what the selling main dealer had checked for a week and a half.


Thinking of giving it back. Lost total trust of the initial dealer and whatever they did or said they did.

Regards
Soo they tore the entire thing apart and say chains have slack. I sure find this hard to believe with 23k miles. But hey there are factory defect and sorry you were the rare 1% that got the defect but its showing its face early and you should just have it repaired and move on and enjoy the car. The car is under warranty right? I also recommend finding another dealer/shop to service your car just for your own sake or happiness.
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Old 02-19-2014, 05:14 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prospeeder View Post
Soo they tore the entire thing apart and say chains have slack. I sure find this hard to believe with 23k miles. But hey there are factory defect and sorry you were the rare 1% that got the defect but its showing its face early and you should just have it repaired and move on and enjoy the car. The car is under warranty right? I also recommend finding another dealer/shop to service your car just for your own sake or happiness.
Yep car is under warranty but only for another 8months.

Lost total trust and with the initial dealer steeling items and saying they did stuff when obviously they did not, just has zero trust in the car. If they source another, then will there be cause of concern on the chain again? Or get my fixed and have new chain. Only issue little reminders of surface scratches initial dealer did and just reminds me every time what they did to us
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Old 02-23-2014, 02:49 AM   #18
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This issue is problem with my Q7 2011 3.0L. Based on you discussion and input I will have it examined by my dealer. I have noticed the problem started since the car was about 3 months old. It occurs most of the time during cold starts in the morning. It seems like for a fraction of second oil is not getting to the internal mechanisms of the engine. I am very concerned about weare and tare to engine components.

I have reported thi issue to my dealership but they do not seem to be very concerned about it. I have even reported it in their questionnaire of satisfaction typically provided to all customers, which is used to rate every dealership as well as the car you purchased.

I am thinking of putting in writing to the owner of the dealership and copying the main factory. I am afraid that as we all know "grinding sounds" do not go away by themselves or get any better.
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:39 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Jorge Holguin View Post
This issue is problem with my Q7 2011 3.0L. Based on you discussion and input I will have it examined by my dealer. I have noticed the problem started since the car was about 3 months old. It occurs most of the time during cold starts in the morning. It seems like for a fraction of second oil is not getting to the internal mechanisms of the engine. I am very concerned about weare and tare to engine components.

I have reported thi issue to my dealership but they do not seem to be very concerned about it. I have even reported it in their questionnaire of satisfaction typically provided to all customers, which is used to rate every dealership as well as the car you purchased.

I am thinking of putting in writing to the owner of the dealership and copying the main factory. I am afraid that as we all know "grinding sounds" do not go away by themselves or get any better.
Hi there

Sorry to hear that you may have the same issues. Where about are you based? In the United Kingdom?

Go to another main dealer and get them to hear the noise and do further tests. Like I did and they confirmed that there was slack in the timing chain. Very rare on a vehicle with only 23k miles so they have put it down to a failed part.

Mine is still at the dealers and wont be repaired until the end of the week. Every time I speak to someone at Audi, I seem to upset them for some reason. They are also looking at sourcing another vehicle of which I have requested the vehicle from another Audi Franchise Group. I just feel that if I am going to pay all that money, then I would prefer to pay it to a company that will be able to assist in times of need. Like this. Instead of lies and trying to put it down to characteristics. They also stole item from my vehicle and now Audi seem to accept that this is ok.

So take it an get a second opinion but mine was confirmed as having slack in the chain. Tensioners and chain due to be changed next week.

We allowed to name and shame dealers?

Regards
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:39 AM
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