BillK

This is a bit of a rant, but those of you with DBW issues, particularly those with 6 speeds need to face it - you're dinosaurs.

Fact is, as time progresses, we will <b>drive</b> our cars less and less and <b>pilot</b> them more and more. This has been coming since the first fly by wire systems were pioneered in aircraft by Airbus. The throttles and control sticks in Airbus aircraft are not only merely electronic sensors, but the aircraft's programming will actually veto certain control input if it feels it is in error. Scary, but true.

The same is occurring with cars. The days of having actual control over the vehicle - direct linkage between the gas pedal and the throttle, direct manipulation of the transmission's gears - are decidedly numbered.

One may say that the automotive Pandora's Box was first opened with ABS; others may go further back and say power steering and power brakes were the first steps down the road we're on today. But fact is, we've come to accept these electronic aids in modern vehicles, and the situation will only (depending on your point of view) get better or worse.

To address our topic of late of the S4's DBW behavior, here's a quote from the brochure for the 2004 Acura TL:

<i>Instead of using a mechanical means to transmit the accelerator pedal's action to the induction system's throttle, the new TL uses a sophisticated electronic throttle control system. Various sensors in the engine and chassis supply data to the system's computer, enabling it to apply appropriate input to the throttle body. So when smooth driving is important - such as in congested traffic or on slippery pavement - the throttle response is more gradual. When instant acceleration is desired, the throttle will respond with more immediacy. Control is enhanced and driver fatigue is lessened.</i>

Note - <b>it</b>, not <b>you</b>, gives the appropriate input to the throttle body. Your inputs are merely "suggestions" given to the car's computer.

Think that's just Acura? Road &amp; Track tested the new BMW 530i this month and said:

<i>Then there was the shifting, and here there were clearly too many filters and thinking machines between driver and car. BMW uses a clutch dampener to limit engagement speed, and fits squishy rubber in the shifter to almost totally isolate the driver from the transmission. Furthermore, the rheostat that thinks it is the throttle varied in its responsiveness, so even a moderately smooth shift seemed a gift.</i>

This from "The Ultimate Driving Machine."

So where does this leave us, the driving enthusiasts? In the past, I'm afraid. Smooth shifts? Not an issue when the closest we'll get to manual transmissions in the future are paddle shift mechanisms like SMG or DSG. Control of the brakes and throttle are already gone. Heel and toe braking? Many cars on the market today already cut off the throttle when the brake is pressed, as <b>no one</b> would want to apply brake and throttle simultaneously. Steering? How about the 530i's new "Active Steering" that requires "little more than a quarter turn" to bang the front wheels off their stops when turning the wheel when parked.

I suspect we can jump up and down and moan all we want to, but having actual control over your vehicle will soon seem as anachronistic as pilots having full control over an aircraft. One of the motor monthlies has a nice article this month about systems that will soon be coming to your car, including sensors that will detect when you are getting too close to the car in front and will <b>automatically</b> apply the brakes (much like Lexus' cruise control system but active all the time) as well as sensors that will detect a car in an adjacent lane and <b>will not allow</b> you to steer too close to it. The futurists' dream of self-driving cars will never occur, but rather control will gradually be taken away. As I alluded to we will no longer drive our cars but simply pilot them to their destinations.

So, sorry to get off on quite such a tangent, but I suspect the DBW behavior of the S4 is merely the tip of an iceberg I suspect and fear we're all going to have to learn to live with...

JDBlueAudiS4

certain parts of the DBW system are messed up. We are not the only car experiencing them. I feel its just the power ratio that makes it more apparent. And about half of the drivers having the DBW probablems have been driving for less then 5-10 years. You would think people like that would adapt very fast, well in a inconsistent behavior from a car, its hard to learn.

MachtigAvant (v3.0)

Something I was thinking about was this:

We've all noticed that we can slam the gas in neutral with the clutch completely engaged and nothing happens. But when we disengage the clutch and select a gear and THEN hit the gas, we get revs pretty quickly.

I'm wondering, if the computer has maps set, that when we select a gear at a certain speed it knows:
a) which gear we've selected, and
b) what the RPMs need to be to rev-match properly.

Kind of like a semi-manual, semi-SMG tranny. I've just noticed that the revs seems to zip right up to where the the engagement point is for the revs and gear to match. I know, it's probably a far-fetched idea, but no more-so then Audi taking away control from the driver! :-D Just some food for thought...

since84

Thanks for posting those excerpts. We are not alone.

HarnessedLunacy

so the solution is to get an automatic transmission?

npteske

...the car should still be an ABSOLUTE pleasure to drive. Isn't that why we drive expensive fast cars in the first place?

BillK

The S4 issues are annoying, but for most they don't rob the car of all joy.

Framkly. I can't think of a single "expensive fast" car that doesn't have issues that prevent it from being an <b>absolute</b> pleasure to drive, from the questionable "let's block the instruments with the steering wheel" dash of the BMW M3 to the maraca-like rattle-prone interiors of the Porsche Boxster, Mazda RX-8 and Honda S2000 to the absolutely useless headlights on the Volvo S60R.

Yes, the driving experience is paramount, but the prevalence of paddle shifters in Ferraris tells you something about the long-term prospects for that shift lever and far left pedal...

©odeWhore

Among general aviation folks, airline pilots are being called "drivers" more and more precisely because of increased computerization of airline cockpits (with Airbus being the extreme), replacing stick-and-rudder piloting skill with electronics.

I'd also like to offer a counterpoint to what you wrote - all of these systems require enormous amount of R&amp;D (and capital), which is why they are being introduced in high-end cars. Once the kinks are worked out on early adopters (us), the improved systems make it into mass market. ABS, and, to a lesser extent, stability control systems are the perfect examples of this. I'm hoping future incarnations of DBW and SMG/DSG would be far more "transparent" to the driver.

Miwa

Heck, we wont even get decent DSG programming in the US.

Likely all sorts of reasons, 1 being that we like long warranties in the US, unlike elsewhere, so they gotta plan for the most abusive use they can think of.

sayemthree

can tell the throttle what to do and they can tell the transmission what gear the computer thinks you should be in - At least with a manual the computer cant over ride shifting (yet).