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Can't decide between Audi or BMW, well there's more than that.

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Old 08-27-2014, 09:37 AM   #1
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Default Can't decide between Audi or BMW, well there's more than that.

Hi all, I am new to this forum and definitely need some of your valuable advice and opinions. I really appreciate your attention.

So at this moment, I am trying to decide between 2014 Audi S4, BMW 335i or 435i GranCoupe.

My original intention was to get Audi S4 and call it a day. I appreciate its beauty and uniqueness on the road. I think there are just way too many BMWs 320/328s out there these days. Also the new F30 steering doesn't feel as good as the E90.

However... there's a little problem. My family has a E90 328i we want to get rid of. It has some minor mechanical problems here and there. We found a BMW dealership that offers the best trade-in price. The catch is.. we have to "trade" instead of sell directly. The dealership is pretty much forcing us to shop at their place.

Now I don't know what to do, it basically means it will cost more for me to own an Audi. I have to bare extra cost.

The price range of the vehicles I am looking at is around $55k, but I see some 335i can go as long as 51k (w/o M-sport) The m-sport package is another question I have. I think the m-sport look is a pretty significant upgrade. However, m-sport package doesn't offer any extra performance as far as I hear from others.

Any opinion? Stick with Audi or go for F30's?

Thank you
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Old 08-27-2014, 09:49 AM   #2
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Dan, welcome aboard. If you are in the USA, you may want to see what CARMAX will buy the car for. Their offerings are typically pretty strong.

Don't get caught up in the idea of the BMW dealer giving you significantly more...they're are a lot of discounts on BMWs to be had and that's where it's coming from.
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Old 08-27-2014, 09:56 AM   #3
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Default one thng to consider BMW service, maintence is free

(well you paid for it) for fours years including, wear items like brakes ect. Audi gives you only one free oil change. Audi service prices are super expensive. example front brakes on s4 $1150! on lesser car A4 $850!
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Old 08-27-2014, 10:39 AM   #4
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(well you paid for it) for fours years including, wear items like brakes ect. Audi gives you only one free oil change. Audi service prices are super expensive. example front brakes on s4 $1150! on lesser car A4 $850!
Do you mean brake pads for $1150?!
How could that be? Even the ceramic pads only cost at most $100 for a set.

Audi engine oil last 12,000 miles like that of BMW right?
Does Audi have extended warranty up to 6 years?

Our old BMW never cost us a penny for 6 years of ownership (put aside the brakes and tires) In some sense, we did paid for it but I like the idea of having the ease of mind as long as we make the monthly payment on time.
However, after the warranty it was a nightmare.
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Old 08-27-2014, 10:53 AM   #5
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Default those prices were quoted to me by dealer in Hartford CT

I found them crazy. But my point is if you are on the fence factor in 4 years of free service INCLUDING wear items. Check how high audi service prices are you will be very upset. No prices on brakes were for s4 & a4 both do not use ceramic pads.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:05 AM   #6
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I ordered new rotors, ceramic pads, and some brake tools for $650. I already had bought a vagcom cable (needed for rear parking brake when changing the pads) for $300, but I got a discount through EBAY so it was $260. Just be careful if you buy one from a third party to make sure it is a genuine Ross-Tech cable.

So it depends on how mechanically inclined you are, but it can be done yourself.

I did have a 328xi and it wasn't a bad car, but I didn't like the interior...it was much too plain and the ride sucked.

As far as oil for the car...Audi recommends change at 5K and then every 10K after that.

I did get an extended warranty on my car...it was for an extra 2 years/25K miles. So my car is covered for 6yrs/75K miles. I did buy overseas (I'm military) and planned on driving the car quite a bit. I have about a 25 mile round trip commute everyday. I have over 38K miles on my 2012 that I have had just over 2 years.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:09 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by uberwgn View Post
Dan, welcome aboard. If you are in the USA, you may want to see what CARMAX will buy the car for. Their offerings are typically pretty strong.

Don't get caught up in the idea of the BMW dealer giving you significantly more...they're are a lot of discounts on BMWs to be had and that's where it's coming from.
Thanks for the suggestion. I will definitely go check out Carmax.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:21 AM   #8
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I think now it comes down to whether the performance justifies the extra cost.

Apparently, the Audi costs more to buy and to own. I read many reviews online and saw plenty youtube videos. It seems they all reached different conclusions. There are BMW fanboys constantly exaggerating how 335i smoke Audi. On the other hand, many reviews said BMW has gone soft in recent years. I don't know about 335i, I drove a 328i F30 loaner car couple months ago. I think it wasn't very exciting. It felt too "electronics." I test drove a S4 at the dealer. I couldn't do much with it cause he was sitting next to me. My impression was the dynamic mode of steering was pretty good. It felt very firm.

Some critics say BMW F30 is very floaty for cornering; the body roll is bad. I couldn't test that on the S4. So what do you guys say?
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:28 AM   #9
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I am way more happy with my S4 than I was with my 328xi. I think it is worth it and would do it all over again...put a Roc-Euro intake on and listen to the supercharger. The only downside is I find it hard to drive my car at anything less than 80 mph...good think I am in Europe (Italy). I have had some good driving on the Autobaun too.


I did consider a 335 with x-drive, but the extra cost of the x-drive wasn't worth it to me...that and I couldn't stand the dealer here. Also, the maintenance wasn't covered in europe, so I would have had to pay for routine maintenance anyway. My 328xi was AWD, but I can tell you that I do prefer quattro over what I had in my 328.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:57 AM   #10
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If you are thinking of leasing, you will most likely get a better lease deal on the BMW. Although if you do lease an S4 and don't go over your mileage, you car will probably have equity at the end of the lease which you can capture by trading your car in (doesn't have to be on an Audi/VW)prior to the lease end. If you are buying, financially there will not be a difference. Sometimes, Audi has $1000 Conquest money that they will give you if you currently own or trade in a BMW/MB/Lexus. Not sure if that program is currently being offered. I had an 04 S4, 07 335i, 10 S4, 14 S4 all of which I leased. Overall operating cost for the BMW was less, EXCEPT, I ended up with $3k buying my leased S4and reselling it. Got $6k by trading my 2010 in on a 2014. Was able to get out of my lease in 10 month for $1k and bought a used 2011. (It did make sense for me due to health issues.)

All that being said,the current 335i is a minor evolutionary change from my E92 335i. Its your money and you can spend it as you desire. Both are good cars, IMHO, I was willing to spend more for a car that I felt was significantly better than the BMW. BTW, Car and Driver recently did comparison between a B8.5 S5 and a 435i. Both are pretty much 2 door versions of the S4 and 335i. The S5 blew away the 435i in most categories. Decisive victory for the Audi. I was a guy that always had to have the latest and greatest new thing in cars. When my lease on my 335i was up, I leased an new 2010 with less options on it just to keep the monthly payments the same as I had had on the BMW. I was not sorry. When lease was up on the 10, I could not find anything that I liked better, so I leased a new 2014 S4. When I decided I needed to get out of the lease on the 2014, I realised that there was nothing out there that I would be happy driving, so I found a 2011 in great shape that I purchased. BTW, I recently had a good look at a 335i Grand coupe. It is not pretty!

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Old 08-28-2014, 07:07 AM   #11
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Survey of Most Disliked Car Brands. Eight listed.

The Most Disliked Car Brands

BMW owners are frustrated with too many repairs.
Volkswagen ranks higher than Audi with no resaons given why Audi not popular despite soaring sales.

You may want to consider the quality of your nearby dealership(s) when making your decision. A good dealer is great. A bad dealer is horrible.

Best
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:50 AM   #12
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That article you linked has a horrible headline. That's not really a scale of most disliked car brands, it's a customer satisfaction survey. People hate xxx or hate yyy, but they typically don't own that car. Shame on AOL.
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:02 PM   #13
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I would stay away from BMW! I used to have a 08 335xi and the problems started in the second year of ownership. The car spent 1/3 of the time at the dealership replacing the same parts over and over again. I was lucky because the car was a lease and I didn't have to worry anything after the lease expired. Tried to get the lease ended early but I have to pay CAD$6000 if returning the car early. I talked to three different dealers to waive the charge and will buy a new BMW from them but none of them even BMW Canada could help me out.
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:05 PM   #14
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Long time BMW fan faced with the same decision. Drove the 335i M sport, a car I thought I'd love...the handling wasn't very sporty, the steering felt disconnected, and the car just wasn't fun to drive. Tried the S4 and it fit like a glove - preferred the looks, the interior, and most importantly...the way it goes! Just a more fun car if you ask me.

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Old 08-31-2014, 05:45 PM   #15
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I was a long time BMW loyalist (10+ years, 4 of my BMWs were M cars). My current 2013 S4 is my first Audi and I am really enjoying my ride. BMW to me has changed their business model - which, by the way, is absolutely fine. It's their company and their choice to make. I may be disappointed but It's not my company. Here's my take.....

On maintenance BMW comes with 4 years of maintenance (includes brakes), on Audi only the 1st service is covered. BUT you can extend the maintenance to 50k miles for a fee (none negotiable). As for warranty both companies offer similar coverage (if I remember correctly) and as with any manufacturer, you can extend the warranty. There are lots of options but keep in mind that the extended warranty is not offered by Audi but rather a 3rd party.

As for the S4... both the newer BMWs and Audis, steering input is rather vague (though the S4 is better). Personally I enjoy the S4 over the current BMW offerings. I think Audi has done a terrific job of minimizing the understeer with their sports diff (a must have if you decide to go with the S4). I'm an avid track/autocrosser, to that end my old '99 M3 is more fun. The S4 with the quattro system delivers amazing mechanical grip but it is a heavy car. It's nearly impossible to get sideways in the s4. I really appreciate the square setup on the s4, ability to rotate the tires help me make the tires last longer.

On power, both the 335 and the S4 are rather similar (I think the s4 is under rated). From an engineering point of view, supercharging creates more consistent pressure on the drivertrain's seals and thus it is my opinion that the s4 should be more durable and hopefully more reliable. Thus far I've experienced no issues with my s4 (I've racked up 43,xxx in the 1.5 years I've owned it - I've owned my s4 since new). The acceleration on the s4 is something one should experience. Amazing torque! Terrific handling capabilities!!

The BMW will probably have better mpg. I know many here will say that if mpg's important to you, you shouldn't be looking at a s4. My s4 is my daily driver, I average 25-26mpg (mostly highway). My financial situation doesn't allow me to purchase a car for daily driving and another for other activities. I still have my '99 M3, its' not worth much to sell. The S4 to me, does everything I need it to do. It's pretty decent at the track too. I don't think you'll be disappointed in the S4. It is more expensive to go with the S4 but keep in mind....despite BMW's discounting their cars by a fairly large percentages from their MSRP pricing, Audi's sales are still ever increasing. That, to me speaks volumes about Audi products vs. their BMW competition.

Good luck. Both are great cars....
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Old 09-01-2014, 05:41 AM   #16
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We have a '14 Z4 35is and a '14 S4, a pretty even comparison of the power trains you are considering.
Most of the above comments hold true… steering is slightly vague, handling is very good, etc. Our cars have 19's with OE tires. Both have very good initial turn in, but quattro with sport diff better handles the transition back to throttle mid corner and exit. Advantage: AUDI.

Both engines are quite torquey, and have very good throttle response at low and mid-range rpm. Gearing is well-spaced. The Audi builds RPM urgently but smoothly, the BMW really screams once the boost builds up. The Audi gets better gas mileage, perhaps because its more fun to feel the revs climb in the Beemer. EVEN.

The BMW could use a throatier exhaust, its too quiet. The Audi sounds more like a performance car… AWE exhaust next for the S4, very few choices for the Z4. AUDI.

Finally, BMW insists on using heavy run-flat tires with stiff sidewalls. While they've improved handling, the ride and tire noise are still punishing. On my last BMW product, (Mini Cooper S), we greatly improved acceleration, ride, handling and interior noise the minute we dumped the run-flats. AUDI.

I considered Boxster and C7 'Vette but i wanted a folding hardtop and more torque than the P car. Bottom line, I like the Z4 a lot. and, I love the S4. S4 replaced my C63 (a great hooligan car with tons of torque), S4 handles much better with better gas mileage too.

If you buy the S4, I don't think you will ever second-guess your decision.
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Old 09-02-2014, 03:57 AM   #17
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I looked at the 335ix, the 435ix, and the S4. here are my thoughts

Engines:
My opinions on the motors are that they are neither here nor there in terms of which is better. I'd probably give a very slight edge to the BMW, only becuase the turbos are a bit more efficient, and you don't have to pull the damn supercharger off to change the thermostat like you do on the S4. Both motors have proven reliable, though the *35 motors have been known in the past to eat fuel pumps.

Transmissions:
If stick transmissions are your thing, then the ONLY way to get AWD and stick on a BMW is in the 335ix. That mattered to me, it may not to you. If you plan on getting an automatic, know that the DSG's in the Audi's have not been great. The mechatronic units have been known to crap out, and plan on spending $400-$600 every 35k miles or so to have the DSG-specific maintenance performed at the dealer. I don't even know that Audi will contiune to support this tranmission beyond the B8 generation, as the MQB chassis DSG is supported by the larger VW group, and all other 'S' models use the tiptronic 8 speeds. If you must have an automatic, I'd stray away from Audi, but that's me.

Exterior:
Styling is subjective, but when it comes to exterior detailing, Audi has nothing on the BMW. The level of detail that goes as far as the BMW logo in the reflectors of the taillights is where the money went on this car, and the M-Sport package looks the race car far more than the "S" exterior treatments, which can pass muster for a poverty spec A4. At the end of the day, I went with the inconspicuous nature of the S4, but there's no denying the appeal of the BMW's exterior design. Please note that I am no fan of Audi's current "industrial air handler" style front grille, and honestly prefer the M-Sport's open mesh racer style front scoops.

Interior:
No argument here. the Audi interior is superior in every way that I can measure. There's no fake 'Bauhaus" style design elements made of cheap plastic, there's no flimsy afterthought of a infotainment screen tacked onto the dash, there's no cheapness, where the BMW has all of that in spades. The back seat of the F-3X models is bigger than it was, but still feels smaller than the Audi. the 435is would have been a big seller for me with the hatch, but the lack of a stick was a deal breaker.

Value:
Look, both cars are German, so you're goning to get butt-humped paying for options that come for free on a Corolla. The total of the options that you're going to pay for that come for free in that Corolla is probably more than the cost of the Corolla. If you can control yourself, you can get more bang for the buck out of the Audi, but don't forget to account for the $1000 Audi hits you for in service, which the BMW does not. I couldn't care less about the run-flat tires, either. They've come a long way and the newest ones ride no worse and cost no more than conventional tires, anymore.

Cost:
Leasing the S4 is just stupid. you need to buy to get a deal on these cars. Audi has artifically low residuals (50%-55%)on these cars and they won't budge. The dealers are harder to deal with on these cars becuase they know you want it. you don't go looking at an S4 unless you want an S4. Still, if you can control yoursef, there's no reason you can't get 8%-10% off MSRP with a little strong arming.
As a counterpoint, buying a BMW is just stupid. The residuals on these cars is nonsensically high, (I've seen as high as 63%), and the dealers are willing to haggle on price. 10% off MSRP is pretty easy. You can probably lease a 335is for around the same price as leasing a Premium Plus A4 with the sporty bits, but when it comes time to turn the lease in, you won't want to pay $35k+ for that car, trust me.

At the end of the day, I went with the S4. There are a number of dealers around me that I can play off of each other for best service deals, and I have a good relationship with my dealer, from whom I've bought 5 Audi's in the past.
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Old 09-02-2014, 05:48 AM   #18
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I was a long time BMW loyalist (10+ years, 4 of my BMWs were M cars). My current 2013 S4 is my first Audi and I am really enjoying my ride. BMW to me has changed their business model - which, by the way, is absolutely fine. It's their company and their choice to make. I may be disappointed but It's not my company. Here's my take.....

On maintenance BMW comes with 4 years of maintenance (includes brakes), on Audi only the 1st service is covered. BUT you can extend the maintenance to 50k miles for a fee (none negotiable). As for warranty both companies offer similar coverage (if I remember correctly) and as with any manufacturer, you can extend the warranty. There are lots of options but keep in mind that the extended warranty is not offered by Audi but rather a 3rd party.

As for the S4... both the newer BMWs and Audis, steering input is rather vague (though the S4 is better). Personally I enjoy the S4 over the current BMW offerings. I think Audi has done a terrific job of minimizing the understeer with their sports diff (a must have if you decide to go with the S4). I'm an avid track/autocrosser, to that end my old '99 M3 is more fun. The S4 with the quattro system delivers amazing mechanical grip but it is a heavy car. It's nearly impossible to get sideways in the s4. I really appreciate the square setup on the s4, ability to rotate the tires help me make the tires last longer.

On power, both the 335 and the S4 are rather similar (I think the s4 is under rated). From an engineering point of view, supercharging creates more consistent pressure on the drivertrain's seals and thus it is my opinion that the s4 should be more durable and hopefully more reliable. Thus far I've experienced no issues with my s4 (I've racked up 43,xxx in the 1.5 years I've owned it - I've owned my s4 since new). The acceleration on the s4 is something one should experience. Amazing torque! Terrific handling capabilities!!

The BMW will probably have better mpg. I know many here will say that if mpg's important to you, you shouldn't be looking at a s4. My s4 is my daily driver, I average 25-26mpg (mostly highway). My financial situation doesn't allow me to purchase a car for daily driving and another for other activities. I still have my '99 M3, its' not worth much to sell. The S4 to me, does everything I need it to do. It's pretty decent at the track too. I don't think you'll be disappointed in the S4. It is more expensive to go with the S4 but keep in mind....despite BMW's discounting their cars by a fairly large percentages from their MSRP pricing, Audi's sales are still ever increasing. That, to me speaks volumes about Audi products vs. their BMW competition.

Good luck. Both are great cars....
interested to know
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Old 09-02-2014, 05:59 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by PhilNotHill View Post
Survey of Most Disliked Car Brands. Eight listed.

The Most Disliked Car Brands

BMW owners are frustrated with too many repairs.
Volkswagen ranks higher than Audi with no resaons given why Audi not popular despite soaring sales.

You may want to consider the quality of your nearby dealership(s) when making your decision. A good dealer is great. A bad dealer is horrible.

Best
AOL is not credible to me.
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Old 09-02-2014, 07:45 AM   #20
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AOL is not credible to me.
It is now wonder brand does not rate higher.
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Old 09-02-2014, 07:45 AM
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