Correct way to change oil on A4
08-10-2013, 07:01 PM
#1
AudiWorld Senior Member
Thread Starter
Correct way to change oil on A4
So.. my car is getting the stage 2 oil fix right now.. and the dealership says my oil pan drain plug is leaking because it's cross threaded from me changing my oil from the bottom for 7 changes.
theyre charging me $375 for a new one.
service guy said the dealership only changes it with an oil extractor... not the bottom drain.
my car has never leaked a drop of oil.. i park on white concrete driveway, never seen oil on it.. or any on the engine under shield..
any ideas?
theyre charging me $375 for a new one.
service guy said the dealership only changes it with an oil extractor... not the bottom drain.
my car has never leaked a drop of oil.. i park on white concrete driveway, never seen oil on it.. or any on the engine under shield..
any ideas?
08-10-2013, 11:53 PM
#3
I am not sure you cross threaded the plug. That usually causes a rather large leak, not dripping, but covering the bottom of the engine and transmission.
Because synthetic oil sneaks out of everything the pan is machined with a class 2A thread. This thread is a very tight fit and only holds tightest when first installed. The plug has a microencapsulated sealant that fills in the spaces. It is consumed when first installed.
When you removed the plug you should have discarded it and used a new one. This will not always seal the sump completely.
I have been using extraction for decades. I first learned how on boats. Some are impossible to drain with the motor in the boat. The difference in what you remove is a scant few ounces, and since about a quart remains in the engine it won't affect the concentration of "new" oil.
With the A4 oil filter now on top it is silly to crawl around on the ground to change oil.
I use a Mity-Vac and the specified oil filter tool. Warm the engine to operating temperature. Remove the filler cap, remove the dipstick cover and push vacuum tube into engine until you feel it hit bottom. Pump the handle to start oil flow. Remove and replace oil filter. When extraction is done, refill with new oil to VW 502.00 spec. Replace cap and cover. Run engine and inspect for leaks. 15 minutes, your done. Take extractor to parts store and dump used oil in their tank and leave the spent filter.
Because synthetic oil sneaks out of everything the pan is machined with a class 2A thread. This thread is a very tight fit and only holds tightest when first installed. The plug has a microencapsulated sealant that fills in the spaces. It is consumed when first installed.
When you removed the plug you should have discarded it and used a new one. This will not always seal the sump completely.
I have been using extraction for decades. I first learned how on boats. Some are impossible to drain with the motor in the boat. The difference in what you remove is a scant few ounces, and since about a quart remains in the engine it won't affect the concentration of "new" oil.
With the A4 oil filter now on top it is silly to crawl around on the ground to change oil.
I use a Mity-Vac and the specified oil filter tool. Warm the engine to operating temperature. Remove the filler cap, remove the dipstick cover and push vacuum tube into engine until you feel it hit bottom. Pump the handle to start oil flow. Remove and replace oil filter. When extraction is done, refill with new oil to VW 502.00 spec. Replace cap and cover. Run engine and inspect for leaks. 15 minutes, your done. Take extractor to parts store and dump used oil in their tank and leave the spent filter.
08-11-2013, 04:31 AM
#4
Never Follows
I am not sure you cross threaded the plug. That usually causes a rather large leak, not dripping, but covering the bottom of the engine and transmission.
Because synthetic oil sneaks out of everything the pan is machined with a class 2A thread. This thread is a very tight fit and only holds tightest when first installed. The plug has a microencapsulated sealant that fills in the spaces. It is consumed when first installed.
When you removed the plug you should have discarded it and used a new one. This will not always seal the sump completely.
I have been using extraction for decades. I first learned how on boats. Some are impossible to drain with the motor in the boat. The difference in what you remove is a scant few ounces, and since about a quart remains in the engine it won't affect the concentration of "new" oil.
With the A4 oil filter now on top it is silly to crawl around on the ground to change oil.
I use a Mity-Vac and the specified oil filter tool. Warm the engine to operating temperature. Remove the filler cap, remove the dipstick cover and push vacuum tube into engine until you feel it hit bottom. Pump the handle to start oil flow. Remove and replace oil filter. When extraction is done, refill with new oil to VW 502.00 spec. Replace cap and cover. Run engine and inspect for leaks. 15 minutes, your done. Take extractor to parts store and dump used oil in their tank and leave the spent filter.
Because synthetic oil sneaks out of everything the pan is machined with a class 2A thread. This thread is a very tight fit and only holds tightest when first installed. The plug has a microencapsulated sealant that fills in the spaces. It is consumed when first installed.
When you removed the plug you should have discarded it and used a new one. This will not always seal the sump completely.
I have been using extraction for decades. I first learned how on boats. Some are impossible to drain with the motor in the boat. The difference in what you remove is a scant few ounces, and since about a quart remains in the engine it won't affect the concentration of "new" oil.
With the A4 oil filter now on top it is silly to crawl around on the ground to change oil.
I use a Mity-Vac and the specified oil filter tool. Warm the engine to operating temperature. Remove the filler cap, remove the dipstick cover and push vacuum tube into engine until you feel it hit bottom. Pump the handle to start oil flow. Remove and replace oil filter. When extraction is done, refill with new oil to VW 502.00 spec. Replace cap and cover. Run engine and inspect for leaks. 15 minutes, your done. Take extractor to parts store and dump used oil in their tank and leave the spent filter.
People have been draining oil from their plug from years. Nothing wrong with doing it that way. Your dealer is just trying to find excuses to overcharge you.
08-11-2013, 12:33 PM
#5
AudiWorld Super User
I use a Pella extractor. Works very well. Some people are afraid that an extractor leaves too much old oil in the pan, but I don't think it leaves any more than draining the oil by the plug.
In fact, last week I changed my oil and filter, and refilled the crankcase with five quarts of Castrol Professional 5W-40. After running the engine for awhile and giving the oil a half an hour to drain back into the pan, I noticed on the dipstick and the MMI that I needed to add about 1/4 of a quart more oil. That made me realize what a good job the extractor does in sucking out the old oil.
In addtion, you don't get dirty using an extractor.
.
.
In fact, last week I changed my oil and filter, and refilled the crankcase with five quarts of Castrol Professional 5W-40. After running the engine for awhile and giving the oil a half an hour to drain back into the pan, I noticed on the dipstick and the MMI that I needed to add about 1/4 of a quart more oil. That made me realize what a good job the extractor does in sucking out the old oil.
In addtion, you don't get dirty using an extractor.
.
.
08-11-2013, 02:14 PM
#6
Some people (even dealer techs) cannot understand that extraction is the same as using gravity to change oil. They take the plug out. When they do that the class 2A fit is lost. When you purchase a new plug, it will not be a 2A thread. Now you are strictly relying on the sealing ring to hold back the tide. The lack of ability of a sealing ring to prevent drips is what brought out the Green shaking fingers in the first place.
The new plug from Audi is a one time use device. Once installed the sealant is released. When you remove it, there is no sealant, and the class 2A thread has partially deformed the threads on the screw. The deformation becomes less and less every time, and that leads to a new oil pan. I am not selling plugs here, just reporting on the engineering.
I am sure a lot of people have done their oil change the 1973 way, and being lucky their bung hole does not leak.
There are also a lot of people that are having free oil pans paid for by Audi because they realize that dealer mechanics have removed the first plug and destroyed the fit. I would suggest if the dealer wants to sell you a new oil pan, you contact Audi and let them know the cat is out of the bag concerning the "cross threaded oil plug" and ask them to pony up.
08-11-2013, 03:48 PM
#7
Never Follows
We need to bring you into the new millennium. The Greens chased all the auto makers waving their finger about all the hazardous used oil dripping out of oil pans. In response the industry started doing business differently. The maker of the drain pan machines a class 2A thread. Back in the day they used class 2B. The 2A fit is very tight, and intended for a single use. When the pan arrives at the engine assembly area the plug with a microencapsulated sealant is already installed and it is super tight. It is a one time use bolt. VW intends for it never to be removed. Extraction is the published method for changing oil.
Some people (even dealer techs) cannot understand that extraction is the same as using gravity to change oil. They take the plug out. When they do that the class 2A fit is lost. When you purchase a new plug, it will not be a 2A thread. Now you are strictly relying on the sealing ring to hold back the tide. The lack of ability of a sealing ring to prevent drips is what brought out the Green shaking fingers in the first place.
The new plug from Audi is a one time use device. Once installed the sealant is released. When you remove it, there is no sealant, and the class 2A thread has partially deformed the threads on the screw. The deformation becomes less and less every time, and that leads to a new oil pan. I am not selling plugs here, just reporting on the engineering.
I am sure a lot of people have done their oil change the 1973 way, and being lucky their bung hole does not leak.
There are also a lot of people that are having free oil pans paid for by Audi because they realize that dealer mechanics have removed the first plug and destroyed the fit. I would suggest if the dealer wants to sell you a new oil pan, you contact Audi and let them know the cat is out of the bag concerning the "cross threaded oil plug" and ask them to pony up.
Some people (even dealer techs) cannot understand that extraction is the same as using gravity to change oil. They take the plug out. When they do that the class 2A fit is lost. When you purchase a new plug, it will not be a 2A thread. Now you are strictly relying on the sealing ring to hold back the tide. The lack of ability of a sealing ring to prevent drips is what brought out the Green shaking fingers in the first place.
The new plug from Audi is a one time use device. Once installed the sealant is released. When you remove it, there is no sealant, and the class 2A thread has partially deformed the threads on the screw. The deformation becomes less and less every time, and that leads to a new oil pan. I am not selling plugs here, just reporting on the engineering.
I am sure a lot of people have done their oil change the 1973 way, and being lucky their bung hole does not leak.
There are also a lot of people that are having free oil pans paid for by Audi because they realize that dealer mechanics have removed the first plug and destroyed the fit. I would suggest if the dealer wants to sell you a new oil pan, you contact Audi and let them know the cat is out of the bag concerning the "cross threaded oil plug" and ask them to pony up.
So your explanation of my 30+ oil changes (changing just the crush washer) on Audi vehicles in the past 6 yrs resulting in zero oil leak is just "luck".
I would have thought from skimming over your "report on engineering" you could have come up with something more technical.
I'm not opposed with using as extractor but there is absolutely nothing wrong with changing it the conventional way. As long as you don't cross thread or over-torque the plug. The positive of the extractor being you don't need to worry about either.
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08-11-2013, 05:48 PM
#9
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Moviela, your engineering explanation doesn't shell any light on why a car manufacturer would design a hole and a plug for it that are not meant to be used, given the extra cost and reliability side if it.
08-11-2013, 06:42 PM
#10
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