Audi Vs. BMW & MB
05-14-2001, 06:50 PM
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Audi Vs. BMW & MB
..Would the best Audi S8 model beat the best BMW M power and the best Mercedes AMG??? I am a hard-core Audi-lover, I get angry when people say that Mercedes and BMW have their own class. I think Audi's class is AT LEAST the same level, or what?
05-14-2001, 09:33 PM
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Re: Audi Vs. BMW & MB
You have to pit size and price to size and price...
M5 vs S8 coparable, but no go... S8 is much bigger...
Should be an M7????
E55 Benz to S8? No go should be the S8 to the S55....
etc.
M5 vs S8 coparable, but no go... S8 is much bigger...
Should be an M7????
E55 Benz to S8? No go should be the S8 to the S55....
etc.
05-15-2001, 11:09 AM
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However, E55 and M5 and XJR are all quicker than the S8
I don't think the S8 is that much bigger inside than the E-Class. It's somewhere between the E-Class and S-Class in interior size. The S8 is definitely roomier than an M5, but I think the reason the S8 is compared to the E55 AMG, Jaguar XJR and M5 is that price-wise, it matches up best against those three models. The S55 AMG is over 100 grand, but I am sure it is quicker (it has a lot more torque than the S8, with comparable horsepower) and it sure is a lot bigger inside than the S8. The A8 L has about equal rear seat legroom as the S-Class.
It's kind of unfortunate, but I think the S8 will also be compared against the much more expensive S55 AMG becasue both are performance flagships from each company's in-house performance division. I don't think the S8 4.2 liter engine can match the massive torque of the AMG 5.5-liter engine.
It's kind of unfortunate, but I think the S8 will also be compared against the much more expensive S55 AMG becasue both are performance flagships from each company's in-house performance division. I don't think the S8 4.2 liter engine can match the massive torque of the AMG 5.5-liter engine.
05-15-2001, 09:36 PM
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Re: However, E55 and M5 and XJR are all quicker than the S8
Of course the E55 and M5 and XJR are all quicker than the S8, but not faster than the new A8 6.0 W12! This is such a fantastic car! The German motor press says that it is one of the best and powerful engines all over the world. I will drive such a car next time and I think about it to install this engine in my car!<ul><li><a href="http://www.vw-audi-dreams.com">http://www.vw-audi-dreams.com</a</li></ul>
05-16-2001, 10:11 AM
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We're all missing 1point here...
Pound for pound.....! The overall accomplishment...
Audi manages to derive unbelievable performance from that 4.2 (0.0857142 hp/cubic centimeter and 0.0754761 lb/ft torque per cubic centimeter.)
Applying this methodology - which isn't bullet proof, I know - but looking at it this way, the Benz for example has to deliver somewhere in the order of 471 horses and 415 lb/ft torque to match the S8's per liter results. Scaling the Benz motor back to 4.2 liters it "only" delivers 267 horses and 298 lb/ft torque....
Live proud Audi...
Also, folks, is 2-wheel drive single cam and a 3 valve head not a bit behind in engineering? This from a car that IS much smaller and still only weighs 300 lbs less....and costs the same?
For the M5 it is slightly better than the E55, but still worse than the S8. A 4.2 M5 will be around 337 horses... This car is much smaller, with 2 wheel drive and it weighs only 80 lbs less than the much roomier S8!
Still, while price-wise they are in the same range the S8 should be compared to the S55 AS A GOOD VALUE! They weigh the same, but the S8 has much better handling, grip etc and costs 30K less....
I can't wait for a 5 liter S8... Turbos or no turbo....
Audi manages to derive unbelievable performance from that 4.2 (0.0857142 hp/cubic centimeter and 0.0754761 lb/ft torque per cubic centimeter.)
Applying this methodology - which isn't bullet proof, I know - but looking at it this way, the Benz for example has to deliver somewhere in the order of 471 horses and 415 lb/ft torque to match the S8's per liter results. Scaling the Benz motor back to 4.2 liters it "only" delivers 267 horses and 298 lb/ft torque....
Live proud Audi...
Also, folks, is 2-wheel drive single cam and a 3 valve head not a bit behind in engineering? This from a car that IS much smaller and still only weighs 300 lbs less....and costs the same?
For the M5 it is slightly better than the E55, but still worse than the S8. A 4.2 M5 will be around 337 horses... This car is much smaller, with 2 wheel drive and it weighs only 80 lbs less than the much roomier S8!
Still, while price-wise they are in the same range the S8 should be compared to the S55 AS A GOOD VALUE! They weigh the same, but the S8 has much better handling, grip etc and costs 30K less....
I can't wait for a 5 liter S8... Turbos or no turbo....
05-16-2001, 10:27 AM
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Re: Audi Vs. BMW & MB
I think there should be arranged a race or something to solve this mystery once and for all! Something like going as fast as they can... you know when they want to attempt speed records? that kind of road would be a good space for that!!
By the way, is S4 faster that any other Audi??
There are stupid government limited in the USA, I think S4 goes 157 MPH. But about in Europe? How fast Audis go in German Autobahns??
By the way, is S4 faster that any other Audi??
There are stupid government limited in the USA, I think S4 goes 157 MPH. But about in Europe? How fast Audis go in German Autobahns??
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05-16-2001, 01:55 PM
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Re: Install W12!
That is a *very* good idea!
:-)
Do you know anything about pricing for the W12 engine? (I would guess about DM 30K)
Will it fit in the "short" A8 4,2 engine compartment without major modifications? Same engine mounts?
--
/Kjell A
:-)
Do you know anything about pricing for the W12 engine? (I would guess about DM 30K)
Will it fit in the "short" A8 4,2 engine compartment without major modifications? Same engine mounts?
--
/Kjell A
05-17-2001, 06:35 AM
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You can not compare Audi S8 vs. M5 or E55
The Audi A8 is one class higher.
And the BMW M5 is much faster:
some times from the german magazines sportauto and AutoMotorUndSport:
0-200 km/h:
BMW M5 18.6 sec
Audi S8 22.8 sec
MB E55 20.1 sec
Audi W12 19.8 sec
Audi S4 25.8 sec
Audi RS4 17.8 sec
BMW M3 18.6 sec
Porsche turbo 996 14.6 sec
Porsche GT2 12.8 sec
Porsche 996 turbo tuned bei Gemballa, Ruf etc. 10-12.0 sec
There is one test in Germany, the so called "Supertest" in Sportauto. They
take the racelaps-time of the "Nürburgring-Nordschleife" and the Hockenheim-Ring.
Some examples:
M5 8:28 min
M3 8:22 min
S4 8:42 min
RS4 8:25 min
Porsche 996: 8:19 min
Porsche GT3: 8:02 min
Porsche 996 turbo: 7:56 min
Porsche GT2: 7:48min
And: you can not compare bussines-cars like Audi W12 with sport-vehicles like
BMW M5. But you can wait for Audi RS6: it will arrive at IAA at Sept. 2001 in Frankfurt/Germany. About 460 hp. Max. Speed 303 km/h. The engine was tested at higher turbo-pressure up to 540 hp, some tuners (like mtm and B&B etc.) will boost the power up to 600 hp.
Greetings from Germany
And the BMW M5 is much faster:
some times from the german magazines sportauto and AutoMotorUndSport:
0-200 km/h:
BMW M5 18.6 sec
Audi S8 22.8 sec
MB E55 20.1 sec
Audi W12 19.8 sec
Audi S4 25.8 sec
Audi RS4 17.8 sec
BMW M3 18.6 sec
Porsche turbo 996 14.6 sec
Porsche GT2 12.8 sec
Porsche 996 turbo tuned bei Gemballa, Ruf etc. 10-12.0 sec
There is one test in Germany, the so called "Supertest" in Sportauto. They
take the racelaps-time of the "Nürburgring-Nordschleife" and the Hockenheim-Ring.
Some examples:
M5 8:28 min
M3 8:22 min
S4 8:42 min
RS4 8:25 min
Porsche 996: 8:19 min
Porsche GT3: 8:02 min
Porsche 996 turbo: 7:56 min
Porsche GT2: 7:48min
And: you can not compare bussines-cars like Audi W12 with sport-vehicles like
BMW M5. But you can wait for Audi RS6: it will arrive at IAA at Sept. 2001 in Frankfurt/Germany. About 460 hp. Max. Speed 303 km/h. The engine was tested at higher turbo-pressure up to 540 hp, some tuners (like mtm and B&B etc.) will boost the power up to 600 hp.
Greetings from Germany