91quattro

OK I have ready many different threads about the suspension issues with these D3s and the fact that the front suspension components are the same ones used in the A6 line…the whole suspension design is unusual….the S8 bushings are different and better….etc. I am now on my third set of arms/bushings in front. My air shocks are rebuilt Arnotts that are less than 2 years old - working fine. About 18 months and 10K miles ago I replaced all the upper control arms (and bushings), forward and aft, and the sway links too, and for several months it felt great. Like I had never experienced in that car before. But gradually I began to hear and feel the looseness, the noise over bumps etc. in the front end again. I haven’t looked but I suspect I’ll find the usual small cracks starting to form in the rubber.

I live in Las Vegas, and the climate here may be an issue in terms of longevity of rubber parts. At least that's what the dealer tells me.

Maybe I did not use good enough quality parts? It was a kit from Blau, maybe I should only use OEM parts? Is using OEM parts worth the extra cost? Maybe replacing these things every couple of years just comes with the territory, especially in a hot and dry climate? Or maybe there are better quality parts or performance parts that last longer out there, and I haven’t heard about them.

Not looking to start yet another debate thread about this issue, there are plenty of those out there already. I’m just looking for this group’s bottom line recommendations on the best strategy for it.

Thanks in advance.

MP4.2+6.0

Bottom line, backed up by 9 years on forum and ownership out past 120K miles, hundreds of posts on this, and bitter personal experience with both a Blau kit and with OE parts: use dealer or OES parts.

The design is fundamentally undersized. Can't change that. The origins are actually later 90's A4's--totally different weight and power class compared to D3. And indeed it did also get used with late C5 aluminum suspension cut over and then C6. At C6 parts apparently merged. And for relevant trivia, C6 A6 for years was literally the top selling luxe ride in China with a local content version assembled by Audi there in country. Well, that stimulated a big market for what we would call here in the vernacular the Chinese junk parts.

My C5 4.2 experience with the very similar front arms was a Meyle kit from Blau. Parts and packaging at least then were not even marked with country of origin-not legally compliant. I should have known better. But price was "cheap." So was quality (not...) Within about 18 months I had creaks again. By two years I had a bad lower control arm--one of the big pain in butt ones to change. And so on. Car today is in family hands and we recently replaced a failed upper arm at still not big miles.

By contrast with D3 I stuck with dealer OE/OES parts. I have focused only on uppers and sway bar links, rather that full kit. I have concluded (and done detailed posts if you search) that useful life of upper bushings even done with top grade parts is as short as 40K miles before early signs of issues reappear, and between 70-90K where it gets pretty obvious on many of them. The links have a bit more life, but are also now only in $60 range for set so not even worth too much analysis or judgement calls when doing uppers. From both personal experience and many a post across different bodies, aftermarket stuff and kits may fall short at half those miles, and sometimes way short like 2 years or less and most miles. And keep in mind, design sizing is not great to begin with given loadings and three dimensional movement involved, especially at hose upper bushings.

You can approach uppers as either bushings only or full arms. The upper arms seem solid on ball joint end IF you stuck with OE. But if you changed whole arm, ball joint side may be sub par too. One of the Meyle kit ones crapped out on me on that end. Whether you now need whole arm due to sub par parts there now or bushings only if prior work was same, then relevant OES for either upper bushings or full arms are Lemforder. Same for sway bar links as it turns out (but not lower arms in general). Lemforder arms cost a little over $100 each on average, while even discount dealer closer to $200.

So bottom line assuming your arms got junked up on bushing end too: get Lemforder full arms from one of the indies and shop price. Get sway bar links in Lemforder. RM European where I got them was low $60's for set. Weren't cheapest for arms IIRC if that helps, but recheck. Get the various bit hardware nuts and bolts from dealer. Get the fender liner push pins too so you can pull liner and get at bolts way easier. Also be sure to tighten arms with suspension loaded. If not practical, set straight out from car when tightening. You should see if you look at your car now that is where they basically sit at rest for normal ride height.

Giovanni Giovino 6.0+6.0TT

May I ask how many miles on the three sets of front end parts, did you yourself install all three sets, if so, when it came time to tighten the upper control arms in position, did you use a third man jack or floor jack to lift the suspension into the normal ride height before tightening said upper and lower control arms ?


As far as quality, I know some whom have gone the cheaper kit way and did not make 5000 mile on some of the parts, I went the Europaparts Kit at $1262.00 tax included route VS. the $2400.00 and no tax that the dealer wanted at shop cost, that was in march of this year, so far so good, but I did get my brakes and bearings from the dealer, I mean I had him price all those pieces, so I had to buy something.....
Here is a list of what my kit included.



Ultimate Control Arm Kit (A8/S8 D3)

004978-000961-003746-003713-003714-003715-003716- 003356-003357-003358-003011$1,179.35
$1,179.35
Control Arm Kit Components
1 x Control Arm (C6/D3, Upper Left, Straight, Meyle HD) $84.95
003713 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
1 x Control Arm (C6/D3, Upper Right, Straight, Meyle HD) $84.95
003714 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
1 x Control Arm (C6/D3, Upper Left, Curved, Meyle HD) $84.95
003715 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
1 x Control Arm (C6/D3, Upper Right, Curved, Meyle HD) $84.95
003716 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
2 x Control Arm (A8/S8 D3, Lower Straight, Meyle HD) $299.90
003356 Ordered: 2
Shipped: 2
1 x Control Arm (A8/S8/Phaeton D3, Lower Curved, Left) $149.95
003357 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
1 x Control Arm (A8/S8/Phaeton D3, Lower Curved, Right) $149.95
003358 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
2 x Sway Bar End Link (C6/D3, Meyle HD) $79.90
003011 Ordered: 2
Shipped: 2
Tie Rod Ends
2 x Tie Rod End (Outer, Meyle HD) $99.90
003746 Ordered: 2
Shipped: 2
Installation Hardware
1 x Control Arm Hardware Kit (A4 A6 S4 S6 RS4 RS6 Passat, Complete Front) $59.95
000961 Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
Oxygen Sensor (17357, Latest Revision)

002715$119.95
Ordered: 1
Shipped: 1
$119.95

.

Triad.:

Would anyone happen to know the correct Lemforder part numbers for the upper control arms when installed in an S8?

MP4.2+6.0

Can only get the S8 arms from dealer. Same on the S8 bushings. Not even in the Lemforder master catalog. S8 complete arms from dealer are actually somewhat less than A8 arms from dealer (which seems weird). Bushings alone are somewhat more though (high $30's each a few years back). Overall S8 dealer arms are about 50% more than Lemforder A8 arms if either are bought online at a discount. Covered in my prior post, linked in my auto sig.

aTOMic

Undersized is right. The UCAs &LCAs have the same p/n as my b5 Passat with a 1.8T.

My question is, why not let the UCA bushings pivot on the bolts? Is that 1" of travel provided by the rubber that crucial? Poly bushings pivot freely there, if my understanding of their function is correct.

MP4.2+6.0

The bushings move in all three dimensions if you watch them while cranking steering wheel. So anything that stiffens them unnecessarily or works in only two dimensions seems to compromise the underlying design. There have been a couple of "seemed like a good idea at the time" poly posts over the years, usually followed by the noise/squeak post, and eventually the gave it up post.

mishar

Lower arms bushings have same 3D flexing under greater stresses and they last virtually forever. A bit larger ones at the top would last just as long. More rubber to flex would easily accommodate all that 3D movement. And no, it won't require completely redesigned suspension.

Way to fix the existing one is to make a custom replacement bushing that combine ball joint for 3D movement and rubber cushion to suppress sound transferring.