D4 stock ride height issues and wrinkles
03-20-2016, 09:21 PM
#1
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
D4 stock ride height issues and wrinkles
Several further twists from the every day parking type ride height issues I thought I would separate out into its own post.
I measured ride height differences on mine. Not up to snuff spec wise and its only a 3500 mile car. Right front is half an inch higher than left front measured from even garage floor to fender. I confirmed same tire pressures at all corners and tested both cold and warm, motor on and motor off, and with overnight rest and doors open or not [it seems to do a true up slightly audible correction of some sort on first door open]. A half inch tolerance is what I expect from a crap Taurus 25 years ago, with 75K on it and worn shocks on steel springs. But it gets better (worse): rear left is also higher and rear right lower. It is less than the front axle delta, but still a difference of .3-.4 of an inch, and sometimes .5. That means viewed from 4 corners it essentially high from the left front to right rear diagonal and low on the other diagonal. Goofy and just doesn't seem right. Read it again, not "left" or "right" or "front" or "back" that is low or high; it's the diagonal, on a nearly new undamaged D4 that feels aligned perfectly normally as you drive it.. All stock and no VCDS tuning presumably by owner 1 at like age 75 who said it was "too much car." I can see in the (untouched) coding the left and right side settings are different, but actually if you equalized the front settings the front error would increase to about ¾ inch overall; it would correct about ⅓ of the somewhat lesser rear error I field measured.
Needless to say it's going in for a short punch list of shakedown items to my usual service dealer this week, and that's on the list. Since it near new, I'll let dealer dial it in--and explain how it could be this way. Plus deal with any side issues with all the systems alignment with adaptive cruise and other systems that could be affected as front to back angles start to change differentially. I could try playing with VCDS, but better to let them sort what is a basic non- spec set up issue to me that I can demonstrate with any tape measure. It means my drivers side is yet half an inch lower than left (measured with no driver even on board). The total permitted drop (and maybe raise?) is apparently 17mm, and even the side to side errors here are already 12-13mm. And that half inch is measured at my front wheels. Put that front chin edge out the better part of two feet from the axle center line like the S8 and it is just asking for a hit on road dips and such if not careful. Like I said in another post, S8 Pluses with that big bucks trim package are going to be leave $1,000 "plus" pieces of front lower edge carbon fiber from coast to coast, one dip at a time.
Tire choice matters a bit on ride height too as I found from looking at stock D4 tire size specs. A couple 10s of an inch for the largest variances. 275/40 20s are "tallest", 265 35/21's are shortest, and the others somewhat in between. I have 275/35 21, so sort of in between. Not huge, but it is another .1 to .2 inches variance in ride height for any given A8 or S8 depending on wheel and tire set up. At least on mine, it looks like it would go to zero speedo error at the largest size; mine is 0-2mph optimistic at highway speeds (using a GPS app against displayed speed), most commonly 1. Then throw these two points together and even with the same model, my field data says I can have a difference relative to the next owner of almost ¾ of an inch, and it varies even side to side!
Art in Engineering clearly had too many Bieren from the vending machine when mine got to the suspension QA station for his oversight. And lest you think I joke, on the Q5 Euro delivery plant tour at Ingolstadt in 2013 (on the Q3 line IIRC), my wife and I asked if they still had the beer machines for the workers. Sheepishly the guide said yes, but now they are hidden in the break rooms instead out in the main cafeterias, public spaces and even to the side of the lines like when our jaws dropped in 1985 seeing them. She assured us "the workers really look out for each other." Comforting. Good thing the body build and paint shop robots only drink fine machine oil... Not sure about the ride height setting method and review...and consumption of Brau or 20 weight.
I measured ride height differences on mine. Not up to snuff spec wise and its only a 3500 mile car. Right front is half an inch higher than left front measured from even garage floor to fender. I confirmed same tire pressures at all corners and tested both cold and warm, motor on and motor off, and with overnight rest and doors open or not [it seems to do a true up slightly audible correction of some sort on first door open]. A half inch tolerance is what I expect from a crap Taurus 25 years ago, with 75K on it and worn shocks on steel springs. But it gets better (worse): rear left is also higher and rear right lower. It is less than the front axle delta, but still a difference of .3-.4 of an inch, and sometimes .5. That means viewed from 4 corners it essentially high from the left front to right rear diagonal and low on the other diagonal. Goofy and just doesn't seem right. Read it again, not "left" or "right" or "front" or "back" that is low or high; it's the diagonal, on a nearly new undamaged D4 that feels aligned perfectly normally as you drive it.. All stock and no VCDS tuning presumably by owner 1 at like age 75 who said it was "too much car." I can see in the (untouched) coding the left and right side settings are different, but actually if you equalized the front settings the front error would increase to about ¾ inch overall; it would correct about ⅓ of the somewhat lesser rear error I field measured.
Needless to say it's going in for a short punch list of shakedown items to my usual service dealer this week, and that's on the list. Since it near new, I'll let dealer dial it in--and explain how it could be this way. Plus deal with any side issues with all the systems alignment with adaptive cruise and other systems that could be affected as front to back angles start to change differentially. I could try playing with VCDS, but better to let them sort what is a basic non- spec set up issue to me that I can demonstrate with any tape measure. It means my drivers side is yet half an inch lower than left (measured with no driver even on board). The total permitted drop (and maybe raise?) is apparently 17mm, and even the side to side errors here are already 12-13mm. And that half inch is measured at my front wheels. Put that front chin edge out the better part of two feet from the axle center line like the S8 and it is just asking for a hit on road dips and such if not careful. Like I said in another post, S8 Pluses with that big bucks trim package are going to be leave $1,000 "plus" pieces of front lower edge carbon fiber from coast to coast, one dip at a time.
Tire choice matters a bit on ride height too as I found from looking at stock D4 tire size specs. A couple 10s of an inch for the largest variances. 275/40 20s are "tallest", 265 35/21's are shortest, and the others somewhat in between. I have 275/35 21, so sort of in between. Not huge, but it is another .1 to .2 inches variance in ride height for any given A8 or S8 depending on wheel and tire set up. At least on mine, it looks like it would go to zero speedo error at the largest size; mine is 0-2mph optimistic at highway speeds (using a GPS app against displayed speed), most commonly 1. Then throw these two points together and even with the same model, my field data says I can have a difference relative to the next owner of almost ¾ of an inch, and it varies even side to side!
Art in Engineering clearly had too many Bieren from the vending machine when mine got to the suspension QA station for his oversight. And lest you think I joke, on the Q5 Euro delivery plant tour at Ingolstadt in 2013 (on the Q3 line IIRC), my wife and I asked if they still had the beer machines for the workers. Sheepishly the guide said yes, but now they are hidden in the break rooms instead out in the main cafeterias, public spaces and even to the side of the lines like when our jaws dropped in 1985 seeing them. She assured us "the workers really look out for each other." Comforting. Good thing the body build and paint shop robots only drink fine machine oil... Not sure about the ride height setting method and review...and consumption of Brau or 20 weight.
Last edited by MP4.2+6.0; 03-21-2016 at 10:38 AM.
03-21-2016, 01:50 AM
#2
AudiWorld Super User
Well, on mine, the passenger front is lower than the rest by 3/4" as measured from the top of the fender. I've no idea why, but I don't have my cable to check numbers, either.
03-25-2016, 03:05 PM
#4
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[QUOTE=MP4.2+6.0;24790610]Several further twists from the every day parking type ride height issues I thought I would separate out into its own post.
I measured ride height differences on mine. Not up to snuff spec wise and its only a 3500 mile car. Right front is half an inch higher than left front measured from even garage floor to fender. I confirmed same tire pressures at all corners and tested both cold and warm, motor on and motor off, and with overnight rest and doors open or not [it seems to do a true up slightly audible correction of some sort on first door open]. A half inch tolerance is what I expect from a crap Taurus 25 years ago, with 75K on it and worn shocks on steel springs. But it gets better (worse): rear left is also higher and rear right lower. It is less than the front axle delta, but still a difference of .3-.4 of an inch, and sometimes .5. That means viewed from 4 corners it essentially high from the left front to right rear diagonal and low on the other diagonal. Goofy and just doesn't seem right. Read it again, not "left" or "right" or "front" or "back" that is low or high; it's the diagonal, on a nearly new undamaged D4 that feels aligned perfectly normally as you drive it.. All stock and no VCDS tuning presumably by owner 1 at like age 75 who said it was "too much car." I can see in the (untouched) coding the left and right side settings are different, but actually if you equalized the front settings the front error would increase to about ¾ inch overall; it would correct about ⅓ of the somewhat lesser rear error I field measured.
Needless to say it's going in for a short punch list of shakedown items to my usual service dealer this week, and that's on the list. Since it near new, I'll let dealer dial it in--and explain how it could be this way. Plus deal with any side issues with all the systems alignment with adaptive cruise and other systems that could be affected as front to back angles start to change differentially. I could try playing with VCDS, but better to let them sort what is a basic non- spec set up issue to me that I can demonstrate with any tape measure. It means my drivers side is yet half an inch lower than left (measured with no driver even on board). The total permitted drop (and maybe raise?) is apparently 17mm, and even the side to side errors here are already 12-13mm. And that half inch is measured at my front wheels. Put that front chin edge out the better part of two feet from the axle center line like the S8 and it is just asking for a hit on road dips and such if not careful. Like I said in another post, S8 Pluses with that big bucks trim package are going to be leave $1,000 "plus" pieces of front lower edge carbon fiber from coast to coast, one dip at a time.
Tire choice matters a bit on ride height too as I found from looking at stock D4 tire size specs. A couple 10s of an inch for the largest variances. 275/40 20s are "tallest", 265 35/21's are shortest, and the others somewhat in between. I have 275/35 21, so sort of in between. Not huge, but it is another .1 to .2 inches variance in ride height for any given A8 or S8 depending on wheel and tire set up. At least on mine, it looks like it would go to zero speedo error at the largest size; mine is 0-2mph optimistic at highway speeds (using a GPS app against displayed speed), most commonly 1. Then throw these two points together and even with the same model, my field data says I can have a difference relative to the next owner of almost ¾ of an inch, and it varies even side to side!
Art in Engineering clearly had too many Bieren from the vending machine when mine got to the suspension QA station for his oversight. And lest you think I joke, on the Q5 Euro delivery plant tour at Ingolstadt in 2013 (on the Q3 line IIRC), my wife and I asked if they still had the beer machines for the workers. Sheepishly the guide said yes, but now they are hidden in the break rooms instead out in the main cafeterias, public spaces and even to the side of the lines like when our jaws dropped in 1985 seeing them. She assured us "the workers really look out for each other." Comforting. Good thing the body build and paint shop robots only drink fine machine oil... Not sure about the ride height setting method and review...and consumption of Brau or 20 weight.[/QUOTE
So right side of car is a bit lowered then left. Dealer recalibrate the car suspension today but it now lowers bit still uneven like yours. Pictures show RR, RF, LF, and LR. What do we do... It's annoying
I measured ride height differences on mine. Not up to snuff spec wise and its only a 3500 mile car. Right front is half an inch higher than left front measured from even garage floor to fender. I confirmed same tire pressures at all corners and tested both cold and warm, motor on and motor off, and with overnight rest and doors open or not [it seems to do a true up slightly audible correction of some sort on first door open]. A half inch tolerance is what I expect from a crap Taurus 25 years ago, with 75K on it and worn shocks on steel springs. But it gets better (worse): rear left is also higher and rear right lower. It is less than the front axle delta, but still a difference of .3-.4 of an inch, and sometimes .5. That means viewed from 4 corners it essentially high from the left front to right rear diagonal and low on the other diagonal. Goofy and just doesn't seem right. Read it again, not "left" or "right" or "front" or "back" that is low or high; it's the diagonal, on a nearly new undamaged D4 that feels aligned perfectly normally as you drive it.. All stock and no VCDS tuning presumably by owner 1 at like age 75 who said it was "too much car." I can see in the (untouched) coding the left and right side settings are different, but actually if you equalized the front settings the front error would increase to about ¾ inch overall; it would correct about ⅓ of the somewhat lesser rear error I field measured.
Needless to say it's going in for a short punch list of shakedown items to my usual service dealer this week, and that's on the list. Since it near new, I'll let dealer dial it in--and explain how it could be this way. Plus deal with any side issues with all the systems alignment with adaptive cruise and other systems that could be affected as front to back angles start to change differentially. I could try playing with VCDS, but better to let them sort what is a basic non- spec set up issue to me that I can demonstrate with any tape measure. It means my drivers side is yet half an inch lower than left (measured with no driver even on board). The total permitted drop (and maybe raise?) is apparently 17mm, and even the side to side errors here are already 12-13mm. And that half inch is measured at my front wheels. Put that front chin edge out the better part of two feet from the axle center line like the S8 and it is just asking for a hit on road dips and such if not careful. Like I said in another post, S8 Pluses with that big bucks trim package are going to be leave $1,000 "plus" pieces of front lower edge carbon fiber from coast to coast, one dip at a time.
Tire choice matters a bit on ride height too as I found from looking at stock D4 tire size specs. A couple 10s of an inch for the largest variances. 275/40 20s are "tallest", 265 35/21's are shortest, and the others somewhat in between. I have 275/35 21, so sort of in between. Not huge, but it is another .1 to .2 inches variance in ride height for any given A8 or S8 depending on wheel and tire set up. At least on mine, it looks like it would go to zero speedo error at the largest size; mine is 0-2mph optimistic at highway speeds (using a GPS app against displayed speed), most commonly 1. Then throw these two points together and even with the same model, my field data says I can have a difference relative to the next owner of almost ¾ of an inch, and it varies even side to side!
Art in Engineering clearly had too many Bieren from the vending machine when mine got to the suspension QA station for his oversight. And lest you think I joke, on the Q5 Euro delivery plant tour at Ingolstadt in 2013 (on the Q3 line IIRC), my wife and I asked if they still had the beer machines for the workers. Sheepishly the guide said yes, but now they are hidden in the break rooms instead out in the main cafeterias, public spaces and even to the side of the lines like when our jaws dropped in 1985 seeing them. She assured us "the workers really look out for each other." Comforting. Good thing the body build and paint shop robots only drink fine machine oil... Not sure about the ride height setting method and review...and consumption of Brau or 20 weight.[/QUOTE
So right side of car is a bit lowered then left. Dealer recalibrate the car suspension today but it now lowers bit still uneven like yours. Pictures show RR, RF, LF, and LR. What do we do... It's annoying
03-25-2016, 04:44 PM
#5
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Baloo, not quite sure on yours I can figure out the distances to tire in your pictures, especially w/ tire curving along edge. Factory measure is to ago from hub center to top of fender. The one I did is to measure from the garage/concrete/flat pavement up to the fender edge. The front numbers you get may be different than rear (depends on fender cut on front and rear, and also how much rake (downward body angle look from back to front) they dial in. But both fronts and both rears should each be about the same height as pairs. Mine is even weirder because its not like the left side of car is low, or left is high. On a steel suspension car, it should be a little high with no one in it on drivers side, or if you throw in about a 150-200 pound dummy load, then about right. On an air ride, it should self correct, and seems very illogical the cross diagonals are like mine are height wise.
Specifically, I got:
LF:29.0" RF: 29.5+"
LR: 29.4" RR: 28.9"
Depending on whether car was hot or cold, doors never opened overnight, etc., I got numbers that would move around a few tenths of an inch, but the relative differences across the different positions were pretty consistent and always showed the weird cross diagonal anomaly.
Specifically, I got:
LF:29.0" RF: 29.5+"
LR: 29.4" RR: 28.9"
Depending on whether car was hot or cold, doors never opened overnight, etc., I got numbers that would move around a few tenths of an inch, but the relative differences across the different positions were pretty consistent and always showed the weird cross diagonal anomaly.
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03-25-2016, 08:33 PM
#8
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
So, my garage was floor poured in one slab, only slopes front to back barely, and I was there for the pour. With car parked front to back on said monolithic slab? The one parts don't do any weird rolls on any time since poured 20 years ago? Not
If S.A. trots that out, maybe I'll leave a tape measure in trunk to use their TBD flatter service drive if we need to do a friendly show and tell. Love it when it takes 30 seconds on a walk around and a Home Depot "special tool" to demonstrate. Sort of hard to then get the "could not replicate" line. I'll let them explain how exactly my 3900 mile car with a literally a purchased clock speed averaging 15 MPH is essentially slightly tipping on a cross diagonal axis as dialed in. I can do the demo with a diagonally bowed sheet of paper too, or just simplify to:
L H
H L
From at least one measurement here so far, I'm not the only one.
If S.A. trots that out, maybe I'll leave a tape measure in trunk to use their TBD flatter service drive if we need to do a friendly show and tell. Love it when it takes 30 seconds on a walk around and a Home Depot "special tool" to demonstrate. Sort of hard to then get the "could not replicate" line. I'll let them explain how exactly my 3900 mile car with a literally a purchased clock speed averaging 15 MPH is essentially slightly tipping on a cross diagonal axis as dialed in. I can do the demo with a diagonally bowed sheet of paper too, or just simplify to:
L H
H L
From at least one measurement here so far, I'm not the only one.
Last edited by MP4.2+6.0; 03-26-2016 at 08:00 AM.
03-26-2016, 05:00 AM
#9
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Yeah I'll remeasure it and it's in flat ground and ive tried few different areas of flat ground and the left side is about 1/4 inch or more wheel gapr than right grub and rear suspension
03-27-2016, 11:35 AM
#10
AudiWorld Member
Baloo,
When you shut the car off and get out, I'd suspect the drivers side would increase the gap because you took the weight off the drivers seat.
MP4.2,
Quite obvious the floor is not poured perfectly flat, think about a 1/4"-3/8" diagonal in the concrete and this would be your difference. No way can the floor be as perfect as you think, how can it be, its put in by by pouring concrete on hubs pounded in the ground and struck off of those hubs usually by a long 2x4. Certainly not as precise as the jig an Audi is built on I'm sure. Just a 1/4" high on two diagonal tires will give you measurements that are all of 1/2" different overall. Don't overthink it. If it really bothers you, go find a different slab to measure it on, I'll bet you come up with different figures again. No ground is going to be as perfect as you think.
When you shut the car off and get out, I'd suspect the drivers side would increase the gap because you took the weight off the drivers seat.
MP4.2,
Quite obvious the floor is not poured perfectly flat, think about a 1/4"-3/8" diagonal in the concrete and this would be your difference. No way can the floor be as perfect as you think, how can it be, its put in by by pouring concrete on hubs pounded in the ground and struck off of those hubs usually by a long 2x4. Certainly not as precise as the jig an Audi is built on I'm sure. Just a 1/4" high on two diagonal tires will give you measurements that are all of 1/2" different overall. Don't overthink it. If it really bothers you, go find a different slab to measure it on, I'll bet you come up with different figures again. No ground is going to be as perfect as you think.