Oh goodie! AudiGate!
11-13-2016, 04:48 PM
#1
AudiWorld Senior Member
Thread Starter
11-14-2016, 06:34 PM
#2
AudiWorld Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am so disappointed by VW's corporate cheating. I used to have a much higher opinion of their corporate ethics.
11-14-2016, 06:44 PM
#3
AudiWorld Super User
I still have higher respect for their engineering. Working on an A8 is easier than working on a Mercedes. Less stuff at risk of breaking upon disassembly. At least in my experience.
11-14-2016, 09:06 PM
#4
AudiWorld Super User
Stories I have read so far--back to the original Welt am Sonntag story a few weeks ago--seem to suggest it relates to the 3.0T. The thread has been running for a few weeks on the Q5 board where probably the top selling 3.0T Audi is resident. See https://www.audiworld.com/forums/q5-...vered-2909091/ Makes some sense (unfortunately) that it could be that one specifically since they made such a push for it in lieu of normally aspirated 4.2 (and 3.2) used in many of the same fitments previously and were working to get CAFE #'s up here, and CO2 numbers down where already regulated and/or taxed like Europe. But on the other hand as they rolled the 3.0T out to most models, a supercharged motor it is not going to be the most economical set up even if it has good get up and go close to prior 4.2.
If it plays like the TDI debacle, expect variously: Audi/VAG denials; "careful" whitewash investigations miraculously absolving top management accompanied by a bunch of laughable Sergeant Schultz "I know nothing" denials while blaming a "few [more...] rogue engineers"; and all oddly juxtaposed with a few higher level guys suddenly ejected by the spring loaded door hitting him/her but being "thanked" for their glorious service while "pursuing new opportunities." You can almost write the script now. They still have not fixed the top level management and Porsche family control issues and insular arrogant mindset, even if they are capable of strong designs. And if they really did it, CARB is going to roast them royally regardless of whatever new politics at EPA might be. German guys with the handcuffs who have been poking for months might finally say enough too.
If it plays like the TDI debacle, expect variously: Audi/VAG denials; "careful" whitewash investigations miraculously absolving top management accompanied by a bunch of laughable Sergeant Schultz "I know nothing" denials while blaming a "few [more...] rogue engineers"; and all oddly juxtaposed with a few higher level guys suddenly ejected by the spring loaded door hitting him/her but being "thanked" for their glorious service while "pursuing new opportunities." You can almost write the script now. They still have not fixed the top level management and Porsche family control issues and insular arrogant mindset, even if they are capable of strong designs. And if they really did it, CARB is going to roast them royally regardless of whatever new politics at EPA might be. German guys with the handcuffs who have been poking for months might finally say enough too.
P.S. Best BTW is the brief mention I saw that supposedly there is some way to trigger the hidden mode by some button or other sequence from in the vehicle. If that mode is the get up and go, something tells me that will be on the forums big time if someone cracks or leaks it. Of course in news speak, I guess that could be as simple as putting it in S. On the other hand, if it is the special granny mode for the hypermile set migrating from Priuses, not destined for a very popular mod...
Last edited by MP4.2+6.0; 11-14-2016 at 09:31 PM.
11-15-2016, 08:09 PM
#7
AudiWorld Super User
On pricing...they already are dropping a lot whether this comes to pass or not. Honestly if you read between the lines of the TDI debacle, a lot of the 2.0T TDI owners seem to have been using it/thinking of it as a way to bail on cars they would otherwise have found were worth far less, scandal or not. Apparently to the point where VW/Audi/Porsche are very reluctant to extend it to the 3.0TDI's where both the price points and the depreciation $$ are much greater, especially seeing what the 2.0T owners have already done. Or, just go to the Q5 board where my sense is if a 2.0T type buyout were offered on the 3.0TDI (which would include the very low volume D4 3.0TDI...), many would cash out fast and are just waiting/hoping for the offer even if they like the vehicle and motor.
Meantime on D4s, my rough approximation formula is always pretty much the same. And probably similar for most any pricy luxobarge, and maybe even the Audi C generations still. Basically expect a drop of 20% per year relative to the prior year for many years. Then add to it a further 20% clip as the first model change occurs--D5 for us. That is, what becomes effectively a 40% clip. That model change clip seems to run over a couple years from when expectation of the new model bubbles up (which it has already for D5) to when it actually ships. And since Audi usually intros and ships first in Europe, an car enthusiast mags run stories in that early window, it overhangs the used market a good amount. I think we are already into some of the latter model change over double whammy. Only questions on D5 are exactly what and when, not at all "if" or that it won't move the bar up again. S models usually fare a little better, and W12's a good amount worse, at least earlier on. Actually owning a W12 long enough w/ D3, I think it finally resets to around the S pricing, but took a long time. My own sense/hunch is there will probably be a somewhat more pronounced notch step from 4.2's to 4.0T's, if there isn't already. Smaller Audis do a lot better in general, since the used market is much younger demographically and tends to want smaller and sportier--A/S 4s and 5's, Q5, etc. It's been that way as long as I have owned them and watched pricing--back to latter 70's.
Meantime on D4s, my rough approximation formula is always pretty much the same. And probably similar for most any pricy luxobarge, and maybe even the Audi C generations still. Basically expect a drop of 20% per year relative to the prior year for many years. Then add to it a further 20% clip as the first model change occurs--D5 for us. That is, what becomes effectively a 40% clip. That model change clip seems to run over a couple years from when expectation of the new model bubbles up (which it has already for D5) to when it actually ships. And since Audi usually intros and ships first in Europe, an car enthusiast mags run stories in that early window, it overhangs the used market a good amount. I think we are already into some of the latter model change over double whammy. Only questions on D5 are exactly what and when, not at all "if" or that it won't move the bar up again. S models usually fare a little better, and W12's a good amount worse, at least earlier on. Actually owning a W12 long enough w/ D3, I think it finally resets to around the S pricing, but took a long time. My own sense/hunch is there will probably be a somewhat more pronounced notch step from 4.2's to 4.0T's, if there isn't already. Smaller Audis do a lot better in general, since the used market is much younger demographically and tends to want smaller and sportier--A/S 4s and 5's, Q5, etc. It's been that way as long as I have owned them and watched pricing--back to latter 70's.
Last edited by MP4.2+6.0; 11-15-2016 at 08:43 PM.
Trending Topics
11-16-2016, 05:14 AM
#9
oh lordy! My brother has a VW Golf diesel, he was offered $20k from VW to give it back, more than he paid almost, and it's a 5 year old car! think he's the real winner here...
11-19-2016, 06:11 AM
#10
Audiworld Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I heard the same thing about the buyback for VW. It was a good deal for buyers from what I read. Having watched my A8's value go through the floor, I was shocked. I love the car but was shocked. I think it depreciated far faster than any other car I have ever owned and I don't know why since I love the car.