hoospiders

hello again,

well, it appears that the damage to the drivers side frame rail on my V8Q may require my body shop to cut the existing frame from where it is buckled and weld a new section back on in its place:






ideally, i'd like to have a section that's the first 14" measured from the bumper attach point. unfortunately to get to the "red line" in my pic, you've got to take out the ABS pump, which means disconnecting the various brake lines, etc., and the brake pressure accumulator, which will also no longer have a "home" on the frame. probably as a result of this hassle-factor, a "well-known audi parts place" has offered to sell me an 11" piece for $85, which is kind of tempting, but 1) i'm not sure my body shop guy wants to have to make up the difference between where he cuts the frame and where the new piece starts, and 2) i would also probably rather have as clean a joint as possible i.e. just two sections of frame welded together as opposed to having them be joined by a section of some kind of plate. anyway, if anyone has a car that can spare the first 14" or so inches of its drivers side frame rail (basically a zombie V8Q), i would love to hear from you.

oddly enough, the bumper was undamaged in whatever caused the frame rail to buckle:



otherwise, the car is actually in surprisingly good shape for its age and mileage (160k). i have acquired all of the exterior parts necessary to fix what was damaged in its accident, and also all of the "obligatory" parts to do a pretty good mechanical refresh, which will now include a new fuel pump (spot-on toml99, it is in fact a VDO) as well as water pump, thermostat, timing and poly vee belts and associated hardware, valve cover gaskets, rebuilt power steering hoses courtesy of spokane house of hose (spokanehose.com), and a dave-kase-recharged brake pressure accumulator (audibombs,com). also an embarrassingly long and still growing list of smal parts from audi creve-coeur here in st. louis, mo. after some trial and error, jason, one of their parts guys, was able to source parts from audi tradition in germany, which was (as far as i know) the only place to get things like a fuel pressure regulator, the "rubber isolator" that attaches at the passenger-side valve cover (itself a monument of one part doing like 10 different things) and connects to the frame rail, and last but not least, this little gem:



anyway, the frame rail is the missing link to this audi puzzle at this point, so i hope to hear from somebody so i can start the reassembly process. thanks.

V8BOB

I went on Car-Part.com and searched for a left fender and came up with quite a few yards with 1990 to 93 V8's. I don't know where you are at but maybe one of those is close to you. Also from the picture, I would have it cut behind the motor mount as much as possible. The shop may want to sleeve the rail. They should pull the rail back to it's original length or as close as possible before cutting it.

Hope this helps, Bob

hoospiders

thanks bob. i never thought to alter my search term to something more generic (like "fender") and was searching under "frame", "frame horn" etc. i put a request out there, but will also send some emails directly to the yards that list fenders and see what they are willing to chop off in terms of frame rails. i'm too space-constrained for a parts car unfortunately.

good point about straightening the frame first. fortunately, my body person recommended pulling/straightening first as well, and also wanted as long a section of frame as possible. i will ask him about sleeving it.
i am assuming that you suggest going past the motor mount so that as much of the damaged frame is removed as possible. its a good suggestion. im trying to figure out hom mush extra its going to cost.

toml99

Hey, if you still have a list of small bits, let me know as I may have them....sorry no frame rail. That rubber isolator(torque mount) thing on passenger valve cover if broken usually indicates worn motor mounts....Did you get that from Audi Tradition?....I could use one for the Lago car....All the ones from parts cars were torn and yes, all motor mounts on those were toast. Someone's got your piece....Good luck and will be excited to hear when it's back on the road, Tom

hoospiders

thanks tom. i'm pretty much good to go on small bits.

here is the link to the "torque mount" on audi tradition: https://trshop.audi.de/konakart/Quic...267B&x=10&y=10

i ended up paying $61.77 to the dealer for the part. unfortunately, the motor mounts are 175 euros each from audi tradition, and that's before import taxes and dealer mark-up, steep enough for me to try to source them elsewhere.

vince

hoospiders

so what does a healthy motor mount look like any way? here are pics of my drivers side and passenger side, respectively:


drivers side

passenger side

please advise. also, if replacement is warranted, does any one have any tips and/or tricks with respect to removing the old mounts and installing new ones without removing the engine? i don't have any prior experience with this aspect of the car, and i cant really find specific guidelines in any of the scanned repair microfiche manuals. thanks in advance.

toml99

Hey Vince, I've parted 3 and helped with a 4th and all the mounts were failed. I never really looked at them close as I was always under the assumption(for the last 18 yrs) that they were Hydraulic and made sense why they failed/fell out in 2 pieces. In looking them up ETKA(7zap) calls them a bonded rubber bushing as opposed to the ones for a 200 that are hydraulic. So if they are indeed solid rubber, they have a horrible success rate. All the pentosin/oil leaks in these cars doesn't help any of the rubber bits either. I "think" but not totally positive if you loosened the motor/tranny mounts(supporting tranny with jack) and motor with engine hoist theres enough slop to lift front enough to get them out. If no, you can support engine/tranny and drop subframe. Been a few years, but I know dropping subframe is a for sure. "I think" again that all you need to remove to "lower" subframe is the swaybar, but both ball joints might need to get removed(been awhile). A good trick for removing swaybar is use a ratchet strap to pull both ends toward each other. Put jack under front part of bar and loosen the front mounts. If you forget the jack part you'll end up with a black eye(I did it twice!) because it's under tension. With the right tension on the strap, it will slip out and slide right back in. The front swaybar mounts have been NLA for years here but still available in Germany(I assume). The Powerflex Urethane ones are out there but apparently 1mm smaller and really difficult to get in. All that said, many V8's are driving around with bad motor mounts. My Lago car has had bad ones/torn torque mount for years and would drive it around if it ran. You may want to put off the mounts till you verify you have a fully functional car since they appear to be about $200 each these days...Good luck with the welding project...Tom

toml99

Hey Vince, I finally got in touch with a long time ex-V8 owner to verify that he used the street density motor mounts from 034 that are listed for the 5-cylinder cars on his V8 5-speed many years ago and that they fit and he said they felt great(and they're like $70)....I will likely go that route next time I have it apart that far....Mine look a bit like yours, but the torque mount is intact and I have zero drivability issues....