aaackkk...
10-21-2004, 05:53 PM
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aaackkk...
I bought a certified '01 AR at the begining of september. 42k miles, 402'd, sweet exhaust, chipped, silver, body colored bumpers.
the wheels had been 19" , but when I bought it, it had the 17" twin spoke wheels with a bald set of tires. ( My salesman had bought the wheels from the original owner.)
So this is supposed to be the certified car, right?
first thing I did was drive it across the street, put a set of pilot sports on it, and did an alignment. the left side camber was out. way out. over 2 degrees out. I had -2.83 degrees on the left side, and .5 on the right.
The tire store dude didn't know about the shifting subframe thing, so he sent me back to the dealer, they sent me to there sister audi dealer and they tried another alignment, and confirmed, gee, its out. Something must be bent. they sent me back to my dealer, and threw some parts at it.
Upper control arms, both side, lower control arms, left side. bushings all around.
overnight, they had the car on the lift, which lost oil pressure and lowered my AR onto the cart parked under the left fender and bumper area. This ripped the bumper cover, inner fender, and left fender.
ok. so I told them accidents happen, fix it, and come up with some kind of compensation for the excess depreciation.
off to the body shop we go. Fender, inner liner, bumper cover. blend into the door and the hood. I haven't priced that out yet, but we pained a 1/4 of the car.
off to the alignment shop. remember, we replaced most of the suspension already, and its yet to be aligned. Nope, won't align, must be a tweeked frame.
back to the body shop. Oh yeah. This body shop dude knew the guy who traded this car in. He's a regular there. Had the bumpers painted there a while ago, before trading it for a S4.
The body shop owner tells me that the car's previous owner had driven around in the low setting all the time. In fact, he had it so low , it probably had been sitting on or close to the bump stops. Every time it hit a bump, it tweeked the frame little by little.
last friday, I was told the car had been pulled, and that it would go to the alignment shop on monday. monday gets here, not done. its got to go back on the rack again, before it goes to the alignment shop. tuesday, back on the rack for another pull. two pulls now. weds early am, service advisor tells me more pulling. this is the third pull.
this is when a little background info on me comes in. I ran a body shop from '89 to '91. I wrote estimates, managed parts ordering, and did customer relations. I was the main point of contact for several dealerships. I have been cutting these guys slack because I used to be one of them.
on weds, after three phone calls, two visits (they are four blocks away from my home) and no service advisor, I walk into the front of the dealership, and get the sales manager, who, btw, has seen me at the dealership on and off for the past three and 1/2 weeks. I'm in his loaner car.
I tell him I want him to write down everything I'm going to tell him, and pass it on to the general manager, who would be in at 9:00 this morning.
I give him the whole story. And told him I had been patient. But now that my car has been pulled three times, I didn't want the car.
this morning, I discuss with the general manager trading me out of the car, and that I'd be back later that day to negotiate a deal, and that last night, I had found a black '01, manual, premium package, 27,000 miles or so at a nearby dealer .
I show up at 4:30, and general manager is not there, I talk with the general sales manager who had called that dealer, and decided they wanted retail for their car. I said so, suck it up. cut your losses. do the deal.
he responds with, "how bout a really good deal on an '04 S4?"
I decline, as it was a sedan, and it was 12 grand more than what I paid for my AR. I ski, and I want and AR, but I'd take a B4 S4 avant, but I want a frickin manual.
He's researching options tonight.
I leave the dealer, and head straight to the body shop. Body shop owner tells me he didn't get to pull it until monday, that he had to pull another car off the rack to do it, and that the alignment guy couldn't take it until today, that's why it had been out so long, and it was fixed now and he'd have it back at the dealer tonight. that was 5:45. He claims to have pulled it only once, that they moved the upper control mounting point out about 1/4 inch, and the alignment shop said it lined up now.
At this point, I have a car that was sold as a certified used car, wasn't properly prepped (tires are on the checklist, I should make them buy those pilot sports I bought) , and has been damaged while in their possession. In addition, I was led to believe the car had been pulled three times, but have now been told only once, and had not heard anything about the busy alignment shop problem.
There's a difference between what the dealer has told me, and what the body shop told me. Here in lie the rub. If this has been pulled three times, like the dealer guys said, then I don't want the car. No way. If only once, maybe, but I still want a huge concession to cover depreciation.
I don't want to have to make a decision based on who to believe. I think I'd be better served to negotiate a different car. what would you-uns do?
the wheels had been 19" , but when I bought it, it had the 17" twin spoke wheels with a bald set of tires. ( My salesman had bought the wheels from the original owner.)
So this is supposed to be the certified car, right?
first thing I did was drive it across the street, put a set of pilot sports on it, and did an alignment. the left side camber was out. way out. over 2 degrees out. I had -2.83 degrees on the left side, and .5 on the right.
The tire store dude didn't know about the shifting subframe thing, so he sent me back to the dealer, they sent me to there sister audi dealer and they tried another alignment, and confirmed, gee, its out. Something must be bent. they sent me back to my dealer, and threw some parts at it.
Upper control arms, both side, lower control arms, left side. bushings all around.
overnight, they had the car on the lift, which lost oil pressure and lowered my AR onto the cart parked under the left fender and bumper area. This ripped the bumper cover, inner fender, and left fender.
ok. so I told them accidents happen, fix it, and come up with some kind of compensation for the excess depreciation.
off to the body shop we go. Fender, inner liner, bumper cover. blend into the door and the hood. I haven't priced that out yet, but we pained a 1/4 of the car.
off to the alignment shop. remember, we replaced most of the suspension already, and its yet to be aligned. Nope, won't align, must be a tweeked frame.
back to the body shop. Oh yeah. This body shop dude knew the guy who traded this car in. He's a regular there. Had the bumpers painted there a while ago, before trading it for a S4.
The body shop owner tells me that the car's previous owner had driven around in the low setting all the time. In fact, he had it so low , it probably had been sitting on or close to the bump stops. Every time it hit a bump, it tweeked the frame little by little.
last friday, I was told the car had been pulled, and that it would go to the alignment shop on monday. monday gets here, not done. its got to go back on the rack again, before it goes to the alignment shop. tuesday, back on the rack for another pull. two pulls now. weds early am, service advisor tells me more pulling. this is the third pull.
this is when a little background info on me comes in. I ran a body shop from '89 to '91. I wrote estimates, managed parts ordering, and did customer relations. I was the main point of contact for several dealerships. I have been cutting these guys slack because I used to be one of them.
on weds, after three phone calls, two visits (they are four blocks away from my home) and no service advisor, I walk into the front of the dealership, and get the sales manager, who, btw, has seen me at the dealership on and off for the past three and 1/2 weeks. I'm in his loaner car.
I tell him I want him to write down everything I'm going to tell him, and pass it on to the general manager, who would be in at 9:00 this morning.
I give him the whole story. And told him I had been patient. But now that my car has been pulled three times, I didn't want the car.
this morning, I discuss with the general manager trading me out of the car, and that I'd be back later that day to negotiate a deal, and that last night, I had found a black '01, manual, premium package, 27,000 miles or so at a nearby dealer .
I show up at 4:30, and general manager is not there, I talk with the general sales manager who had called that dealer, and decided they wanted retail for their car. I said so, suck it up. cut your losses. do the deal.
he responds with, "how bout a really good deal on an '04 S4?"
I decline, as it was a sedan, and it was 12 grand more than what I paid for my AR. I ski, and I want and AR, but I'd take a B4 S4 avant, but I want a frickin manual.
He's researching options tonight.
I leave the dealer, and head straight to the body shop. Body shop owner tells me he didn't get to pull it until monday, that he had to pull another car off the rack to do it, and that the alignment guy couldn't take it until today, that's why it had been out so long, and it was fixed now and he'd have it back at the dealer tonight. that was 5:45. He claims to have pulled it only once, that they moved the upper control mounting point out about 1/4 inch, and the alignment shop said it lined up now.
At this point, I have a car that was sold as a certified used car, wasn't properly prepped (tires are on the checklist, I should make them buy those pilot sports I bought) , and has been damaged while in their possession. In addition, I was led to believe the car had been pulled three times, but have now been told only once, and had not heard anything about the busy alignment shop problem.
There's a difference between what the dealer has told me, and what the body shop told me. Here in lie the rub. If this has been pulled three times, like the dealer guys said, then I don't want the car. No way. If only once, maybe, but I still want a huge concession to cover depreciation.
I don't want to have to make a decision based on who to believe. I think I'd be better served to negotiate a different car. what would you-uns do?
10-21-2004, 06:11 PM
#2
I'd stop the checks and call the bank..
I'd also be calling AoA as the car was certified... but was in poor shape, not deseriving certification. I'd also call your state's consumer affairs and better business bureau.
You have what sounds like outright FRAUD and the long you empathise and put up with it the worse you case will be. There is no way a certified car comes with bald tires in addition to a bent frame.
You have what sounds like outright FRAUD and the long you empathise and put up with it the worse you case will be. There is no way a certified car comes with bald tires in addition to a bent frame.
10-21-2004, 06:16 PM
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Re: I'd stop the checks and call the bank..
too late for the check stoppage. that was a month ago. I have my payment book allready.
I will contact AoA tomorrow, but first, I'm going to see what their offer is.
If I was the dealer, I'd make right rather than have this cost 50 grand in attorney fees.
I will contact AoA tomorrow, but first, I'm going to see what their offer is.
If I was the dealer, I'd make right rather than have this cost 50 grand in attorney fees.
10-21-2004, 06:57 PM
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My advice to you is wait and see what the dealer offers you, but in any case i personally would not
take back that car, even if it's been pulled only once...but then again it's just me...
10-21-2004, 07:32 PM
#7
AoA response... falisfying a Certification...
is a big deal to AoA... afterall they or / their insurance co foots the bill for the falsification.
The dealer should refund 100% of the car and tires including taxes, etc. or give you an even exchange with something in stock. Good Luck..let us know how this continues...
The dealer should refund 100% of the car and tires including taxes, etc. or give you an even exchange with something in stock. Good Luck..let us know how this continues...
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10-21-2004, 07:50 PM
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Re: AoA response... falisfying a Certification...
I have found that in extreme cases like this it is helpful to document it all very well. Lots of names dates times. Then document not just the sate consumer ETC but the exact person phone number and title of the State guy, AoA, your attorney, the name of the processor server, the local TV make it right guy. names of reporters at the local paper (with phone numbers.) ETC. (every person and office you can think of. In one case I had my congressman on the list.
It is important that it shows that you have calmly done a lot of home work and are ready to go, Not just "I'll call my attorney"
I did this before the Internet. Now, I would probably have 10 web lists in there and the address of my web page. (all mocked up but no home page to find it YET)
I then present the document to the dealer and tell them that no action is required. I just want to let them know that I am taking next Tuesday off to contact all these people and start the ball rolling. I have only done this over kill approach three times in 30 years. Once with a dealer and once with a insurance company. It worked within hrs all three times.
Frank
It is important that it shows that you have calmly done a lot of home work and are ready to go, Not just "I'll call my attorney"
I did this before the Internet. Now, I would probably have 10 web lists in there and the address of my web page. (all mocked up but no home page to find it YET)
I then present the document to the dealer and tell them that no action is required. I just want to let them know that I am taking next Tuesday off to contact all these people and start the ball rolling. I have only done this over kill approach three times in 30 years. Once with a dealer and once with a insurance company. It worked within hrs all three times.
Frank
