JayP

A few guys a the track were praising steel brake lines as it provided a firmer feel.<p>With the slotted disks and sport pads from KVR, there is more pedal travel. I thought the pads needed seating, but after the weekend they are still spongy, nothing like the stock pads.<p>I'm convinced I need new lines.<p>I might have boiled the fluid... <p>Since I'll let the shop do the fluids, I might as well let them install the new lines. Anyone else let the dealer do it?<br>I'd expect $$$, but as long as I ain't doin' it, its might be worth the trouble.

Steve S.

I have been holding off due to the large labor bill to do the lines and ATE super blue fluid, but that last visit to the track did not allow me to have real responsive brakes near the end of the run. Several of the 1.8T owners were saying that their fluid boiled over and was in the engine bay area. To me this is not good news...mine didn't boil over, but I don't want it to. Did you install the rotor yourself? if so, how hard? how much time did it take? You know...all that stuff.<p>Your Brembo Bro<p>Steve S.<br>

ErikR

Do you have the Brembo kit?<p>If you didn't have sponginess then before it is likely that you did get some air in the system. Before and after track events it is a great idea to bleed the brake system. It is sort of overkill, but I use Castrol LMA and it is so inexpensive that I am essentially replacing the whole system every three events or so.

JayP

Its only a rotor/pad conversion using the stock calipers. <p>It just started when I added the new pads. I thought break in was needed... but after driving my GTI, the A4 feels spongy. Before, the GTI was the spongy one.<p>Another BBs'er had changed his fluid out before the track event. He said there were bit of junk in the lines. We have the same # of miles, but I have 1 more track event than he does.<p>I might try to squeeze the shop for a flush.

JayP

Several cars were having trouble with brakes.<br>I credit the pads for not forcing me to use more pressure and boil the fluid.<p>More then one person said the steel lines were great... so I guess I'll get them.<p>The rotors were easy:<br>I used a 17mm socket to remove the caliper and the rotor just fall off... might use that plastic too to keep it from droppin' on your foot!<p>The clips on the backs of the pads were tough. Had to wrestle with them for about 45 minutes each! <p>The retaining clips on mine were a bear to re-install. But overall, its pretty simple.<br>Just take your time. I was rushed and got frustrated (and got a headache |-----------------------------------------------| this big.<p>I might put the stock pads back on to see what the difference is. I really like the slots. Not as efficient as the cross drilled, but as quiet as standard disks (No cross-drill roar.)<p>I'll probably have a rundown on my page... but the film is not yet developed.

Ray Calvo

The talk I have heard snd read over past 10 years or so is that steel brke lines do NOT provide any assistance in regards to brake feel - they can actually be detrimental if they are not sized compatible with your OE lines in regards to line length and flow cross-sectional area. Have heard also that some are more prone to failure at the connections - all depends on manufacturer. Race drivers apparently use them since they provide heat protection. However, they do a heavy maintenance/inspection prior to any race to find/correct problems. On a street car, you can collect dirt/chips/salt/slush/water, etc. that can eat away at the rubber lines, and you'll never know you have a problem until the rubber fails during an emergency stop.<br>I replaced the OE lines on my '84 Carrera largely since I noticed some cracking of the rubber lines. I did NOT notice any improvement in braking feel.<br>If you put them on, get the3m from a reputable manufacturer who has sized them right with the proper fittings, and do a careful check of them every couple of months.

ErikR

If your new pads are thinner than the stock ones you can get worse pedal feel and easier boiling! (regardless of better grip) I always look for endurance racing spec pads because of this.

John/TSR

If you have spongy brakes, it's due to air in the system. Make sure that your system is bled at all the calipers AND at the master cylinder. Most people figure that since the master is "uphill", it doesn't need to be bled. Wrong. You can have air trapped in the master, and bleeding at the wheels all day long won't get it out.<p>Teflon lined braided steel lines will give you a slightly more firm feel (but only slightly...) as they "swell" less under pressure than stock flex lines. They aren't any better at high temps, and they won't keep you from boiling your brakes. They are a little tougher, and can stand very high pressures that might cause normal flex lines to fail. <p>New pads won't feel spongy, even if they're not broken in yet. At worse, they'll just give you a firm pedal with very little braking torque.<p>Bleed. Bleed. Bleed. Bleed.<p>JW<br>TSR

ErikR

John,<p>Agree completely on the braided lines, although you have to watch the length on some aftermarket lines.<p>On the pads though I have found skinner pads (same material) allow heat to transfer to the caliper faster, and have much poorer feel to them. The feel is obviously not the same as fade; which some of the comments here lead me to believe that they DON'T have actual boiling (no Holy S***!! The pedal went to the floor on turn 6).<p>Some master cylinders develop a groove or just get mushy at the end of the travel, that is the feel I'm try to explain here.