The latest S4 is a “better” car than the latest S6.
06-27-2017, 08:00 PM
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The latest S4 is a “better” car than the latest S6.
You’ve come here to this forum probably because you are an S4 owner or perhaps are considering an S4. You may be shopping other manufacturer’s offerings and, you may, like me, even have crossed shopped different Audi models.
In my case, after having had an S6 – last century – and a 2014 S4, I did, briefly consider a second S6, rather than a second S4. I’m so happy I went with the new S4, and after reading the many current model S6 posts here on AW, I’ve come to the conclusion that the only reason to get an S6 is if, for some reason, the plus-size of the S6 is required.
I decided to approach this from the perspective of Truth or Dare.
And, I’ve decided I’ll choose “truth!”
To wit: The latest S4 is a “better” car than the latest S6.
Here’s how I came to this conclusion.
I was thoroughly enjoying my leased 2014 S4, a Premium+ model with most of the option boxes checked so that it would virtually qualify the car to be considered a Prestige model. But, it was, after all, a lease – and all good leases come to an end. So, my thoughts were already headed down the path of thinking, “After the wonderful experience with this S4 is I’ll go ahead and get another S4; after all there is a new one coming to the US in early 2017, so the timing will work out.”
But, as I was having these thoughts it’s the summer of 2016, and as is our wont, my wife and I treat test-driving cars as a small-cost, big-fun Saturday afternoon activity usually culminating in dinner out where we discuss the vehicles driven du jour.
Audi S6 Prestige
On the menu for that particular summer of ’16 Saturday – for the second time – was the latest and greatest S6, in Prestige trim, no less. Let’s see if the S6 delivers. Let’s see if the S6 meets our expectations for a car costing perhaps $15,000 – or more – than an S4.
Getting behind the wheel of the S6, I immediately felt at home. Even the S6 Steering wheel was virtually identical to my S4’s flat bottomed affair. The analog dash, somewhat dated, looks (looked) expensive (I believe the phrase is “jewel-like”) and everything the driver can see and touch looks and feels as if no expense was spared. Although, it must be emphasized that the S6 – both inside and out – could be easily thought of as an Audi A6 from 2012. It looks handsome, but it also doesn’t look very young and it certainly doesn’t look, well, current (but, at this point, neither does my ’14 S4 which looks like my 2009 A4 and the then current – 2016 – S4’s.) The S6, handsome as it may be, looks (to be charitable) in need of a refresh, especially when sitting next to the 2017 A4’s and Q7’s on the showroom floor, both of which hint strongly at the look of the “coming soon” S4.
But, then again, fire up the turbo-charged V8 and – near silence – the only real assurance that anything is happening is that the tach needle isn’t resting at zero anymore, the V8 burble sounds as if it is coming from someplace further away than directly in front of the driver.
Sitting behind the wheel of the running S6 after hopping out of a not-too-old S4, the S6 seems huge. This car would look just right sitting on the semi-circular driveway fronting a 7 or 8,000 square foot house situated on 5 acres. This is no mere sports sedan, no – this automobile seems as if it actually should be called a “Saloon.”
But my impression that the S6 is a “giant-sized” car may well be nothing more than a function of having been in an S4 a minute or two earlier. Let’s drive this thing. The S6, lightly pressed into service, is so smooth, so almost eerily quiet it must be a hybrid running, on take-off, on purely and perfectly silent, electric motors. Are those bass notes actually coming from something close by?
Hello, is this thing really on?
OK, so I reach the entrance ramp to the six-lane interstate (I-275) that encircles Cincinnati. I press a bit harder on the accelerator and there is an immediate response of acceleration, but within a cocoon of isolation, so complete the sensation is something like having my whole head completely under water. The S6 is so deceptively quick, speed arrives almost more as an event that is reported to you via the car’s readouts rather than perceived by your senses. It is possible to feel the pressure of the very rapid acceleration the car is capable of, but only if you force the issue with your right foot. The thing is, the S6 is capable of very rapid acceleration episodes accompanied by very little drama; the S6 must have been designed with its first order of business being to isolate the driver and passengers so well as to almost guarantee that attaining triple-digit speeds is accomplished to give the impression that it is impervious to wind and road imperfections – perhaps it really is impervious, I have no data that would refute this notion. The S6 really is one of the few cars that can live up to the description: Stealthy. One-hundred miles per hour actually seems like a rational, perhaps everyday speed, the S6 drives and rides so sedately, so without drama. The air-suspension (when set to dynamic) and wide tires encourage cornering feats that somehow seem to suggest the S6 can literally scoff at the laws of physics. Truthfully, it can’t, of course, but the damn thing seems stickier than it really is, and perhaps perception is enough. Unlimited urge, of course, is not all there is; and, there are actually some glaring oversights, that are really quite possibly deal breakers – for some of us. What are they, you may wonder?
The Bose sound system seems horribly out of place in this car – to say something “nice” about it requires that I say “what were they thinking?” There is nothing high-end about it – I can’t imagine what the “standard” system must sound like and this Bose system almost makes me believe the optional system (at what, $6,000?) might actually be worth it. As James Comey once said, “Lordy.”
Driving along at the posted Interstate speed limit and then flooring the car for a long count of “one, two, three” almost guarantees you will be at double the posted speed limit should you care to glance at the digital (or analog) read out – if you dare.
One last positive note: Despite its overall girth, the S6 is (thanks, no doubt to the air-suspension) fairly nimble – and when things start to get out of hand, the result is pretty easily controllable under-steer which almost doesn’t matter considering how easily you’ll be able to use the engine’s prodigious power as you exit the curve you’re plowing through onto the next straightaway where you’re pretty much assured to be able to catch up and pass almost any less nose-heavy opponent. Absolute power corrupts absolutely? Absolutely.
Even having said all of these glowing things about the S6 (other than the crappy Bose system), the current (even as of now, June, 2017) S6 seemed/seems like it should have undergone a serious upgrade since its 2012 birth (initially as an A6) when it was first offered in the US. Yes, I liked the power, I liked the refinement, but I didn’t like the almost total lack of drama I was able to provoke even when I tried.
As my time with the S6 lengthened, it almost seemed like its purpose was to be a “hot-rod for the ol’ [well-heeled] man.” At $80,000+, it just seemed it ought to have felt and looked, uh, more like a current style garment rather than a Nehru jacket. If I needed the “real estate” of the S6, I would probably end up getting a maxed out A6 “performance” edition and not spend the extra on such a dated driver.
Although there will be a new A6/S6 generation – eventually – it is good, very good that we have the 2018 Audi S4 Prestige in the meantime.
Audi S4 Prestige
In Prestige trim – and being somewhat trimmer, in size, too – the new S4 can be (with certain of its selectable parameters set to “comfort”) also quite stealthy in its own right. Although initially the 2018 S4 seems less of an all-new design than its designation as a ‘B9’ would suggest, the ’18 S4 is more than a face lift – as you probably know, unless this is your first visit to Audiworld. Just in case you’re wondering (and chances are, you aren’t), the most serious upgrades to the A4/S4 have happened under-hood and in the cabin – I’m talking about the thing’s “avionics” of course.
Nevertheless, the B9 S4 looks every bit as upscale as the S6, having lost virtually all of the cues suggesting “I’m a small sporty design” looks of the B8 generation. The current S4, with its state-of-the-art tech and even more bespoke look than the aging S6, no longer looks like the “obviously” less well-heeled member of the family. That job is now left to the S4’s A3/S3/Q3 cousins. The new S4 is stunning, nothing about it, inside or out suggests “entry level” anything.
Fire it up – unless “provoked” the S4 Prestige, similar to the S6, sits in near silence until or unless “dynamic” is chosen for the engine/transmission and/or exhaust sound via the ADS. With its dual pane glass, the S4 pressed gently will seem to quietly glide from a stop to most any rational speed, and some that aren’t, with little drama – quite a bit like the S6, but with just enough urgency to let you know that it is not asleep and that it will not put you to sleep. Although the S6 will have most likely impressed you, the S4 will both impress and entertain you. The S4, unlike the S6, is not entirely drama free, that is – and that really is a welcome thing, a very good thing.
Let me be very clear, while the S4 can be made to remain relatively calm, it is also – with little provocation quite capable of showing you a good time – impressing and entertaining all the while – but not wearing you out.
Getting behind the wheel of the S6 impresses in the way that a Ralph Lauren Blazer impresses, but it’s like “old money,” perhaps with the emphasis on “old.” Getting into an S4, you’re not sure who the designer is, but you know it’s not Ralph Lauren or Burberry or Savile Row, perhaps it’s Prada, or a newcomer you’ve not heard of, but whatever it is, the S4’s virtual cockpit like a brand-new designer from Asia or Italy is unlikely to be like anything you’ve seen previously. Yet, the optional fine Napa leather diamond-stitched seats, like the ones in the S6 somehow manage to look of a current design and yet are both top-class and also look – especially in red or gray – sumptuous.
The S4’s flat-bottom steering wheel somehow with its less prominent hub has taken the look more contemporary and even pull off being sleeker. Without meaning to damn the S6, the S4 seems to present an inviting and simultaneously cool demeaner.
What I’m trying to say, is that the S4 looks fresh, new, while the S6 looks dated. It’s a big deal.
But, other than size, what does one get for an additional sum of $15,000 or more – is it simply performance? Well, yes, the S6 is perhaps up to a half-second quicker than the S4, which considering the sheer size of the S6 is no mean feat. The S6 can do the 0-60 deed in under 4 seconds. Of course, all current reviews of the new S4 claim Audi’s estimates are, well, pessimistic. It seems quite capable of being the marble launched by a weapon’s grade quality sling-shot.
On the same stretch of the northern loop of I-275, where I had previously driven the S6, pressing the S4’s accelerator to the floor – while traveling at the posted legal speed – provided virtually the same rush of speed as occurred with the S6. Virtually the same is not EXACTLY the same, however; the V8 in the S6 truly is a force of nature, besting even the awesome acceleration and accomplishment of double-digit speeds the S4 produces. Long live the S6’s V8.
So, despite the 2018 S4’s horsepower and torque improvements, the S6 is still likely to show the S4 its taillights when flying flat out in a run from 60 to 120MPH. But it’s not like the S6 shouldn’t at least check the rear-view mirror, because the increased power and lighter package to move means the S4 won’t likely lose sight of the S6 and if there are any curves ahead, the S4 will catch up while the S6 scrubs off speed, Too, the S4 will more than keep up with the S6 throughout the esses, and if the course taken has many curvy bits, the S4’s nimbleness will likely win the day or, at worst, be a formidable asset, allowing the S4 to keep up with the more powerful S6 V8.
Yet, the thing is, most of us don’t buy $60K, $70K or $80K cars to flog them insanely on public roads without regard to traffic, safety and law enforcement’s pursuit – indeed, we probably rarely, if ever, do this, and even if we’re tempted to try, we undoubtedly make damn sure we’re on a deserted road and almost certainly show more than a little restraint.
So, what makes the S4 – today – the better car when compared to the S6?
Unless you absolutely need to chauffer rear-seat passengers taller than 6’ for long periods of time, the ’18 S4 is, simply, more. More modern, more capable overall – specifically in terms of performance, efficiency, technology and safety – the S4 is a modern sports sedan. The S6, on the other hand has passed its prime; perhaps a more complete description is to say that the S6 when it was first brought to market is where the S4 is today – the current state of the art in Audi’s lineup. The new S4 is capable of a degree and level of elegance no previous S4 was ever able to achieve. Today’s S4 has a better, more sorted out, chassis than the S6, of course (but there is a new A6/S6 coming). At this price point the S6’s Bose (no highs, no lows) audio system should be able to be almost taken for granted as “among the best.” Not even close. But, the B&O sound system in the S4 is a thing of aural beauty – without spending thousands and thousands more on the S6’s own implementation of B&O.
Everything – unless you NEED the size, width, girth and the weight of the S6 – is in better balance with the ’18 S4 Prestige. However, due in large part to its size, the current S6 does have a certain gravitas, especially in the darker hues. But once you get behind the wheel, you realize the S6 is due, perhaps overdue, for modernization.
Get an S4 Prestige, save yourself $15,000+ and drive one of the most impressive and always entertaining sports sedans ever created (at this price point) – it’s worth the price of entry (about $61,000 nicely equipped) into an almost new class of car, the contemporary sport sedan.
This car makes me wonder if an RS 4 sedan would gain in performance and poise but lose something of its refinement in the process.
Beats me, but I’d sure be willing to test-drive one of them.
I dare you to compare these two for yourself.
In my case, after having had an S6 – last century – and a 2014 S4, I did, briefly consider a second S6, rather than a second S4. I’m so happy I went with the new S4, and after reading the many current model S6 posts here on AW, I’ve come to the conclusion that the only reason to get an S6 is if, for some reason, the plus-size of the S6 is required.
I decided to approach this from the perspective of Truth or Dare.
And, I’ve decided I’ll choose “truth!”
To wit: The latest S4 is a “better” car than the latest S6.
Here’s how I came to this conclusion.
I was thoroughly enjoying my leased 2014 S4, a Premium+ model with most of the option boxes checked so that it would virtually qualify the car to be considered a Prestige model. But, it was, after all, a lease – and all good leases come to an end. So, my thoughts were already headed down the path of thinking, “After the wonderful experience with this S4 is I’ll go ahead and get another S4; after all there is a new one coming to the US in early 2017, so the timing will work out.”
But, as I was having these thoughts it’s the summer of 2016, and as is our wont, my wife and I treat test-driving cars as a small-cost, big-fun Saturday afternoon activity usually culminating in dinner out where we discuss the vehicles driven du jour.
Audi S6 Prestige
On the menu for that particular summer of ’16 Saturday – for the second time – was the latest and greatest S6, in Prestige trim, no less. Let’s see if the S6 delivers. Let’s see if the S6 meets our expectations for a car costing perhaps $15,000 – or more – than an S4.
Getting behind the wheel of the S6, I immediately felt at home. Even the S6 Steering wheel was virtually identical to my S4’s flat bottomed affair. The analog dash, somewhat dated, looks (looked) expensive (I believe the phrase is “jewel-like”) and everything the driver can see and touch looks and feels as if no expense was spared. Although, it must be emphasized that the S6 – both inside and out – could be easily thought of as an Audi A6 from 2012. It looks handsome, but it also doesn’t look very young and it certainly doesn’t look, well, current (but, at this point, neither does my ’14 S4 which looks like my 2009 A4 and the then current – 2016 – S4’s.) The S6, handsome as it may be, looks (to be charitable) in need of a refresh, especially when sitting next to the 2017 A4’s and Q7’s on the showroom floor, both of which hint strongly at the look of the “coming soon” S4.
But, then again, fire up the turbo-charged V8 and – near silence – the only real assurance that anything is happening is that the tach needle isn’t resting at zero anymore, the V8 burble sounds as if it is coming from someplace further away than directly in front of the driver.
Sitting behind the wheel of the running S6 after hopping out of a not-too-old S4, the S6 seems huge. This car would look just right sitting on the semi-circular driveway fronting a 7 or 8,000 square foot house situated on 5 acres. This is no mere sports sedan, no – this automobile seems as if it actually should be called a “Saloon.”
But my impression that the S6 is a “giant-sized” car may well be nothing more than a function of having been in an S4 a minute or two earlier. Let’s drive this thing. The S6, lightly pressed into service, is so smooth, so almost eerily quiet it must be a hybrid running, on take-off, on purely and perfectly silent, electric motors. Are those bass notes actually coming from something close by?
Hello, is this thing really on?
OK, so I reach the entrance ramp to the six-lane interstate (I-275) that encircles Cincinnati. I press a bit harder on the accelerator and there is an immediate response of acceleration, but within a cocoon of isolation, so complete the sensation is something like having my whole head completely under water. The S6 is so deceptively quick, speed arrives almost more as an event that is reported to you via the car’s readouts rather than perceived by your senses. It is possible to feel the pressure of the very rapid acceleration the car is capable of, but only if you force the issue with your right foot. The thing is, the S6 is capable of very rapid acceleration episodes accompanied by very little drama; the S6 must have been designed with its first order of business being to isolate the driver and passengers so well as to almost guarantee that attaining triple-digit speeds is accomplished to give the impression that it is impervious to wind and road imperfections – perhaps it really is impervious, I have no data that would refute this notion. The S6 really is one of the few cars that can live up to the description: Stealthy. One-hundred miles per hour actually seems like a rational, perhaps everyday speed, the S6 drives and rides so sedately, so without drama. The air-suspension (when set to dynamic) and wide tires encourage cornering feats that somehow seem to suggest the S6 can literally scoff at the laws of physics. Truthfully, it can’t, of course, but the damn thing seems stickier than it really is, and perhaps perception is enough. Unlimited urge, of course, is not all there is; and, there are actually some glaring oversights, that are really quite possibly deal breakers – for some of us. What are they, you may wonder?
The Bose sound system seems horribly out of place in this car – to say something “nice” about it requires that I say “what were they thinking?” There is nothing high-end about it – I can’t imagine what the “standard” system must sound like and this Bose system almost makes me believe the optional system (at what, $6,000?) might actually be worth it. As James Comey once said, “Lordy.”
Driving along at the posted Interstate speed limit and then flooring the car for a long count of “one, two, three” almost guarantees you will be at double the posted speed limit should you care to glance at the digital (or analog) read out – if you dare.
One last positive note: Despite its overall girth, the S6 is (thanks, no doubt to the air-suspension) fairly nimble – and when things start to get out of hand, the result is pretty easily controllable under-steer which almost doesn’t matter considering how easily you’ll be able to use the engine’s prodigious power as you exit the curve you’re plowing through onto the next straightaway where you’re pretty much assured to be able to catch up and pass almost any less nose-heavy opponent. Absolute power corrupts absolutely? Absolutely.
Even having said all of these glowing things about the S6 (other than the crappy Bose system), the current (even as of now, June, 2017) S6 seemed/seems like it should have undergone a serious upgrade since its 2012 birth (initially as an A6) when it was first offered in the US. Yes, I liked the power, I liked the refinement, but I didn’t like the almost total lack of drama I was able to provoke even when I tried.
As my time with the S6 lengthened, it almost seemed like its purpose was to be a “hot-rod for the ol’ [well-heeled] man.” At $80,000+, it just seemed it ought to have felt and looked, uh, more like a current style garment rather than a Nehru jacket. If I needed the “real estate” of the S6, I would probably end up getting a maxed out A6 “performance” edition and not spend the extra on such a dated driver.
Although there will be a new A6/S6 generation – eventually – it is good, very good that we have the 2018 Audi S4 Prestige in the meantime.
Audi S4 Prestige
In Prestige trim – and being somewhat trimmer, in size, too – the new S4 can be (with certain of its selectable parameters set to “comfort”) also quite stealthy in its own right. Although initially the 2018 S4 seems less of an all-new design than its designation as a ‘B9’ would suggest, the ’18 S4 is more than a face lift – as you probably know, unless this is your first visit to Audiworld. Just in case you’re wondering (and chances are, you aren’t), the most serious upgrades to the A4/S4 have happened under-hood and in the cabin – I’m talking about the thing’s “avionics” of course.
Nevertheless, the B9 S4 looks every bit as upscale as the S6, having lost virtually all of the cues suggesting “I’m a small sporty design” looks of the B8 generation. The current S4, with its state-of-the-art tech and even more bespoke look than the aging S6, no longer looks like the “obviously” less well-heeled member of the family. That job is now left to the S4’s A3/S3/Q3 cousins. The new S4 is stunning, nothing about it, inside or out suggests “entry level” anything.
Fire it up – unless “provoked” the S4 Prestige, similar to the S6, sits in near silence until or unless “dynamic” is chosen for the engine/transmission and/or exhaust sound via the ADS. With its dual pane glass, the S4 pressed gently will seem to quietly glide from a stop to most any rational speed, and some that aren’t, with little drama – quite a bit like the S6, but with just enough urgency to let you know that it is not asleep and that it will not put you to sleep. Although the S6 will have most likely impressed you, the S4 will both impress and entertain you. The S4, unlike the S6, is not entirely drama free, that is – and that really is a welcome thing, a very good thing.
Let me be very clear, while the S4 can be made to remain relatively calm, it is also – with little provocation quite capable of showing you a good time – impressing and entertaining all the while – but not wearing you out.
Getting behind the wheel of the S6 impresses in the way that a Ralph Lauren Blazer impresses, but it’s like “old money,” perhaps with the emphasis on “old.” Getting into an S4, you’re not sure who the designer is, but you know it’s not Ralph Lauren or Burberry or Savile Row, perhaps it’s Prada, or a newcomer you’ve not heard of, but whatever it is, the S4’s virtual cockpit like a brand-new designer from Asia or Italy is unlikely to be like anything you’ve seen previously. Yet, the optional fine Napa leather diamond-stitched seats, like the ones in the S6 somehow manage to look of a current design and yet are both top-class and also look – especially in red or gray – sumptuous.
The S4’s flat-bottom steering wheel somehow with its less prominent hub has taken the look more contemporary and even pull off being sleeker. Without meaning to damn the S6, the S4 seems to present an inviting and simultaneously cool demeaner.
What I’m trying to say, is that the S4 looks fresh, new, while the S6 looks dated. It’s a big deal.
But, other than size, what does one get for an additional sum of $15,000 or more – is it simply performance? Well, yes, the S6 is perhaps up to a half-second quicker than the S4, which considering the sheer size of the S6 is no mean feat. The S6 can do the 0-60 deed in under 4 seconds. Of course, all current reviews of the new S4 claim Audi’s estimates are, well, pessimistic. It seems quite capable of being the marble launched by a weapon’s grade quality sling-shot.
On the same stretch of the northern loop of I-275, where I had previously driven the S6, pressing the S4’s accelerator to the floor – while traveling at the posted legal speed – provided virtually the same rush of speed as occurred with the S6. Virtually the same is not EXACTLY the same, however; the V8 in the S6 truly is a force of nature, besting even the awesome acceleration and accomplishment of double-digit speeds the S4 produces. Long live the S6’s V8.
So, despite the 2018 S4’s horsepower and torque improvements, the S6 is still likely to show the S4 its taillights when flying flat out in a run from 60 to 120MPH. But it’s not like the S6 shouldn’t at least check the rear-view mirror, because the increased power and lighter package to move means the S4 won’t likely lose sight of the S6 and if there are any curves ahead, the S4 will catch up while the S6 scrubs off speed, Too, the S4 will more than keep up with the S6 throughout the esses, and if the course taken has many curvy bits, the S4’s nimbleness will likely win the day or, at worst, be a formidable asset, allowing the S4 to keep up with the more powerful S6 V8.
Yet, the thing is, most of us don’t buy $60K, $70K or $80K cars to flog them insanely on public roads without regard to traffic, safety and law enforcement’s pursuit – indeed, we probably rarely, if ever, do this, and even if we’re tempted to try, we undoubtedly make damn sure we’re on a deserted road and almost certainly show more than a little restraint.
So, what makes the S4 – today – the better car when compared to the S6?
Unless you absolutely need to chauffer rear-seat passengers taller than 6’ for long periods of time, the ’18 S4 is, simply, more. More modern, more capable overall – specifically in terms of performance, efficiency, technology and safety – the S4 is a modern sports sedan. The S6, on the other hand has passed its prime; perhaps a more complete description is to say that the S6 when it was first brought to market is where the S4 is today – the current state of the art in Audi’s lineup. The new S4 is capable of a degree and level of elegance no previous S4 was ever able to achieve. Today’s S4 has a better, more sorted out, chassis than the S6, of course (but there is a new A6/S6 coming). At this price point the S6’s Bose (no highs, no lows) audio system should be able to be almost taken for granted as “among the best.” Not even close. But, the B&O sound system in the S4 is a thing of aural beauty – without spending thousands and thousands more on the S6’s own implementation of B&O.
Everything – unless you NEED the size, width, girth and the weight of the S6 – is in better balance with the ’18 S4 Prestige. However, due in large part to its size, the current S6 does have a certain gravitas, especially in the darker hues. But once you get behind the wheel, you realize the S6 is due, perhaps overdue, for modernization.
Get an S4 Prestige, save yourself $15,000+ and drive one of the most impressive and always entertaining sports sedans ever created (at this price point) – it’s worth the price of entry (about $61,000 nicely equipped) into an almost new class of car, the contemporary sport sedan.
This car makes me wonder if an RS 4 sedan would gain in performance and poise but lose something of its refinement in the process.
Beats me, but I’d sure be willing to test-drive one of them.
I dare you to compare these two for yourself.
Last edited by markcincinnati; 06-28-2017 at 05:28 AM.
06-28-2017, 08:24 AM
#2
AudiWorld Senior Member
Haven't driven an A6 or S6 as I had no interest in a car that large so didn't bother, but I don't disagree just on my showroom drivers seat impressions alone. That said, it is in my experience both normal and common for the outgoing model of the "better" car to be trumped in many (sometimes almost all) ways by the completely-redesigned "lesser" car.
Two examples:
Anyway, guess what I'm saying is when the S6 is redesigned in the next couple of years you can bet your hat it will murder the B9 S4 in all departments, but we early adopters get to enjoy this lame duck period in the meantime. Enjoy it while it lasts!
Two examples:
- A lot of prospective S4 buyers just a year or two ago pulled the trigger on the [then] just-introduced S3 because the tech / new MMI system of that car was so much better than the outgoing B8.5 S4, and the S3 was also faster. Obviously that "flip" has "flopped," and even prospective RS3 buyers are flocking to S4 for its bountiful levels of refinement and tech.
- Even over in the Honda brand, the then-newest, at-the-time-recently-redesigned Civic was in almost all ways better than the outgoing Accord in terms of interior quality, looks, and refinement. I received one as a service loaner for several days while my low mileage and fully-optioned Accord EX-L V6 was in for warranty service a few years back, and I remember being surprised that literally the only thing my Accord had on the Civic was power. The Accord redesign launched some 12-18 months later and regained the throne.
Anyway, guess what I'm saying is when the S6 is redesigned in the next couple of years you can bet your hat it will murder the B9 S4 in all departments, but we early adopters get to enjoy this lame duck period in the meantime. Enjoy it while it lasts!
06-28-2017, 08:44 AM
#3
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Well written indeed!
Truly enjoyed reading your review.
Car and Driver or Mototrend should consider your literary assets .
I agree as my wife is going from BMW 335i to Audi S4 and we discussed either S6 or 540i.
All the same points were covered .
I appreciate your efforts.
Truly enjoyed reading your review.
Car and Driver or Mototrend should consider your literary assets .
I agree as my wife is going from BMW 335i to Audi S4 and we discussed either S6 or 540i.
All the same points were covered .
I appreciate your efforts.
06-28-2017, 02:49 PM
#4
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I tested an S6 and here are my thoughts:
1. You have too much times on your hands.
2. I think the S6 is very elegant. I don't feel that way about the S4. It's doesn't do enough to distinguish itself from the run of the mill Japanese sedan. At least on the exterior.
3. There are a couple of interior upgrades available on the S6 that make the interior more elegant than the S4.
4. That V8 is just amazing, though it is more like an event and the sound is dull.
5. The S6 has a pop up screen. The S4 has a tacky ipad glued to the dash. That was almost a killer for me, but all I can say is, "everyone's doing it now, oh well".
6. Audi underrates the power on all models, so does BMW and MB. They may be faster than what Audi quotes, but comparable to other models.
7. The S6 felt very nimble for it's size, couldn't tell much difference between the S4.
8. I like the S6 better and the days of any V8's are about over, but it isn't worth $17k more, the way I would option them.
1. You have too much times on your hands.
2. I think the S6 is very elegant. I don't feel that way about the S4. It's doesn't do enough to distinguish itself from the run of the mill Japanese sedan. At least on the exterior.
3. There are a couple of interior upgrades available on the S6 that make the interior more elegant than the S4.
4. That V8 is just amazing, though it is more like an event and the sound is dull.
5. The S6 has a pop up screen. The S4 has a tacky ipad glued to the dash. That was almost a killer for me, but all I can say is, "everyone's doing it now, oh well".
6. Audi underrates the power on all models, so does BMW and MB. They may be faster than what Audi quotes, but comparable to other models.
7. The S6 felt very nimble for it's size, couldn't tell much difference between the S4.
8. I like the S6 better and the days of any V8's are about over, but it isn't worth $17k more, the way I would option them.
06-28-2017, 05:33 PM
#5
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Sam, I agree with you regarding the pop-up screen. I had a 2005 A6, 2009 A4 and 2014 S4 and 2014 SQ5 -- they all had the screens built-in to the dash. We tested a Macaan and although we thought it was an expensive SQ5, we did like the built-in screen.
The dealer said that the reason for the stuck on screen had to do with (German or American or Chinese -- I'd assume not Chinese, however) safety regulations that require the rear view camera to be available, apparently in a shorter period of time than the mechanism can present the screen.
I almost -- but what was my choice -- thought I'd pass on the stick on iPad look (but what the heck, BMW and Mercedes do it too and god knows Audi wouldn't want to depart from that [but I still wonder why Porsche bucked the trend?]).
I have a 15-year old Sheltie who has no gall bladder and only has about 70% of his teeth -- he seems fine (with my wife and me), but he won't eat or even pee unless either my wife or I happen to at home. So, I get home from the office around 6 or 7 and after dinner (which I cook at least a couple of days per week), I sit in front of the TV while I await on our dog to eat his dinner so that I can give him his liver pill, his anti-biotics, his analgesics, his apoquel and for good measure doggie valium and gabapenten (which, coincidentally, I also take for post-shingles pain from my bout with shingles in 2011.)
So, yeah, I have several hours per night where I'm baby sitting the little boy (Sammy T. Dog) and, posting here on AudiWorld. Too much time? I look at it as I have too LITTLE time.
- I agree the S6 is very elegant (but dated), I said as much. We differ on our feelings of the S4, but I looked and tested the Lexus competition for the S4, which, at this time is still the IS. The S4 has a much better interior than the Japanese competition (from Acura, Infiniti and Lexus). Although this happens to be my opinion and you have yours, I'm in good company at least insofar as concerns those who actually get paid to wax on and on about cars (the folks from Automobile, Car and Driver, Motor Trend and Road and Track -- and while I'm at it Consumer Reports, which I do not consider represent automotive journalists.)
The S6 V8 is, as I stated a force of nature.
Yes, the S6 FEELS quite nimble -- but the suffix must be "for its size," the current iteration of the S4 can "carve" much better, this one is not subjective.
We both agree overwhelmingly, the S6 as you say at $17K more, isn't worth it.
Ergo, the current S4 is "better" than the current S6.
Gotto go, time for the dog's pills.
The dealer said that the reason for the stuck on screen had to do with (German or American or Chinese -- I'd assume not Chinese, however) safety regulations that require the rear view camera to be available, apparently in a shorter period of time than the mechanism can present the screen.
I almost -- but what was my choice -- thought I'd pass on the stick on iPad look (but what the heck, BMW and Mercedes do it too and god knows Audi wouldn't want to depart from that [but I still wonder why Porsche bucked the trend?]).
I have a 15-year old Sheltie who has no gall bladder and only has about 70% of his teeth -- he seems fine (with my wife and me), but he won't eat or even pee unless either my wife or I happen to at home. So, I get home from the office around 6 or 7 and after dinner (which I cook at least a couple of days per week), I sit in front of the TV while I await on our dog to eat his dinner so that I can give him his liver pill, his anti-biotics, his analgesics, his apoquel and for good measure doggie valium and gabapenten (which, coincidentally, I also take for post-shingles pain from my bout with shingles in 2011.)
So, yeah, I have several hours per night where I'm baby sitting the little boy (Sammy T. Dog) and, posting here on AudiWorld. Too much time? I look at it as I have too LITTLE time.
- I agree the S6 is very elegant (but dated), I said as much. We differ on our feelings of the S4, but I looked and tested the Lexus competition for the S4, which, at this time is still the IS. The S4 has a much better interior than the Japanese competition (from Acura, Infiniti and Lexus). Although this happens to be my opinion and you have yours, I'm in good company at least insofar as concerns those who actually get paid to wax on and on about cars (the folks from Automobile, Car and Driver, Motor Trend and Road and Track -- and while I'm at it Consumer Reports, which I do not consider represent automotive journalists.)
The S6 V8 is, as I stated a force of nature.
Yes, the S6 FEELS quite nimble -- but the suffix must be "for its size," the current iteration of the S4 can "carve" much better, this one is not subjective.
We both agree overwhelmingly, the S6 as you say at $17K more, isn't worth it.
Ergo, the current S4 is "better" than the current S6.
Gotto go, time for the dog's pills.
Last edited by markcincinnati; 06-28-2017 at 06:10 PM.
06-28-2017, 08:02 PM
#6
AudiWorld Senior Member
Thanks for your insight...
Having owned a brace of S-cars and considering and S6/S4/RS5 as replacements for my B8 RS5, I have just a couple of additional reflections. Two endearing values to me of the S6 are that it 1) retains the 7-Speed DSG transmission and 2) has the full time Quattro system - not the new system that is mostly FWD. Both older systems were abandoned in favor of 1) smooth take up from start and 2) improved fuel mileage. However, performance and feel suffer. Perhaps its my age, but I also dislike the virtual cockpit of the B9 brethren. Real gauges have a real sweep plus shadow and momentum. The virtual cockpit is very un-nerving to me. I could get used to it. The steering in the S6 and B9 S4 leave so much to be desired compared to the B8 S4 and RS5. It really is discouraging. The aural delight of the S6 V8 is not even distantly replicated by any of the B9 clan.
I have twice driven the F80 M3 with the Competition Package and it is quite a successful integration. The steering feel is mostly there, although it too suffers from isolation.
All of the above cars are extraordinary, so there is no bad choice... just diminishing human contact with the act of driving. Drive by wire throttle, electronic steering and soon (according to VW), electronic by-wire braking systems.
I have twice driven the F80 M3 with the Competition Package and it is quite a successful integration. The steering feel is mostly there, although it too suffers from isolation.
All of the above cars are extraordinary, so there is no bad choice... just diminishing human contact with the act of driving. Drive by wire throttle, electronic steering and soon (according to VW), electronic by-wire braking systems.
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06-29-2017, 04:12 AM
#8
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Point of clarification/correction: The B9 S4 does NOT employ Ultra-Quattro. Rather, the latest and greatest S4 relies on the good ol' mechanical TorSen system, center diff and all intact.
Torque split is 40: F, 60: R and retains the ability to apportion torque front to rear, etc. as needed. There is no lag, the mechanical diff "binds in real time." However quick Ultra quattro's brain may be, it still has a very small amount of delay whilst the rear end is brought on-line.
I was at the Audi store, the other day, and a prospect came in from test driving a new S5, and he said he had come from test driving a BMW and that the BMW rep was pointing out that the Audi was no longer "real time" binding quattro and that the BMW X-drive had a new electronic system that had reduced latency to [virtually] zero.
With respect to the S5 vs 4-series X-drive, the salesrep had it backwards. I added the word virtually, because I assumed the BMW rep had made the claim thusly. The Audi rep did not argue with the prospect, saying instead that he would look up the specs of the current mechanical quattro system (used by the S4) and the literature on the electronic engagement favored by BMW.
Afterwords, the rep and I wondered if the BMW rep was referring to Ultra quattro which does have some latency (as does the BMW system). What we wondered was which one of the two systems Ultra or X had the greatest latency; regardless TorSen is the system that was designed by Gleason to "bind in REAL time," and nothing that Audi has done (in the S4, S5, S6, S7, S8, etc.) has undone that.
http://ridingmode.com/torsen-differe..._medium=mech01
Torque split is 40: F, 60: R and retains the ability to apportion torque front to rear, etc. as needed. There is no lag, the mechanical diff "binds in real time." However quick Ultra quattro's brain may be, it still has a very small amount of delay whilst the rear end is brought on-line.
I was at the Audi store, the other day, and a prospect came in from test driving a new S5, and he said he had come from test driving a BMW and that the BMW rep was pointing out that the Audi was no longer "real time" binding quattro and that the BMW X-drive had a new electronic system that had reduced latency to [virtually] zero.
With respect to the S5 vs 4-series X-drive, the salesrep had it backwards. I added the word virtually, because I assumed the BMW rep had made the claim thusly. The Audi rep did not argue with the prospect, saying instead that he would look up the specs of the current mechanical quattro system (used by the S4) and the literature on the electronic engagement favored by BMW.
Afterwords, the rep and I wondered if the BMW rep was referring to Ultra quattro which does have some latency (as does the BMW system). What we wondered was which one of the two systems Ultra or X had the greatest latency; regardless TorSen is the system that was designed by Gleason to "bind in REAL time," and nothing that Audi has done (in the S4, S5, S6, S7, S8, etc.) has undone that.
http://ridingmode.com/torsen-differe..._medium=mech01
Last edited by markcincinnati; 06-29-2017 at 05:33 AM.
06-29-2017, 04:19 AM
#9
AudiWorld Member
Two endearing values to me of the S6 are that it 1) retains the 7-Speed DSG transmission and 2) has the full time Quattro system - not the new system that is mostly FWD. Both older systems were abandoned in favor of 1) smooth take up from start and 2) improved fuel mileage. However, performance and feel suffer.
The only cars using the FWD-biased "Ultra" Quattro system are the Allroad and the Q5.
As for the A4, someone else will have to enlighten us on what is going on there. It is rather difficult to confirm exactly what is meant by 'ultra' when it comes to the A4, since it appears to be how they distinguish the system used for manual-transmission equipped cars... but the description only says 'FWD.' So... not Quattro with ultra? Or are they calling the engine 'ultra?' The waters have been muddied. No manuals with ultra on the prestige models. Honestly I haven't paid much attention to the A4 since all I have cared about from the start is the S4.
***edit: Lol, leave it to Mark to beat me to it whilst typing a response.
Last edited by dbuxton13; 06-29-2017 at 04:30 AM.
06-29-2017, 05:48 AM
#10
AudiWorld Super User
I understand what the OP is talking about. I've got the non-S cars (A4 and A7) and I've driven both the S4 and S6. Like the others said, the V8 in the S6 is beautiful and extremely quick. The V6 in the S4 is good and very quick too. But the S4 feels better to drive because it is smaller.
My A4 gets a whole lotta love more than my A7! That's how good the new platform is.
And regarding the fixed screen on the dashboard. I'm still shocked at how people dislike it! I don't mind the fixed screen one bit and most of my friends don't either! I believe it is non-A/S/Q 4/5 owners who have a problem with the "fixed" display. Most owners are more than happy with the fixed screen. Also, my sales guy told me the exact same reason mark's did as to why the new A4 came with the fixed screen (which then also made me wonder why the A/S3 gets the foldable screen still).
My A4 gets a whole lotta love more than my A7! That's how good the new platform is.
And regarding the fixed screen on the dashboard. I'm still shocked at how people dislike it! I don't mind the fixed screen one bit and most of my friends don't either! I believe it is non-A/S/Q 4/5 owners who have a problem with the "fixed" display. Most owners are more than happy with the fixed screen. Also, my sales guy told me the exact same reason mark's did as to why the new A4 came with the fixed screen (which then also made me wonder why the A/S3 gets the foldable screen still).