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-   -   Driving/Install notes from the new 8.5 inch twin ceramic disc Clutchmasters FX750 clutch (Part 1) (https://www.audiworld.com/forums/s4-rs4-b5-platform-discussion-6/driving-install-notes-new-8-5-inch-twin-ceramic-disc-clutchmasters-fx750-clutch-part-1-a-1638068/)

Jason Trumpio 03-07-2009 08:22 AM

Driving/Install notes from the new 8.5 inch twin ceramic disc Clutchmasters FX750 clutch (Part 1)
 
Women, girly men, little boys, and RS4 parts nutswingers, please stay away. This clutch was designed by manly men, for manly men who are tired of turning torque into broken overpriced OEM parts.

After dealing with my last RS4 pressure plate failure, I decided to stop being cheap and actually invest in a clutch properly designed for my application.

I selected the Clutchmasters on the following criteria:

1) I am getting too old to be working on cars and bench pressing heavy and greasy transmissions into place. I need something that won't turn inside out, blow a hole in my bellhousing, and cause me to destroy second gear.

2) I am tired of the RS4 pressure plate. It's junk.

3) I need a clutch that will put the power to the ground and move my heavy car without slipping.

4) I need a clutch that is rebuildable.


A little background here - my car is a PJK04 car. The RS4 pressure plate was about 2 years old when it failed. It broke apart in first gear at WOT. At the time the failure mode was a mystery and the clutch did not disengage entirely, causing me to roast second gear.

So, I drove the car around for another 2000 miles with this broken pressure plate being locked out of 1/2 on occasion.

Upon disassembly, the rivets which secure the torque straps which float the pressure plate inside the housing, failed. There was also a nice hole in the bellhousing.

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/album81/IMG_5742.sized.jpg">

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<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/01ERebuild/IMG_0057.sized.jpg">

Now, here is what a normal RS4 pressure plate torque strap looks like:

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/01ERebuild/IMG_0050.sized.jpg">

here is what my straps looked like:

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/01ERebuild/IMG_0040.sized.jpg">

You can even see how the floating locating dowels were elongating the locating holes, indicating that the single shear rivet on the pressure plate housing side is what failed first.

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/01ERebuild/IMG_0055.sized.jpg">



With that said, I'm sure there are a lot of RS4 purists/zealots out there, who have never actually installed a clutch (read: armchair mechanics/engineers), who will blame installation "error" like in the last thread. The fact is, engineers struggle to design these straps. They take a tremendous load, and on heavy decel loads, can buckle. It is most likely a material issue with the rivets in my case, but this post isn't about analyzing the failure mode.

The clutchmasters clutch, in twin plate ceramic form, is AWESOME.

I purchased mine from Alex @ VAG. Great dude who was just as excited about this clutch as I was.

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Jason Trumpio 03-07-2009 08:23 AM

Part 2: Installation Notes and Driving Impressions, etc
 
Installation notes:

First, check the pilot bearing fitment on your input shaft. The pilot bearing is a standard shelf bearing(6202RS) and the one I received was ground slightly undersized. I replaced the bearing and all was good.

Secondly, check the bolts you received. The bolts clutchmasters shipped me were incorrect and bottomed out in the flywheel. I was able to locate bolts made by ARP for a Ford 2 liter pinto. Part number is 151-2801 and available from Summit for around $14 per pack. You will need 2 packs.

Here you can see the bolts clutchmaster supplied:

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/MiscRefresh/IMG_5900.sized.jpg">

Here are stock stretch bolts in my ECS LWFW:

<IMG SRC="http://gallery.trumpio.com/albums/MiscRefresh/IMG_5901.sized.jpg">

Third, use blue loctite on your crank bolts.

These are not stretch bolts, and should be torqued to 58-60ft/lbs, in 3 passes, with a star pattern. They are M10x1x30 grade 10.9 bolts.

The pressure plate bolts are to receive blue loctite as well, and are to be torqued to 22-24ft/lbs.


Driving impressions:

This is not a clutch to daily drive in stop and go traffic. Perhaps the kevlar version is. I am not entirely sure. You can bank on the following:

It requires substantially more pedal effort than a stock clutch. You can still push the pedal down with your hand, as a point of reference.

Initially it will be an on-off switch. It will not forgive you. You will either stall, or burn rubber. The end.

After about 500 miles, there will be about 1/16th of an inch of friction modulation in the pedal, all at nearly the upper most of the pedal. You will learn, after driving, that revving is not an option, but you should instead learn the point at which the clutch starts to drag, bring the revs up to about 1200, and then slowly release the clutch to get moving. Otherwise the clutch will grab, and the car will jerk, causing you to drop the clutch.

At first you will be irritated, think all hope is lost, and then suddenly it will all make sense.

When declutched, the center friction plate is going to rattle. It will sound like a ducati clutch. (Or a broken RS4 pressure plate ;)

The clutch squeals when you release it. It is embarassing.

You will experience substantial gear noise at low RPM under load. This is normal. Remember, the discs are not sprung, the pilot bearing is solid, and the aluminum flywheel will amplify any noise.

Now the part you've been waiting for:

Launching.

Oh, sweet glorious clutch, how I love thee. It holds. It holds, and it holds. There is no compromise or monkey business here. You can beat on this clutch like there is no tomorrow. You will eat tires like Oprah eats cupcakes. It is an addiction.

With that said, I am going to go shoot some quick video of the declutched noise.

Flame away!

Audeye A6 03-07-2009 08:36 AM

Sounds awesome...I'm glad I don't have one...Unless this was a weekend or a show car I would be
 
very annoyed. I love to drive and this sounds like a track car now. I am stating what keeps "me" enthused as an enthusiast only. It it pretty bad ass looking as well. Enjoy!

DxC 03-07-2009 08:46 AM

how much?

Jason Trumpio 03-07-2009 08:51 AM

Indeed. This is a weekend toy for me really, with occasional track duty
 
It definitely has its own unique driving style requirements. I got in my turbo jetta for the first time this week and stalled backing out of my driveway, lol

Ari-TwinT3 03-07-2009 09:17 AM

"Women, girly men, little boys, and ..., please stay away." - Dude you got the blue rib
 
that is for girls :)
Know about the the white one ?
just messing around.. well ? :-P

Jason Trumpio 03-07-2009 09:28 AM

Video of noises
 
Sorry... no launch videos until I get my overboost/ping issues resolved with Mark.



The HD version is apparently still processing.<ul><li><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11xaYA86h-o">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11xaYA86h-o</a</li></ul>

Wrinkledpants 03-07-2009 09:56 AM

Wow that is an annoying sound. Sounds like a great clutch for a weekend/track car.

Ari-TwinT3 03-07-2009 10:04 AM

Dude.. you are pressing it in too far... need a clucth stop or foot adjustment...
 
I had similar issues... if you keep on doing that .. matter of time before -you start busting slaves...

krypt0 03-07-2009 10:46 AM

lol @ drunk ant


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