Brent

First off, so far, so good. The dealership (Laurel motors) was great...they treated me like a king yet I still felt like I was talking to a group of real "car guys." It is nice to be able to hold an intelligent conversation about performance tires with a dealer service manager. This guy has AutoX experience and everything.

I was completely unaware that you are supposed to let a turbo engine "spin down" for a minute before shutting them off after some hard driving. I actually didn't believe the guy who was doing my delivery presentation at first, but a quick call to a friend who drives a twin-turbo Ruf car cleared that up. If the guy who builds the Ruf engines recommends a two minute "spin down," that is good enough for me! The dealership guy said it had to do with the oil sump stopping oil delivery while the turbos are still spinning. I am guessing this could affect the bearings, and probably ultimately raise your boost RPM if not tended to. But that is just my guess.

Anyway - impressions...Wow.

After driving M3's for the past 4 years, only one time did I dragrace one on public highways (not a result of any self-control, simply a lack of encounters in a good, safe environment) This morning, first ride to work in the S4, what comes buzzing up behind me on a wide open road..? A black '95 M3. This time, self control did step up to the plate, as the odometer was just clicking past 150 miles (yes, that is 120 more than it had yesterday at 2:00pm.) A friendly wave was exchanged, and he layed into it and disappeared over the horizon. Once I'm past breakin, I'll probably never see an M3 again on an open & clear highway...figures...

Anyway - on to the impressions. I have not explored -any- limits of the car, so I have little to say beyond the basics.

It corners like it is on rails. The turn in is almost abrupt compared to an M3, which says a lot. The brakes were initially very high and extremely touchy compared to the M3...but either they softened up a bit, or I simply adjusted to them quickly. It feels like heel&toe would be possible under heavy braking, haven't tried.

The power feels great. It is perfectly drivable, and easy to maintain a constant speed. (As opposed to an M3's rubber-band feeling, where you're either accelerating or decelerating, but never quite cruising along at a constant speed.) None of the gear whine of the M3.

The stick is smooth. I like it a lot more than the M3, no problem finding any gears, no problem with the length of the throws. I was afraid of the "overboosted" steering I kept hearing about. It is a little isolated from the front tires, but there is a strong self-centering feel to it..I wouldn't consider this to be overboosted (as opposed to an A6, for example, where you can turn the wheel with your pinky...the S4 would take a pretty beefy pinky to turn it lock to lock.)

Front brakes look awesome, rear brakes look kind of small inside those wheels..The dash is very cool looking at night...with big lit up needles in the tach and the speedo.

It feels good going along in 6th, giving it a little gas for that 1 mph adjustment, and then giving it just an ounce more just to tweak the turbos and get a shove into the seat. It really feels like this engine can be "used" below 3000 RPM, even near 2000 RPM...a territory that you simply didn't consider using on an M3's tach.

Well, without having visited a track, autoX, or even spooling the turbos all of the way up, that is about the extent of what I can say.

I don't know if Laurel has any cars available, but they really hooked me up (...literally... they transplanted my hardwired Valentine 1 from the old car into the S4 on the spot during delivery ) They are certainly worth checking out too.

I am interested in any comments, especially about the turbo-spin down. Regardless of what anyone else says, I'm doing it. I trust the dealership, and even if I didn't, I definately trust the word of a guy who builds major $$ Ruf & custom engines.

This message was not flame-bait for M3 drivers. Please don't get me wrong, I absolutely love that car...Initially I tried to get a stripper M3 to keep it lighter...add a wife to the equation and suddenly I perceive the power passenger seat to be "nice" instead of "added weight."

One last question...the manual says the first oil change is at 8000 miles?! One of the guys at the dealership told me the cars are simply filled with good 'ol Quaker State, the same stuff in their own oil guns. Anybody else thinking about switching to Mobil 1 Synthetic at, say, 1500 miles?

Brent

ErikR

For a change the dealers are right on this one. Let it cool down for a minute (the manual is your friend, when in doubt). I don't know about the change intervals (most REAL data say that short intervals are just a waste of money), but forget the dino oil. Go synthetic in a turbo (and give me the name of anyone who claims otherwise), very cheap insurance. I would wait 8k to 10k before putting it in to let the engine break in properly.

Corey S

I like what you have to say about the car. You may have noticed me screaming for mine a few posts below. :-) All that you, and all the other owners, say about this car is encouraging. I'm the kinda guy where stock isn't good enough, though. I will definitely be putting an aggressive suspension system on the car, 18" wheels, and high perf tires. Soon after that will come the chip and exhaust.

Anyway, my theory on turbo "spin-down" (I've been driving a chipped 97 1.8tqm for 2.5 years) is that if you were driving the car hard within a mile or two of parking it, then let it idle for about a minute before shutting down. If you were taking it easy during the last 5 miles or so, then only 5 to 10 seconds might be necessary. Again, this is the practice I use, I'm not necessarily an expert. However, I have had zero engine problems with any vehicle I've ever owned (car, truck, atvs, motorcycles). Generally, no matter far I've driven, or how hard I've driven, I try to drive leisurely for the last 2 or 3 miles so that the turbo is not overworked right before shutdown. This also allows me to use a shorter "spin-down" every time I park. Mine are usually 10 to 30 seconds.

About changing to synthetic....again, I'm no expert. But, my practice is to use whatever oil is in the vehicle until the first recommended service. At that time, switch to your favorite synthetic oil, and NEVER GO BACK. I ran the standard oil in my 1.8T up to the first service at 7,500 miles, then switched to Mobil 1 Syn 15w-50. I've used that since.

I will also be using this practice on my S4.

Corey S
Wett 97 1.8tqm (leaving me tomorrow)
'00 S4 coming soon

Sandy

I'm a fan of synthetic also. It's tough to know if the anecdotal success stories represent true science but it seems to be a small price to pay.

I am curious about the mention several times on this forum as to how important it is to keep the original oil in for as long as the manual says, in order to avoid burning oil, etc. down the line. This may very well be true, but I don't understand the rationale. I've looked at the oil that comes out of a car at the initial oil change. It's got little bits of metal, etc. in it. I would think that driving with this oil in would be like rubbing sandpaper through your engine (coarse, not fine).

I'd think the best break-in regimen (should it be possible) would be to change your oil every 1000 miles or so (every 500??). What's the flaw in this reasoning?

Sandy

Jeff R.

that turned on when the engine was shut off. The article in Audi Driver about the 2.7T engine state something about it. I know the A4 1.8T does not have one so you need to let it idle for 2 minutes after hard driving. The S4 might be alright. If you chip it then I would let it idle but stock it might be ok.

I would read the owners manual and if it does not state to let it idle then you might be fine. The 1.8T manual says to let it idle.

Jeff R.

MikeP

I believe the article about the special break-in oil. It's good reading.

MikeP
99 1.8t Tip/Sport/Bose/Wett-for sale

P2

Just in case you want to sell them....drop me a line....I can't imagine you not putting on those huge Pultechs from your current car to your S4.

P2....98.5 2.8QMS.....no S4 in my future yet, but do love those wheels!!

ErikR

The "special break-in oil," FAQ or not, is still wild conjecture. I have heard the two conflicting stories from Audi too. It's irrelevant.

What we know for a fact is that it is dino oil. Audi does not share P's and callaway/Corvette belief in synthetics from the factory in the motor oil (some trans, yes). If you leave the oil in it will allow a controlled wear on the parts due to normal use and some wear at the very end of the oil service life 4-10k. Synthetic is very slippery, so slippery that break-in may not happen, or happen very slowly. This means the rings and the bearings don't seat, and you burn oil.

The same problem happens if you change the dino oil frequently, it stays at full spec. and you get minor wear. (yes dino is ok, if you never drive hard, live in the hot or cold parts of the US, loan your car to someone who doesn't know about cooldown, etc.)

I certainly hope you don't see actual metal bits in your oil. You will see a black metal paste (magnetic). The heavy stuff settles in the pan and won't be sucked up by the intake and the fine stuff will be trapped in the filter. There is a nominal small particle size that can get past the filter-but the numbers show it has no measurable impact on wear.

I have found actual metal chips/flakes in damaged engines and some rebuilt motors. I had none in my Audi.

Sander

The break-in oil is not unique to the S4, the A4 has it as well. The rationale is that the rings in this engine are so hard that they would not properly wear in if there is not enough friction in the engine. After the indicated number of miles I'd recommend Mobil-1 synthetic oil. In the Eclipse turbo crowd this is the preferred oil because it has a higher burning point then dino. It protects your engine and turbo more after shutdown.

With regards to the spool down, it's pretty simple. If you have driven the car hard, let it idle for a minute or two before shutting down. If you just came of the freeway, do the same. If you casually drive through the neighboorhood to get home (you shouldn't race there anyway) you can simply turn it off.

Two purposes for spooldown:

1- prevent the turbo from spinning without oil pressure. There is probably not a real bearing in this turbo (correct me please here) but an oil film instead. Pretty standard stuff.

2- prevent heat soak from burning oil in the turbo and passages leading to it. This could eventually block oil flow, causing a failure. This happened on Merkur XR4Tis sometimes.

If you can't wait to get out the car, consider a turbo timer.

Regards,

Sander

Paul F

I can definitely confirm that there is no bearing in the S4 turbos. I saw a cutaway version of the S4 engine on display at the Franfurt motor show.

Paul F