S4 Resale Comparison ... Trying to put to rest this issue of perceived poor resale value!
10-31-2003, 07:59 AM
#1
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S4 Resale Comparison ... Trying to put to rest this issue of perceived poor resale value!
This is unscientific and high-level. However, I was cross-shopping a new 2001 BMW 330Ci Coupe when I purchased my 2001 S4 Avant. I actually had a deposit on a Topaz Blue example, well equipped with Sport, Premium, 5-spd, xenons, HK and more. It would have been $43k(ish) MSRP. My Avant, by comparison, was $43,775 MSRP.
As of today -- with a sample base of 324 ads (listing price) from AutoTrader.com, with no location parameters (ie nationwide) and excluding Convertible models -- the 2001 330Ci (Coupe) provides the following resale values:
High: $39,990
Low: $22,988
Avg: $30,542
On a base of 224 ads meeting the same criteria, the 2001 S4 (sedan and avant) yields these figures:
High: $39,995
Low: $13,900
Avg: $30,898
I actually had to scrub the S4 data a bit, since initial query results found a High of $62,000 and a few examples over $45,000, resulting in an Average Price of $31,034. I therefore capped the search criteria at a max price of $45k.
Based on this quick-and-dirty, S4 resale is doing no better or worse than a compartively priced BMW of the same model year.
Feel free to do your own comparisons using vehicles you considered when deiciding between the S4 and others.
<img src="http://www.sigfactory.com/host/s4anogaro.gif">
As of today -- with a sample base of 324 ads (listing price) from AutoTrader.com, with no location parameters (ie nationwide) and excluding Convertible models -- the 2001 330Ci (Coupe) provides the following resale values:
High: $39,990
Low: $22,988
Avg: $30,542
On a base of 224 ads meeting the same criteria, the 2001 S4 (sedan and avant) yields these figures:
High: $39,995
Low: $13,900
Avg: $30,898
I actually had to scrub the S4 data a bit, since initial query results found a High of $62,000 and a few examples over $45,000, resulting in an Average Price of $31,034. I therefore capped the search criteria at a max price of $45k.
Based on this quick-and-dirty, S4 resale is doing no better or worse than a compartively priced BMW of the same model year.
Feel free to do your own comparisons using vehicles you considered when deiciding between the S4 and others.
<img src="http://www.sigfactory.com/host/s4anogaro.gif">
10-31-2003, 08:38 AM
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But, there is a perceived level of poor resale value by the car selling for 20k or under... this---
this than makes the buyer cautious of any car which appears to be on the higher side of the scale, and then you have sellers who give into this pressure and lower there cars.... ultimatly selling the cars for much cheaper than they had originallay asked... sellers who don't do this (pearl2k) end up sitting on there cars for 3-4 mos.
those prices are just asking figueres, not final sale prices...
those prices are just asking figueres, not final sale prices...
10-31-2003, 08:39 AM
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I agree. I don't think it's as bad as people claim...(more)
There are plenty of factors such as quick e-bay sales which are scaring us all. Those sales don't reflect the real market value.
I lost less than $2k in value on the A4 I owned prior to the S4 during 2 years and 25k of driving.
I lost less than $2k in value on the A4 I owned prior to the S4 during 2 years and 25k of driving.
10-31-2003, 08:44 AM
#6
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I think the "problem" is fueled by the number of bargain buy posts vs. those who bought at ...
... something more representative of true market value. Just like you often here 10x more complaints of a product or service than you do positive comments, I think we tend to see (or focus on) only those super cheap listings or threads by people who scored great -i.e., non-representative - deals.
And I agree with your last line about the data being asking prices versus actual sell prices ... but it's just a relative comparison and shows the values are inline with [asking] prices of a comparable vehicle.
And I agree with your last line about the data being asking prices versus actual sell prices ... but it's just a relative comparison and shows the values are inline with [asking] prices of a comparable vehicle.
10-31-2003, 08:49 AM
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I (and the woman) am in the market for an S4 (keeping the current A4) ...(longish)
What I've found as far as resale values is that people like myself perceive the 2.7T engine as a liability. Stories of blown turbos, other reliability issues, etc kill the perception of value.
In addition, it's difficult to locate an S4 with an existing warranty (or more than just a few thousand remaining miles on the factory one).
Warranty costs are also exceptionally high, for an aftermarket one that covers turbos- Further lowering the perception of value.
In any case, I would buy an S4 with new turbos at the right price. For me, "right" means including the price of a warranty. Of course, I'd much rather buy from someone who I know has maintained the car rigorously...but then, how do you know it wasn't beat on? It's a tough call, and for me the car has to be cost effective. I've got two salaries to work with, but with a mortgage, insurance, etc, it's tougher and tougher to see an S4 not as a liabilty.
I'd love to hear the comments of current S4 owners on this.
Matt
In addition, it's difficult to locate an S4 with an existing warranty (or more than just a few thousand remaining miles on the factory one).
Warranty costs are also exceptionally high, for an aftermarket one that covers turbos- Further lowering the perception of value.
In any case, I would buy an S4 with new turbos at the right price. For me, "right" means including the price of a warranty. Of course, I'd much rather buy from someone who I know has maintained the car rigorously...but then, how do you know it wasn't beat on? It's a tough call, and for me the car has to be cost effective. I've got two salaries to work with, but with a mortgage, insurance, etc, it's tougher and tougher to see an S4 not as a liabilty.
I'd love to hear the comments of current S4 owners on this.
Matt
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10-31-2003, 09:00 AM
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That's a pretty good analysis, Rob....
...that is probably one of the single best methods non-industry folks can use to calculate something like this.
Like a lot of you, when I bought my '01 S4 this summer I was cross-shopping against an '01 330i/Ci. The prices generally ran about the same and the S4 I eventually bought was the most expensive car I looked at out of 2 S4s and 3 330s.
I think one of the biggest factors this board doesn't take into proper account is how many folks actually buy from a dealership vs. a private seller. Dealer prices are *significantly* higher AND often include the Audi Assured Warranty (as do BMWs, of course) which push average prices up much higher.
The most signficant issue, however, may not be depreciating value, but rather slow turnover rates. In my experience, a used BMW carries a greater appeal than a used Audi, therefore, it's much harder to sell Audis off dealer lots or in the private market (e.g., pearl2k). Because many private sellers do have time constraints, they are the ones pushing down the market price on our S4s.
While turnover data (how long a car has been on the market to be sold) is tough to come by on the used market, there is a "days listed" figure that Audi's web site includes if someone want to do a quick survey. Locally, I've seen some B5 S4s on dealer lots for months. But again, I have nothing to compare this against for used BMWs so this is just speculation.
Like a lot of you, when I bought my '01 S4 this summer I was cross-shopping against an '01 330i/Ci. The prices generally ran about the same and the S4 I eventually bought was the most expensive car I looked at out of 2 S4s and 3 330s.
I think one of the biggest factors this board doesn't take into proper account is how many folks actually buy from a dealership vs. a private seller. Dealer prices are *significantly* higher AND often include the Audi Assured Warranty (as do BMWs, of course) which push average prices up much higher.
The most signficant issue, however, may not be depreciating value, but rather slow turnover rates. In my experience, a used BMW carries a greater appeal than a used Audi, therefore, it's much harder to sell Audis off dealer lots or in the private market (e.g., pearl2k). Because many private sellers do have time constraints, they are the ones pushing down the market price on our S4s.
While turnover data (how long a car has been on the market to be sold) is tough to come by on the used market, there is a "days listed" figure that Audi's web site includes if someone want to do a quick survey. Locally, I've seen some B5 S4s on dealer lots for months. But again, I have nothing to compare this against for used BMWs so this is just speculation.
10-31-2003, 09:13 AM
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p.s. - I'm trying real hard not to call you and NJRickD about my car.
The inevitable is that I will probably have to sell sometime between now and next summer. I can't make myself part with it...yet! :-/
10-31-2003, 09:46 AM
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Good analysis, but..
..I'd be interested in seeing a multiple regression analysis to determine what the most influential variables are in determining the sales price. Mileage, of course, will be the first or second most important factor. But, I wonder what color does to a price.