joe@vwvortex

So I log on late last night after checking my email and once again - people are expressing concerns about deleted posts and locks and moderators in general. So I go to bed and give it some thought and am sitting here coffee in hand and log onto the forum.

One of the hotly contested debates last night centered on OT messages. Upon loggin on this am - i'm greated with 9 of the first 13 threads being OT. Hmm. While the discussion was had long ago about OT and being able to mark threads OT, it is disheartening to see the majority of the threads in here being OT. I have to say IMO they do take away from the fact that this IS an car forum. I also think that OT threads shouldn't be deleted or locked for no reason since they ARE allowed.

The moderators operate based upon feedback from JET as well as the basic premise of the Terms of Service which was posted last night. If the law comes down to lock certain types of posts like FS posts - well - that's what is done. While some of us may not like it (moderators included) we're instructed to do it so we do. It is frustrating to then have to deal with all the people's complaints about it.

The FS issues is being dealt with and it IS in response in part to paying advertisers complaining and in part to the existing system not being as effective as it could be. We are going through the same thing on Vortex and will be moving towards something like what they have on MTB Review. Check out the link to see what I'm talking about. While it won't be EXACTLY like this - it will be similar. HOWEVER - I DO NOT KNOW what AUDIWORLD's new classifieds system will be like.

As for self moderation - i'm all for it - would make my job easier. However, it just doesn't happen that way. In fact - you'd think that some of the forum regulars and old timers would be above some of this and be more understanding - but in fact - look at the forum and see who's stirring the pot - it isn't the newbies.

Speaking of newbies - it's also a shame that some of the newbies get harassed on here as much as they do. I know that it doesn't happen all the time - but it does happen and I just don't think that is right.

Well those are my thoughts.<ul><li><a href="http://marketplace.consumerreview.com/cgi-bin/classifieds/classifieds.pl?db=MtbReview&amp;website=MtbReview& amp;language=&amp;session_key=">MTBR Classifieds</a></li></ul>

NexxTT

Good food for thought. Thanks for posting, Joe.

YosemyTT

I do also think that private FS posts should be allowed and that OT stuff should not be deleted since I would like the chance to respond to it if I want. Thanks for sharing Joe.

JaminTT

Well put, I agree almost in whole with what you wrote. This is a car forum and not owned by us

JeremyTT

unconscionable.

hoTTub

Now, because Vortex is much more car focused I go there for technical discussions etc, there is a defined line in the sand what is appropriate and what is not. I dont have any problems with the moderating job over there and actually enjoy doing it (well most times) One of the downsides of this setup is that the community is very cold towards each other in general and has lost its close knit ties that it used to have back in the old days when it was only 10K users.

Now Audiworld (specifically the TT forum) has a much closer knit group of people with varying interests and will often share those interests with others on the forum. While I recognize that this is a car forum, if Audiworld as a whole does not realize that this is what makes the TT forum go round and makes things tougher and more strict, I hope they are prepared for a big dive in readership / participation.

Take for example one of the posters last night that was expressing her feelings (KimTT) she is not very tech oriented in her posts as she is still learning, but for all of the OT posts she has, she does participate in discussions about cars. She has also been a big part of the PhoTTo contest that was so successful...again, this is something that makes the forum so desirable to return and visit over and over and over. Is that not the intended purpose? Although I know this is a car forum, AW has got to the point that it really does not matter whether it was about cars or needlepoint, AW wants advertisers that are willing to fork out the $$$ to advertise. Advertisers want to be here because there is such a strong readership / return rate. Now Kim may not contribute technically all the time but she is just as valuable as a customer as anyone else, and she has probably been more interested in modding her car than any other one she has ever owned. Not because of all the car talk, because she is part of the group where she has been accepted, she trusts peoples opinions etc because there is a personal touch to it.

Now, not that I have been asked but I would not want to moderate over here, because I enjoy the environment too much and also enjoy playing in some of the reindeer games that go on. That is what makes this place special to me...the comraderie, not the car. If I want car stuff, I head over Vortex.....

EighTT

Most of all, it is a community. The Audi TT is the common theme that binds us, but there are only so many issues directly related to the TT that we can discuss and still keep things fresh and interesting.

Most of us are here, in my view, because we enjoy the atmosphere and we like many of our fellow TT forum members. One of the more entertaining aspects of the forum is that you never know what's coming next. It keeps things interesting and fun.

If all we did is talk about the same TT-related subjects, it would be extraordinarily dull in short order.

We are able to mark OT posts as such, and most of us are pretty good about doing so. Those who think there are too many OT posts should set their preferences up so that they do not have to view them. Period.

I sense that most of us don't care for the OT forum. I can only speak for myself, but I find many (but certainly not all) of the regulars there to be pretty immature. Which is not to say that I/we can't be immature as well every now and then, but I think that if the OT forum was a cocktail lounge, most of us wouldn't frequent it. We'd leave it for the kids.

As to the regulars who are "stirring things up", that's certainly to be expected. You'd expect the more senior forum members to show some leadership on an issue such as this. Just because the debate is often done in a humorous, tongue-in-cheek manner, doesn't mean that there isn't a serious underlying issue of over-moderation that we feel need to be addressed.

So much of this goes back to what I feel is the actual issue. The creation of problems where they do not otherwise exist.

Bluto

I have seen a number of posts from newbies over the past few days thanking the forum for its advice and assistance. And a number of new people introducing themselves over the past few days and being greeted with warm welcomes.

The newbies who are getting a little abuse are getting it for just reasons. Silly questions or stupid posts. Come on, Joe do you think someone posting the questions, "Is my TT a fake" will be taken seriously?!? On any other forum they would have been roasted ten times worse.

You are not the problem, Larry was not the problem, but Dave is. He really lost any respect I had for him w/his outbursts last night. And I had actually begun to like the guy. Crap if he would have posted something like this last night most that BW wasting crap would never have happened.

Thanks for posting this. Hopefully we'll get a chance to throw one back one of these days.

Jim TT

..OT stuff could just as easily go to the OT forum. I feel and have for a long time that this forum is way too off topic. You start with a car forum, you add an OT forum...what happens next, OT posters are telling the car posters to turn off OTs and limit thier veiw of what is posted here. It seems more correct for them to go to an OT forum to me. If the OT stuff was more limited I would see it differently but it is in fact over the top. Let me add that I think a perfect forum would be about 10%- 20% OT as it is nice to have some OT fun but you can't have that here because in fact the OT posters have tacken over. JIM

hoTTub

Again, you say yourself that you CAN turn off the view off topic threads. You obviously like reading some of the OT, but you say it should be trimmed down. You cant have your cake and eat it too, it is all or nothing. This is more than a car forum.....