Magneride normal setting firmer or softer than normal(sport) suspension?
08-05-2007, 08:49 AM
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Magneride normal setting firmer or softer than normal(sport) suspension?
All -- I haven't been able to drive a 2.0t with MR suspension and it's the last option I'm debating ordering on a 2.0t coupe.
From everything I've read on this site and seen in review the sport setting is firmer than the "normal" setting of MR(which is good) But I've not read a review from anyone who has driven both normal suspension and MR on a 2.0t. Is the MR in normal mode softer than the normal suspension?
I personally felt like the stock sport supension was quite nice; but handling for me is a premium and as I am leasing I won't be modifying(other than maybe a reflash).
From everything I've read on this site and seen in review the sport setting is firmer than the "normal" setting of MR(which is good) But I've not read a review from anyone who has driven both normal suspension and MR on a 2.0t. Is the MR in normal mode softer than the normal suspension?
I personally felt like the stock sport supension was quite nice; but handling for me is a premium and as I am leasing I won't be modifying(other than maybe a reflash).
08-05-2007, 09:10 AM
#2
That's a difficult question to answer. MR is better, but I'm not sure I'd call it softer.
The MR is more compliant, and the dynamic semi-active adjustments are a plus in comfort or sport.
I've driven both, and I felt the MR was better behaved over varied road conditions. If you're on smooth pavement, you may not notice it, but over the bumpy stuff, I think the MR deals better.
I've got the S-Line with 19" wheels, and in comfort mode, I'm impressed as to the amount the MR hides the additional weight of those wheels.
This is a graph from the Audi service training. It shows the range of MR compared to a conventional damper.
<img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/476/mrride2.jpg">
I've driven both, and I felt the MR was better behaved over varied road conditions. If you're on smooth pavement, you may not notice it, but over the bumpy stuff, I think the MR deals better.
I've got the S-Line with 19" wheels, and in comfort mode, I'm impressed as to the amount the MR hides the additional weight of those wheels.
This is a graph from the Audi service training. It shows the range of MR compared to a conventional damper.
<img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/476/mrride2.jpg">
08-05-2007, 10:27 AM
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I think you answered it clearly: softer.
"If you're on smooth pavement, you may not notice it, but over the bumpy stuff, I think the MR deals better."
And that graph shows exactly why some magazines suggested you forego the Mag Ride, as the stock suspension is the perfect compromise. With Mag Ride, you either have a very harsh or a mushy ride, but nothing in between: comfortable, yet sporty.
And that graph shows exactly why some magazines suggested you forego the Mag Ride, as the stock suspension is the perfect compromise. With Mag Ride, you either have a very harsh or a mushy ride, but nothing in between: comfortable, yet sporty.
08-05-2007, 10:50 AM
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I disagree, and so did most of the reviews I read
My take, having driven both, is that the MR is definitely more comfortable in "comfort mode" than the regular suspension - but *without* any loss of handling capability. In fact, I think it's still better.
Sport mode is clearly less comfortable... feels more like an Audi suspension in terms of ride quality, heh (they're known to be unnecessarily harsh). But the feel in turns goes from being excellent to phenomenal. I'm still impressed on a daily basis by how great this car is to drive, and I'm in the slightly more front-heavy 3.2.
In other words, I'm very glad I got the MR. Normal daily driving, driving with passenger(s) / dates / etc, the comfort mode is great. If I'm going to have some fun on the twisties or whip around an on-ramp, it's not hard to hit a button beforehand. Plus there's something really cool about being able to change the ride so easily =)
Sport mode is clearly less comfortable... feels more like an Audi suspension in terms of ride quality, heh (they're known to be unnecessarily harsh). But the feel in turns goes from being excellent to phenomenal. I'm still impressed on a daily basis by how great this car is to drive, and I'm in the slightly more front-heavy 3.2.
In other words, I'm very glad I got the MR. Normal daily driving, driving with passenger(s) / dates / etc, the comfort mode is great. If I'm going to have some fun on the twisties or whip around an on-ramp, it's not hard to hit a button beforehand. Plus there's something really cool about being able to change the ride so easily =)
08-05-2007, 11:37 AM
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There are some who do praise it, but there's also those who dislike it.
Remember <a href="http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/coupes/0705_2008_audi_tt_coupe_roadster/">this</a> controversial review on Automobile magazine?
"...the optional magneto-rheological suspension has two distinct modes: normal, which felt slightly softer than the standard suspension, and sport, which is quite punishing. Paying extra for two modes is unnecessary in my opinion - the conventional suspension is the Goldilocks "Just Right" setting, anyway."
I wasn't talking about handling, but connection to the road. There's absolutely no doubt that a suspension that damps out more road irregularities will alienate you more from it and the mag ride on the TT is no exception. What I have read is that the comfort mode disconnects you too much and the sport mode is unforgiving and, unfortunately, a compromising middle setting (which is what the stock suspension would be) is not available with mag ride. With the sport suspension you cannot make it softer... or harsher, but the way it is is just ideal for most situations.
Yes, I know what you mean about how cool it is to change this on the fly. I have 3 settings in my car. Advanced (the sportiest one) actually remaps the throttle response as well. Pretty cool. And lightning fast too.
"...the optional magneto-rheological suspension has two distinct modes: normal, which felt slightly softer than the standard suspension, and sport, which is quite punishing. Paying extra for two modes is unnecessary in my opinion - the conventional suspension is the Goldilocks "Just Right" setting, anyway."
I wasn't talking about handling, but connection to the road. There's absolutely no doubt that a suspension that damps out more road irregularities will alienate you more from it and the mag ride on the TT is no exception. What I have read is that the comfort mode disconnects you too much and the sport mode is unforgiving and, unfortunately, a compromising middle setting (which is what the stock suspension would be) is not available with mag ride. With the sport suspension you cannot make it softer... or harsher, but the way it is is just ideal for most situations.
Yes, I know what you mean about how cool it is to change this on the fly. I have 3 settings in my car. Advanced (the sportiest one) actually remaps the throttle response as well. Pretty cool. And lightning fast too.
08-05-2007, 12:26 PM
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Re: Magneride normal setting firmer or softer than normal(sport) suspension?
No doubt (as is happening now) you will see people post that it is a must and people that will post to skip it.
Do yourself a favor, drive both for a good 20 - 30 minutes down the SAME ROAD SEVERAL TIMES in both cars. If you tell your dealer what you are trying to figure out he may even be able to suggest a road to try it out on. This is what I did, I spent about 25 minutes in both cars with and without MR. One thing I took to mind was how bumps felt in the road with the MR ride in both normal and sport and how it felt without MR at all in a TT without it. You will draw your own conclusion shortly ater driving both, trust me.
So go out and drive both and draw your own conclusion and make the decesion for yourself. You are the one paying for it and your opinion matters more then any on this board. By no means am I saying those on this board don't know what they are talkign about, because they do. However it is your money and your car so it should be your unbiased decision.
My opinion, I bought a sports car, MR in normal driving to me did not feel like a sports car, in sport mode it did, but a little to harsh. Knowing this I knew I would leave it in sport mode most of the time which after a while I would not like b/c of the harsh ride. So I went wihtout out it knowing that the ride did feel very sporty but not so much so that it felt uncomfortable, the perfect mix for me.
Do yourself a favor, drive both for a good 20 - 30 minutes down the SAME ROAD SEVERAL TIMES in both cars. If you tell your dealer what you are trying to figure out he may even be able to suggest a road to try it out on. This is what I did, I spent about 25 minutes in both cars with and without MR. One thing I took to mind was how bumps felt in the road with the MR ride in both normal and sport and how it felt without MR at all in a TT without it. You will draw your own conclusion shortly ater driving both, trust me.
So go out and drive both and draw your own conclusion and make the decesion for yourself. You are the one paying for it and your opinion matters more then any on this board. By no means am I saying those on this board don't know what they are talkign about, because they do. However it is your money and your car so it should be your unbiased decision.
My opinion, I bought a sports car, MR in normal driving to me did not feel like a sports car, in sport mode it did, but a little to harsh. Knowing this I knew I would leave it in sport mode most of the time which after a while I would not like b/c of the harsh ride. So I went wihtout out it knowing that the ride did feel very sporty but not so much so that it felt uncomfortable, the perfect mix for me.
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08-05-2007, 12:59 PM
#8
Not softer... Hard to explain...
When I think "Soft", what comes to mind is something like a 70ish caddy, where the car slowly undulated/glided over the pavement. So you'd hit a little bump, the car would absorb it, but there was the feeling of riding in a boat, completely disconnected.
The MR is a different beast. In comfort, the small road imperfections are soaked up keeping the cruising very comfortable, but I'd never say that I'm gliding. As the road gets a little more bumpy, it dampens even more. I always feel connected.
In sport, the ride is a bit more harsh, but it is in no way jarring like a conventional sport suspension is. No doubt, that's because the damper can react far faster than a conventional shock at the onset and then tapper from there. Thus, you don't get the bump-stop crashing common when driving a sport suspension on less than perfect roads.
What most are missing here, and it 100% discoverable from a 20-30 minute drive of MR vs the standard suspension, it the vastly improved handling characteristics of MR. It corners FLAT, with little body roll. It doesn't take a drive on twisty roads to notice this either. A curving freeway off ramp is all you need to see the vast difference in MR over a conventional system. With conventional, the car will roll into the turn and you'll get typical Audi under-steer, and some suspension rebounding as you exit the turn and unload the outside wheels. In MR, the car is FLAT, with little body roll, and zero over-rebounding. It sold me... and every turn convinces me that this is the future of suspension.
No conventional suspension, no matter how good, can compete with a active system. The MR can adjust rates on-the-fly based on all the input sensors i.e. higher damping to the outside on a turn, less on the inside. You just can't get that with conventional shocks.
Last but not least... A conventional shock changes in character as it heats and cools. When cold it acts very different than when it heats up from aggressive driving. The MR fluid is no different, except that the system compensates for fluid temp to ensure that the damping is the same in all conditions.
Audi should have made MR standard, but I think there are enough "old timers" that won't embrace any new technology, that they had to offer the conventional.
The MR is a different beast. In comfort, the small road imperfections are soaked up keeping the cruising very comfortable, but I'd never say that I'm gliding. As the road gets a little more bumpy, it dampens even more. I always feel connected.
In sport, the ride is a bit more harsh, but it is in no way jarring like a conventional sport suspension is. No doubt, that's because the damper can react far faster than a conventional shock at the onset and then tapper from there. Thus, you don't get the bump-stop crashing common when driving a sport suspension on less than perfect roads.
What most are missing here, and it 100% discoverable from a 20-30 minute drive of MR vs the standard suspension, it the vastly improved handling characteristics of MR. It corners FLAT, with little body roll. It doesn't take a drive on twisty roads to notice this either. A curving freeway off ramp is all you need to see the vast difference in MR over a conventional system. With conventional, the car will roll into the turn and you'll get typical Audi under-steer, and some suspension rebounding as you exit the turn and unload the outside wheels. In MR, the car is FLAT, with little body roll, and zero over-rebounding. It sold me... and every turn convinces me that this is the future of suspension.
No conventional suspension, no matter how good, can compete with a active system. The MR can adjust rates on-the-fly based on all the input sensors i.e. higher damping to the outside on a turn, less on the inside. You just can't get that with conventional shocks.
Last but not least... A conventional shock changes in character as it heats and cools. When cold it acts very different than when it heats up from aggressive driving. The MR fluid is no different, except that the system compensates for fluid temp to ensure that the damping is the same in all conditions.
Audi should have made MR standard, but I think there are enough "old timers" that won't embrace any new technology, that they had to offer the conventional.
08-05-2007, 01:08 PM
#9
Those that dislike it probably didn't spend enough time with it.
It's an odd feeling at first. The damping characteristics are different that what we're all accustom to. It's a active suspension so it behaves differently depending on the conditions.