smooth 1

If your gonna go through the steps of ordering oil online...then get Motul..that's what they use......in Germany and on the race circuits...It's all about the same price. Unless you get the race oil from Motul..that can get expensive..but it is the best.

But if the choice is Mobil 1 or Castrol...then Castrol Euro would be my choice.

mdskiman521

$23 for 5 quarts of Castrol on amazon. I did read one article that said Mobil 1 is losing their BMW Long Life cert but the accuracy was questionable.

IknowHuhA6

Oops, thanks for catching that, I meant so say higher weight not viscosity, yes the 05-30 is lower viscosity. But I'm not interested in debating chemistry of what "should" work how... just stating my experience with my car.

Where on the wonderful world of 100% internet accuracy did you come across such a fib about it not approved for warranty purposes?
Whomever told you that, have them go read their manual. Owner's manual pg. 223.

Unless if maybe manuals differ in their content.

bhvrdr

Let me help clarify some of that information. 5W-30 is a lower weight and viscosity (same meaning here) oil than 0w-40. Typically when people look at the grades of oils you are referring to the last number as the weight or viscosity since that is the number that refers to the oil at temperature. The first number (the 0w and 5w ) refer to the cold oil temps (ie, startup). The thinner the better there.


With respect to warranty, the warranty booklets state to use a VW502 certified oil. They do allow for multiple viscosity to choose from but keep in mind it has to meet VW502. The kicker of this is that in the US, there are almost zero 5w-30 grade oils that meet VW502 warranty specifications. You will not find a 5w-30 from Mobil 1, Castrol, Valvoline, Pennzoil, etc that meets VW502 warranty requirements in the USA.

https://sites.google.com/site/stoyne...-north-america


If you look at the VW502 approved oil list there is even an error on it listing the Valvoline 5w-30 synpower as the only US oil in 5w-30 that meets specification but that has been a long time error on that list as if you go to valvoline online and look at the actual spec of their oil it clearly does not meet VW502.

Valvoline Synpower 5w30 - VW 502.00 approved? | Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs | Bob Is The Oil Guy

In europe there are several 30 weight oils that can meet spec but their formulations are different. If, in the USA, you are using M1, Valvoline, Castrol 5w-30 that would not be an oil that meets warranty specifications of VW502. When it doubt, check the back of your bottle for the VW502 certification. You wont find it on the 5w-30 but you will on many 0w-40 and 5w-40 USA oils.

Hope that helps.

Mike

DB22

There are thousands of Audi's around the world using many different oils but has anybody ever heard of an engine failure because of oil? Some people change every 3K miles and some every 10K but neither of them had an engine failure. Some people use Castrol because that's what their Dad used and they haven't had an engine failure either.

The specified viscosity is for MPG certification but using any 30 weight and changing every 10K miles will keep the engine running way longer than you being bored with the car and selling it. Most of us have had many cars and how many of us can attribute engine failure to oil?

bhvrdr

If you are going 3K miles between changes you can probably use any conventional oil they make and not have many problems If going 10k miles I'd use a VW502 approved oil. If you are under warranty I would also use a VW502 oil.

The VW502 certification is definitely NOT for mpg certification. Again, the only oils that meet VW502 in the US are 40 weight oils so the mpg would suffer not be improved. The VW502 certification requires a very high quality oil. It specifies more than anything a high temperature high shear viscosity rating of at least 3.5. This is a certification that is all about oil quality and protection and nothing about fuel economy. They spend a lot of money on this testing for a reason.


VW 502.00 and HTHS minimum | Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs | Bob Is The Oil Guy


As you go up on HTHS ratings, you lose a bit of fuel economy actually but VW wants that higher HTHS rating for PROTECTION.

High Temp/High Shear Viscosity and Fuel Efficiency Under Steady State Conditions | Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs | Bob Is The Oil Guy

The high temp high shear rating of M1 5w-30 is 3.1. That does not meet European A3 or VW502 for protection. The HTHS rating of M1 0w-40 is 3.76. This oil meets warranty certification.

The point is that there are plenty of inexpensive extremely high quality oils in the US that meet warranty requirements for protection and picking one that doesnt when it costs the same price is probably not a good idea. For 5 bucks a quart you can get M1 0w-40 or Castrol 0w-40 and you will have an oil that meets warranty requirements and provides the added high temp high shear protection that a US formulation 5w-30 does not.


Mike

DB22

Mike, I agree with you regarding the high standards of VW502 but the engineer who specified it only chose it because it was the best available so why not specify it. I doubt that he drove an Audi for 260000 miles on crap oil and said we need better oil.

I ask again, has anyone ever heard of engine failure because of "bad" oil? (assuming, of course, that it was changed at regular intervals).

99% of engines, since unleaded was law, run between 200 and 220 degrees F. Most redline between 5500 and 6500 RPM. Audi makes a good engine but it goes over the same roads, at the same speeds for the same duration as a Buick. This high tech oil discussion may be relevant for the LMS V10 plus but my A6 will probably outlast me if it ran on lard and I got my oil changes at McDonalds.

bhvrdr

I dont want to be argumentative but let me clarify that VW502 wasnt "chosen" it was indeed created due to extremely extensive and expensive testing carried out by Audi due to significant problems with engine sludging.


Yes, there were significant engine failures...

Volkswagen Extends Engine Warranties ? Center for Autosafety


This was also likely related to extended drain intervals (thanks Audicare) that Audi began recommending in the early 2000s. This is when engine oil quality started becoming VERY important. Again, I agree with you if you are doing 3K mile OCI just about any $2 oil will make it through those miles with good specs on a UOA. When you go out to 7.5K miles and 10K miles in city driving things can change dramatically.

There have been many larger scale engine related issues since the 2000s that are partially related to lubrication. During 2005-2006 there was the famous cam wear issues on the 2.0FSI engines...

2.0T FSI camshaft wear issues - anybody heard of this yet?

There was also the huge issue of almost 126,000 engines of the newer 2009-2011 2.0TFSI with oil consumption that necessitates new piston rings.

Audi Agrees To Settle Oil Consumption Lawsuit | CarComplaints.com


No, there hasnt been ALOT of issues DIRECTLY related to engine oil in the past decade (ie, sludging) when it comes to Audi engines but keep in mind that is since VW502 has been instituted and during half this past decade Audicare had been given FREE to Audi owners meaning you could be assured that every Audi engine was getting dealer services using VW502 oil. Additionally, The great majority of people take their car to dealerships or mechanics who know to use the correct VW502 oil. On an enthusiast board like this there may be a decent amount of people that do their own oil changes but i'd guess fewer than 5% of people change their own oil. Of that 5%, most will know to use the correct VW502 oil. That leaves very few not using an approved oil.


Thus, the lack of oil related engine failures in the past decade tends to support the idea that using a quality VW502 oil is probably worth it and most certainly it is worth it to maintain your engine warranty.


The main point of my post was simply to clarify to a new member that 5w-30 is not a thicker oil and does not meet warranty requirements so pick one that does Bottom line, use one of the many VW502 approved oils and enjoy.

DB22

My cousin had a friend that changed his oil and plugs every 3000 miles so he asked if he may have the old stuff so he then put the used 3000 mile old oil and the 3000 mile plugs into his Pontiac. His Pontiac out-lived him.

I have only had my dealer change the oil in my Audi and it's only my trust that thinks that I have VW502. Every 10K the alarms go off and I take back to the dealer. My days of changing oil have long gone.

Mike: sincerely, thanks for the input and information.

bhvrdr

Right on. I totally understand both positions. There is a guy on the Honda forum (I have a civic SI too) who ran his car 1.2 million miles doing 25K mile synthetic oil changes but it was 100% highway driving literally at a steady rpm and its also not a forced induction engine. I see both sides though of hypermiling oil and not wanting to be wasteful and the other side of the coin with the oil nerds who are only content if you are running Motul Specific 502 or some double ester flavor at a 3 thousand mile interval I try and stay in the middle somewhere.

Mike