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Rear Caliper - rebuild or aftermarket?

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Old 05-25-2015, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by pr0xZen
To the best of my knowledge, the piston itself doesn't seat on the threaded rod - it sits "on top" of the self-adjusting contraption (don't know the appropriate english term) - which IS seated on the threads. The piston is floating freely. When "adjusting", the hydraulic pressure pushes the adjuster outwards (thus turning), and this in turn pushes against the outer piston. It will stop turning when it encounters enough resistance, and thus friction, between the adjuster and the piston. So the lack of resistance -> friction between the adjuster and piston, allows the adjuster to rotate when pushed outwards. There is a little leeway, so that the piston can move and return for normal operation. When the pads & rotors wear, there is again low enough resistance for the adjuster to move a little more.

There is no worm gear in there (in these ones anyway), the lever mechanism that the cable rotates, is shaped like a cam. When you engage the parking brake, what the mechanism does is push the entire threaded rod assembly outwards (and there is a powerful return spring inside, pulling it back when disengaging). With age, heat etc - lubrication will suffer. If the dust boot here goes, rust and dirt will start to seize up this mechanism, and and some point the friction will overpower the return spring. Blown up parts diagram tells alot of the story (here).

Now in an ideal scenario there would be zero friction between the piston and adjuster, and thus you'd be able to push the piston and the adjuster would rotate and "screw back in". But in the real world, metal-on-metal is never frictionless. When you're applying force, you're inducing a temporal friction bond between the piston and the adjuster, and thus turning the piston turns the adjuster. The square-cut seal normally applies an initial force. Also, if the setup had somehow been completely frictionless, the adjuster wouldn't work as it does - it would completely lock up the brakes.

Some patents involve notches or locking shims on the adjuster and/or inside the piston, enabling the piston to rotate freely in one direction - this does away with the friction bond element when compressing the piston/adjuster assembly.

I found a youtube clip that shows some of this, might explain this better than my words: -here-

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Depending on condition, rebuild or replace is a matter of savings vs work/headaches. If the piston dust boot has been knackered for some time, rust is likely to have started eating at the piston. If this is the case, even if sanding the piston and changing the squarecut seal (and dust boot), its not going to last very long. It'll eat those squarecuts fairly rapidly. At that point you're looking at a new piston to add to the bill.

If the dust boot for the parking brake adjuster has gone, you're likely looking at a real party, and the parts cost is closing in on "aftermarket caliper" prices. This guide -here- is for the C4, but the rough principles are the same.

If your Audi is a keeper, the piston rusted and/or the parking brake mechanism is severly compromised - I'd say get a new caliper. Preferrably from someone that do core exchange, but whatever floats your goat / is cheaper. If aftermaket parts are ok with you, then the little you'll save on DIY'ing a complete refurbishment of the rears is not worth the labour and disassembly/assembly headaches. Well, atleast if you're not very well versed and drilled in the procedure.
First, I want to say that your explanation is excellent and thank you for posting those video links. I understand the mechanism now -which I was having trouble with. I have access to ETKA and parts diagram could've helped (I didn't look) but, what you wrote here seals the deal.

I've been thinking about replacing it as I remember it seizing before as well. Now that the boot is shot and entire mechanism looks way too much to invest time/money to rebuild, will just buy an aftermarket. Part stores are quoting around $95+ around here and even if the seal kit costs $30, the rest $60 is easily eaten up in the form of hour(s) of labor I'd have to put in.

Replacement it is. Trying to find a "good" is now the trouble. I "think" Lucas was the OE supplier and "Cardone" or similar is another rebuilt aftermarket..
Can anyone suggest a good replacement? I might keep the carrier as costs are higher replacing it and there is nothing wrong it.
Old 05-25-2015, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by tester123
Part stores are quoting around $95+ around here and even if the seal kit costs $30, the rest $60 is easily eaten up in the form of hour(s) of labor I'd have to put in.
~$100 for a new caliper is really not a bad price. Just check your gliders etc, those usually don't come with. If the pins are good, new boots for those are barely a few $. Use silicone grease, it stands up to the heat better. If it turns out you're brake piston is rusted, an aftermarket seal kit with a new piston is going to set you back atleast $30. If the parking brake assembly needs work, those parts add up too. So yeah - those (best case scenario) $60 you save, is really not worth the hassle.
Old 05-25-2015, 08:28 AM
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Default All good points. It depends on the quality of the rebuild.

Originally Posted by pr0xZen
~$100 for a new caliper is really not a bad price. Just check your gliders etc, those usually don't come with. If the pins are good, new boots for those are barely a few $. Use silicone grease, it stands up to the heat better. If it turns out you're brake piston is rusted, an aftermarket seal kit with a new piston is going to set you back atleast $30. If the parking brake assembly needs work, those parts add up too. So yeah - those (best case scenario) $60 you save, is really not worth the hassle.
It's really irritating if the rebuilder DOESN'T clean/rebuild the emergency brake components. IMHO a rebuild should involve complete disassembly, cleaning, and replacement of all elastomeric components. Sometimes all the 'rebulder' does is blow out the piston, clean the caliper, replace the piston seal and dust boot and call it a day. I've had several rebuilt OG900 Saab front rebuilt calipers that I've had to rebuild the correct way. Returning the caliper for another one didn't help and it just aggravated me.

I'm not saying these cars are so old that they're classics and you have to do it yourself, but maybe...
Old 05-25-2015, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by SloopJohnB@mac.com
It's really irritating if the rebuilder DOESN'T clean/rebuild the emergency brake components. IMHO a rebuild should involve complete disassembly, cleaning, and replacement of all elastomeric components. Sometimes all the 'rebulder' does is blow out the piston, clean the caliper, replace the piston seal and dust boot and call it a day. I've had several rebuilt OG900 Saab front rebuilt calipers that I've had to rebuild the correct way. Returning the caliper for another one didn't help and it just aggravated me.

I'm not saying these cars are so old that they're classics and you have to do it yourself, but maybe...
Usually you get what you pay for (I'm thinking delivering your own caliper for rebuild here). If you agree on a fixed price, and it turns out the e-brake mechanism and piston is gone - the parts price alone might go beyond what you paid. If you want to have a proper refurb job like this done, you'll have to either do it yourself or agree to a price after inspection.

If you go to a shop/parts supplier and get a bad rebuild off the shelf - thats bad.
Old 05-25-2015, 04:06 PM
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I agree with you both. Personally, I'd prefer rebuilding. Today everyone is closed so, I'll call around tomorrow and find out more.
Old 05-27-2015, 09:26 AM
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Default BiggRed responded to the question. The # works on ebay US.

Originally Posted by tester123
I agree with you both. Personally, I'd prefer rebuilding. Today everyone is closed so, I'll call around tomorrow and find out more.

The C4 kit won't work, you need the kit below. Too bad you can't get just the O-rings for the brake system but there it is. Don't forget to remove the adjuster from inside the piston to replace the O-ring therein. FWIW I didn't do that on my Saab caliper(s) and it worked fine..the general problem is with the O-ring (at the outside of the caliper on the brake shaft) that fails and allows crap to corrode the shaft and booger the works. The kit is about $42 USD which seems high…I would think Audi has the kit locally. Good luck.

(From Bigg Redd)
Hi John,
You need kit BRK204342 This is the largest rear calipers used on the S6 range 43mm .
If you type 281092162938 into the general Ebay UK search box you will find
Regards




John Smith

Bigg Red Ltd
Weir Lane
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0044 1905 428793
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Mon - Fri 9.30 - 5.30
Bigg Red


http://www.ebay.com/itm/281092162938?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D281092162938%26_rdc%3D1
Old 05-27-2015, 03:28 PM
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SloopJohnB, Thank you for sourcing the info. As I mentioned before, lack of proper tools / space to do the job, I have opted to do the unthinkable! - order a rebuilt unit. With core it came to $95. It includes the bracket as well so, I don't have to toy with slide pins etc. Just pop two carrier bolts disconnect and connect the brake line to new (I mean rebuilt ) unit and mount it back. Seems like a much simpler solution given my situation.

Also, stopped over at Audi dealer and picked up brake fluid. $7.30 vs $10.xx on Amazon! Not bad, for once!

I'll post back after completing the repair.
Old 05-27-2015, 05:27 PM
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Default ^^^Good Choice^^^

R&R plug and play and with brakes why take a chance, one often overlooked wear issues on old calipers is the piston and bore that wear more so when extended because of worn down pads and worn guide pins that allow a minimal movement against the piston that will **** it at times causing them to plain-out stick.
Old 05-28-2015, 05:28 AM
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For what it's worth, my rear right caliper parking brake actuator was handing up and not completely releasing. It was not the cable. It was the internal parking brake pusrod mechanism. Normally I would go with new OEM, but after speaking with the folks at German Auto Parts I opted to replace with a A1 Cardone Remanufactured caliper.
It looked brand new , shot blasted and refinished, came with all new hardware and instructions to return the Core for refund of the deposit.
Saved about $100 dollars off Noew OEM, comes with a warranty, and works perfectly.
ReMan may not be for everyone....but in this case on a 15 year old vehicle it was the right choice.
Good luck.
Old 05-28-2015, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by nickcarguy
For what it's worth, my rear right caliper parking brake actuator was handing up and not completely releasing. It was not the cable. It was the internal parking brake pusrod mechanism. Normally I would go with new OEM, but after speaking with the folks at German Auto Parts I opted to replace with a A1 Cardone Remanufactured caliper.
It looked brand new , shot blasted and refinished, came with all new hardware and instructions to return the Core for refund of the deposit.
Saved about $100 dollars off Noew OEM, comes with a warranty, and works perfectly.
ReMan may not be for everyone....but in this case on a 15 year old vehicle it was the right choice.
Good luck.
Thank you! I got Cardone as well! It came with the carrier bracket with Audi rings logo and looks identical to my old one. I am pretty sure these are old Audi calipers cleaned and rebuilt with new seals... which is what I was trying to do to begin with. So, the costs and labor alone made sense to go with rebuilt. Glad your problem is gone. I hope to report the same soon.

I am the type of person who advocates repair before replace. So, the grease monkey in my head is not satisfied but will have to let this one slide .

Last edited by tester123; 05-28-2015 at 06:10 AM.


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