Large injector recommendations?
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Large injector recommendations?
440cc/m just isn't large enough.
They have to be:
a) high impedance
b) bolt-in
c) much larger than 440cc/m
I see ATP has 550cc injectors, but I don't think 550cc will cut it. I called PES to see what they recommend, but they said to send them an email. I sent an email, and no response (tuners suck)
I was told the WRX STi and PE injectors would work, but they require a connector change, and they look like they run a smaller o-ring on the fuel rail side.
I know RC carries 550cc, possibly even 650cc and 750cc, but I've heard everything from "God couldn't make a better injector" to "these are the biggest pieces of @!$#@&%!!!" about RC.....
There's also the option of wiring in resistors to use low-impedance injectors on a high-impedance ECU, but I'm not sold on that idea just yet....
They have to be:
a) high impedance
b) bolt-in
c) much larger than 440cc/m
I see ATP has 550cc injectors, but I don't think 550cc will cut it. I called PES to see what they recommend, but they said to send them an email. I sent an email, and no response (tuners suck)
I was told the WRX STi and PE injectors would work, but they require a connector change, and they look like they run a smaller o-ring on the fuel rail side.
I know RC carries 550cc, possibly even 650cc and 750cc, but I've heard everything from "God couldn't make a better injector" to "these are the biggest pieces of @!$#@&%!!!" about RC.....
There's also the option of wiring in resistors to use low-impedance injectors on a high-impedance ECU, but I'm not sold on that idea just yet....
Elder Member
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RC is still working on their largest High Imp 600cc injectors.
The PE's are more work since they are a dual pulse injector which makes them 2 different sizes. They will also need a new boss to sit inside the intake manifold and a new fuel rail.
You might want to try going with the STI 565cc injectors (pink), if I had a set myself right now I would throw them in to see how they run with my setup. BTW the PE injectors come with the new connectors, just sure where to get them if you go with the STI injectors.
John have you thought of going to a stand alone like the EFI with a set of low imp injectors?
You might want to try going with the STI 565cc injectors (pink), if I had a set myself right now I would throw them in to see how they run with my setup. BTW the PE injectors come with the new connectors, just sure where to get them if you go with the STI injectors.
John have you thought of going to a stand alone like the EFI with a set of low imp injectors?
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I had a set of the ATP....
...Bosch 550cc injectors on my custom modded 1.8t (GT28RS turbo w/ custom mapped PES based software) and they worked fine. I also used thier 5 bar FPR to step up the dose.
What I never got used to was the black puff of unburt fuel smoke that shot out of the back of the car when I romped on it. My friends used to call it the smoke screen....lol....like a James Bond flick.....but I am sure you know what that is all about.
Holy crap 750cc? What, are you gonna put a GT30R on that car?
What I never got used to was the black puff of unburt fuel smoke that shot out of the back of the car when I romped on it. My friends used to call it the smoke screen....lol....like a James Bond flick.....but I am sure you know what that is all about.
Holy crap 750cc? What, are you gonna put a GT30R on that car?
Thread Starter
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My thoughts on standalone....
I don't want to spend $2000 just so I can run low impedance injectors. I really don't like the EMS options available either.
I've been told the Autronic SMC will work, but the SM2 does not, and I'd rather have the features of the SM2 for the money.
The Haltech E6 doesn't offer full sequential fuel and ignition at the same time. The E11 has so many bugs it's not funny.
The AEM looks nice, but they don't offer it for our application, I don't think the universal system was ever released, and I'm not confident in their support.
Motec is waaaaay out of my price range.
Besides, the stock ECU is more than capable, it just requires proper tuning. I'm working on it.
If it gets to the point where I have to start adding on a bunch boxes to get the stock ECU to work, then I'll start looking at stand-alone.
Seeing that I already have a nice fuel rail, I'm not going to buy another one to get different injectors to fit.
I've been told the Autronic SMC will work, but the SM2 does not, and I'd rather have the features of the SM2 for the money.
The Haltech E6 doesn't offer full sequential fuel and ignition at the same time. The E11 has so many bugs it's not funny.
The AEM looks nice, but they don't offer it for our application, I don't think the universal system was ever released, and I'm not confident in their support.
Motec is waaaaay out of my price range.
Besides, the stock ECU is more than capable, it just requires proper tuning. I'm working on it.
If it gets to the point where I have to start adding on a bunch boxes to get the stock ECU to work, then I'll start looking at stand-alone.
Seeing that I already have a nice fuel rail, I'm not going to buy another one to get different injectors to fit.
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I know we are talking apple to oranges.....
But there are multiple guys over one vortex...myself included that are runing 440's to about 400 crank hps. What do you think makes your set up max them out sooner?
Audi2ptzero is correct. RC is "working" on a set of High Imp 600cc...but they have been talkiing about it for a while now.
Audi2ptzero is correct. RC is "working" on a set of High Imp 600cc...but they have been talkiing about it for a while now.
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at what fuel pressure?
I'd like to think our 20v motors are really efficient, but 400hp from 440 injectors at 4 bar (100% duty cycle) comes out to a BSFC of 0.48
I think that's a little too optimistic.
I think that's a little too optimistic.
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Slightly more then 4 bar.....
Keep in mind you are correct my duty cycles are are getting high (90%'s). But what Im saying is 55lb injectors, should be more then enough for 400+ hps. Again I know you cant compare the 2 cars....different displacement, different turbo, different head, ect. Just wanted to know if you through there was a specific factor.
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Thread Starter
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HP ultimately comes down to fuel and airflow....
so turbo, displacement, etc. doesn't really matter all that much. 400hp is 400hp.
The DBW ECUs allow a longer injector on-time (24ms vs 16.3ms or something like that) but I did the calculations once, and the intake valve is only open for ~15ms at 6000 RPM, so that's not that big of a factor.
I'm sure 550cc injectors would be good for over 400HP, but I want to have some reserve, just in case
The DBW ECUs allow a longer injector on-time (24ms vs 16.3ms or something like that) but I did the calculations once, and the intake valve is only open for ~15ms at 6000 RPM, so that's not that big of a factor.
I'm sure 550cc injectors would be good for over 400HP, but I want to have some reserve, just in case
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I actually have PE 800cc injectors in my car now
The turbo is a Airwerks S-100 but is only running at 10psi at this time.
BTW running the 5 bar fpr did not help and am pretty sure you were running the T28 chip which is tuned for 440cc with a 4 bar fpr. You would have better off using a adjustable fpr and turn it below 4 bar with those 550's. Right now I am running my 800's with the fpr down at around 3 bar.
BTW running the 5 bar fpr did not help and am pretty sure you were running the T28 chip which is tuned for 440cc with a 4 bar fpr. You would have better off using a adjustable fpr and turn it below 4 bar with those 550's. Right now I am running my 800's with the fpr down at around 3 bar.