[Help] CEB Tranny (auto) shift pattern/hard shifting
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[Help] CEB Tranny (auto) shift pattern/hard shifting
Hi there, im new here, and i hope someone can shed some light on my problem.
I have an 1992 Audi 80 2.3 (NG) with an CEB auto.tranny (4speed w/overdrive)
It shifts funny. It's pattern is like this:
1.gear>2.gear>3.gear...........4.gear then INSTANT to overdrive
0-.............~25km/t)............(~50km/t........................)
Furthermore it shifts really hard from 2nd. to 3rd gear. as in a loud *CLUNK* is heard, and it jolts the entire car. also, when ever it changes to overdrive it does it very rough.
It shifts smooth 1>2>3 when cold for the first like 3-4mins. then the hard 2>3 starts.
What could be the problem? and can i fix this myself?
Thanks in advance to anyone who can help me shed some light on this
-Phill
I have an 1992 Audi 80 2.3 (NG) with an CEB auto.tranny (4speed w/overdrive)
It shifts funny. It's pattern is like this:
1.gear>2.gear>3.gear...........4.gear then INSTANT to overdrive
0-.............~25km/t)............(~50km/t........................)
Furthermore it shifts really hard from 2nd. to 3rd gear. as in a loud *CLUNK* is heard, and it jolts the entire car. also, when ever it changes to overdrive it does it very rough.
It shifts smooth 1>2>3 when cold for the first like 3-4mins. then the hard 2>3 starts.
What could be the problem? and can i fix this myself?
Thanks in advance to anyone who can help me shed some light on this
-Phill
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Poor circulation of the ATF fluid has caused it to overheat and break down.
Your shift solenoids haven't completely fused, but they are well on their way. Take the vehicle to a trusted mechanic and have the tranny filter changed, and the system completely flushed. You might also need to replace the ATF supply line from and ATF return line to the radiator, as they are the most likely spots for a blockage to occur.
Please don't go the cheap route on this, unless you ACTUALLY know how to fix what is being explained to you.
Your shift solenoids haven't completely fused, but they are well on their way. Take the vehicle to a trusted mechanic and have the tranny filter changed, and the system completely flushed. You might also need to replace the ATF supply line from and ATF return line to the radiator, as they are the most likely spots for a blockage to occur.
Please don't go the cheap route on this, unless you ACTUALLY know how to fix what is being explained to you.
Last edited by Loudgoldwing; Jan 27, 2012 at 07:51 PM.
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Poor circulation of the ATF fluid has caused it to overheat and break down.
Your shift solenoids haven't completely fused, but they are well on their way. Take the vehicle to a trusted mechanic and have the tranny filter changed, and the system completely flushed. You might also need to replace the ATF supply line from and ATF return line to the radiator, as they are the most likely spots for a blockage to occur.
Please don't go the cheap route on this, unless you ACTUALLY know how to fix what is being explained to you.
Your shift solenoids haven't completely fused, but they are well on their way. Take the vehicle to a trusted mechanic and have the tranny filter changed, and the system completely flushed. You might also need to replace the ATF supply line from and ATF return line to the radiator, as they are the most likely spots for a blockage to occur.
Please don't go the cheap route on this, unless you ACTUALLY know how to fix what is being explained to you.
Thanks for your reply. Im considering taking the car to a prof. tranny mech.
The described problems only happens when you accelerate slowly (to save fuel)
1. gear to 2nd gear is SILKY-smooth.
2>3 is jolt and clunk
3>4 is smooth
4>Overdrive is smooth but with a noticeable jolt.
During harder accelerations the shifts are still noticeable but no clunks are heard.2>3 is jolt and clunk
3>4 is smooth
4>Overdrive is smooth but with a noticeable jolt.
Going to try and clean the MAF
Later today im gonna try and clean my MAF as i've heard these can cause shift related problems.
ATF is red and transparentI checked the oil today after a nice long drive. Gear in Neutral, and the plastic part was fully covered in red transparent oil. SO maybe too much ATF?
Disconnected the MAF no change in shifts; Defective MAF?I tried disconnecting the MAF during previously mentioned drive and it didn't change the shift behaviour. Which leads me to believe the MAF is faulty. I only noticed a + / - 50 RPM drop when disconnecting/connecting the MAF, which leads me to believe it is NOT faulty? Help on this
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MAF is for air intake, I can't see how that could effect the transmission shifting, it would only effect how the engine runs.
MAFS are very solid unless your air filter is so clogged dirt has soiled the sensor and even then it would effect motronics.
I have a 24,18 and 14 year old MAFS still working excellent. Unless you pull a code for it then it is not the issue.
OEM VW/Audi ATF fluid is gold colored and not red, sounds like somebody might have put something different in it.
As long as it meets the specs the color is not a red flag but it could also be part of the issue.
Audi is very specific about what goes into the transmission fluid wise.
Esso, M1, Pentosin meet their specs as well as a few others.
As mentioned it could just be a clogged filter not allowing fluid to flow as it should. If you have no idea when it was last changed it is probably due.
Bentley has between 30k-45K for changes.
MAFS are very solid unless your air filter is so clogged dirt has soiled the sensor and even then it would effect motronics.
I have a 24,18 and 14 year old MAFS still working excellent. Unless you pull a code for it then it is not the issue.
OEM VW/Audi ATF fluid is gold colored and not red, sounds like somebody might have put something different in it.
As long as it meets the specs the color is not a red flag but it could also be part of the issue.
Audi is very specific about what goes into the transmission fluid wise.
Esso, M1, Pentosin meet their specs as well as a few others.
As mentioned it could just be a clogged filter not allowing fluid to flow as it should. If you have no idea when it was last changed it is probably due.
Bentley has between 30k-45K for changes.
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I googled my problem, and many report that faulty MAF have caused shifting problems in their automatic transmissions. Something with the output from the MAF to the computer than controls the shiftpoints etc. along with the throttle position input and so on.
My car is supposed to have 130hp.. it feels VERY sluggish.. My previous car was a Nissan with 70hp (manual trans tho) and it felt like a ferrari compared to what im driving now. With almost twice the power.
Im gonna clean it, and possibly replace it, just cause.. it MIGHT fix the problem.
My car is supposed to have 130hp.. it feels VERY sluggish.. My previous car was a Nissan with 70hp (manual trans tho) and it felt like a ferrari compared to what im driving now. With almost twice the power.
Im gonna clean it, and possibly replace it, just cause.. it MIGHT fix the problem.
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Phil is actually correct about the MAF being involved in the TCU's determination of shift points. But his discovery of the fluid being so high is MUCH more likely a contributing factor to his issue.
Phil, there are 2 little circle-shaped indentations on the plastic end of your tranny dipstick. Those 2 circles should be (going up from the lowest point) about 30% and then 80% high on the "flat" face of that plastic area.
Those 2 circles represent the 2 temperature-specific points where your fluid level shoud be when an Audi tech has a Vag-Com hooked up to your car and it tells him when to check the level.
The important places for you are the "shelf" points that start and end the flat area of that black plastic bit. Those are the BARE MINIMUM and ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM points for people who have no access to a Vag-Com system.
When the car is FULLY HOT, park on a flat surface, and let the car idle in "P." Check the fluid level, and if it is over that top "shelf" where the flat part of the black plastic ends, drain the ATF down to that point. Anything over that will possibly block the pressure relief system in the tranny, and will cause poor shifting. Death of the tranny will occur shortly thereafter, as seals will blow and moving parts will no longer be able to do so.
Phil, there are 2 little circle-shaped indentations on the plastic end of your tranny dipstick. Those 2 circles should be (going up from the lowest point) about 30% and then 80% high on the "flat" face of that plastic area.
Those 2 circles represent the 2 temperature-specific points where your fluid level shoud be when an Audi tech has a Vag-Com hooked up to your car and it tells him when to check the level.
The important places for you are the "shelf" points that start and end the flat area of that black plastic bit. Those are the BARE MINIMUM and ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM points for people who have no access to a Vag-Com system.
When the car is FULLY HOT, park on a flat surface, and let the car idle in "P." Check the fluid level, and if it is over that top "shelf" where the flat part of the black plastic ends, drain the ATF down to that point. Anything over that will possibly block the pressure relief system in the tranny, and will cause poor shifting. Death of the tranny will occur shortly thereafter, as seals will blow and moving parts will no longer be able to do so.
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Phil is actually correct about the MAF being involved in the TCU's determination of shift points. But his discovery of the fluid being so high is MUCH more likely a contributing factor to his issue.
Phil, there are 2 little circle-shaped indentations on the plastic end of your tranny dipstick. Those 2 circles should be (going up from the lowest point) about 30% and then 80% high on the "flat" face of that plastic area.
Those 2 circles represent the 2 temperature-specific points where your fluid level shoud be when an Audi tech has a Vag-Com hooked up to your car and it tells him when to check the level.
The important places for you are the "shelf" points that start and end the flat area of that black plastic bit. Those are the BARE MINIMUM and ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM points for people who have no access to a Vag-Com system.
When the car is FULLY HOT, park on a flat surface, and let the car idle in "P." Check the fluid level, and if it is over that top "shelf" where the flat part of the black plastic ends, drain the ATF down to that point. Anything over that will possibly block the pressure relief system in the tranny, and will cause poor shifting. Death of the tranny will occur shortly thereafter, as seals will blow and moving parts will no longer be able to do so.
Phil, there are 2 little circle-shaped indentations on the plastic end of your tranny dipstick. Those 2 circles should be (going up from the lowest point) about 30% and then 80% high on the "flat" face of that plastic area.
Those 2 circles represent the 2 temperature-specific points where your fluid level shoud be when an Audi tech has a Vag-Com hooked up to your car and it tells him when to check the level.
The important places for you are the "shelf" points that start and end the flat area of that black plastic bit. Those are the BARE MINIMUM and ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM points for people who have no access to a Vag-Com system.
When the car is FULLY HOT, park on a flat surface, and let the car idle in "P." Check the fluid level, and if it is over that top "shelf" where the flat part of the black plastic ends, drain the ATF down to that point. Anything over that will possibly block the pressure relief system in the tranny, and will cause poor shifting. Death of the tranny will occur shortly thereafter, as seals will blow and moving parts will no longer be able to do so.
Also im thinking maybe the brake bands might be worn?
Still really boggles me that it'll only act up in 2>3.gear, and not all gears.
Anyway, THANKS alot for all your effort!
I guess if dropping some oil out of the tranny doesn't fix problems, im gonna have to take it to an Aut. Tranny Mech. -Phil
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I googled my problem, and many report that faulty MAF have caused shifting problems in their automatic transmissions. Something with the output from the MAF to the computer than controls the shiftpoints etc. along with the throttle position input and so on.
My car is supposed to have 130hp.. it feels VERY sluggish.. My previous car was a Nissan with 70hp (manual trans tho) and it felt like a ferrari compared to what im driving now. With almost twice the power.
Im gonna clean it, and possibly replace it, just cause.. it MIGHT fix the problem.
My car is supposed to have 130hp.. it feels VERY sluggish.. My previous car was a Nissan with 70hp (manual trans tho) and it felt like a ferrari compared to what im driving now. With almost twice the power.
Im gonna clean it, and possibly replace it, just cause.. it MIGHT fix the problem.
You may continue to believe it does, but IMHO you are wasting your time.
Now... your MAF WILL cause your car to run rich or lean..whch will rob you of some or all power. My car would not even rin more than 5 km/h when I had a MAF problem.
Last edited by Luxus Panzer; Jan 28, 2012 at 12:54 PM.
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I'll defer to Luxus on this for now... My first instinct is to disagree with him strongly. But I've scoured my tech manual for this car and I admit I might be applying a remedy for a different vehicle to this issue.
But I could have sworn that replacing an air intake seal was what fixed my unmetered air leak and cured my shifting problem on this car when I first bought it.
I'll get back to you.
But I could have sworn that replacing an air intake seal was what fixed my unmetered air leak and cured my shifting problem on this car when I first bought it.
I'll get back to you.
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fun update
So here's a fun update.
The car still runs 'perfectly'
The shifting is exactly the same
We're down to 6km/l (14mpg for the US)
What has been replaced since then? Waterpump, brake discs, and a timing belt!!!! Talk about a stubborn car?!
Maybe a bad tranny mount?
The car still runs 'perfectly'
The shifting is exactly the same
We're down to 6km/l (14mpg for the US)
What has been replaced since then? Waterpump, brake discs, and a timing belt!!!! Talk about a stubborn car?!
Maybe a bad tranny mount?