CCMF

I recently posted some information that i gathered from Todd of AWE about the GIAC chip. Of course there were immediate 'conspiracy' posts alleging that it was a sales ploy by Garret or Todd.<p>BULL****!!!!!!!!!!!!<p>I am in the process of evaluating chips from several vendors of whom i believe offer the best solutions for me and my turbo. Nothing More.<p>I posted the particular info about the Garret Chip due to its unusual characteristic of producing about twice the amount of torque of ANY other available chip.<p>Why has there been no analysis of this? I know that Garret is the 'young turk' amongst all the tuners, but come on, we need to evaluate and determine ALL viable options available.<p>So my question still stands:<p>1) How is 250+ ft/lbs even a possibility with only a 1 bar set up?<br>2) What is Garret doing that the other tuners either cant or refuse to do? Why Not??<br>3) There just HAS to be some sort of downside to all this torque. What parts are being stressed?<br>4) With so much torque available, shouldnt the the GIAC chip propel the A4 to 0-60 in ~6 sec's?<br>4B) Doesnt this torque approach the "push" that should be available in the soon to be S4?<p><br>I know that this is a long list....but the resident experts here are large enough in numbers, and knowledgeable enough about engines & turbos, that most should be answered rather quickly.<p><br>Everybody wonders which chip is the best. Although some may doubt GIAC's long term viability, i certainly have my own concerns, here's an opportunity to examine what is in reality the ONLY chip that stands out from the rest.<p>Im not intersted in Garret Rules! posts. Just some thought out and logical analysis on the above questions.<p>Thank You<p>The Closet Chip & Mod Fan<br>

Lucas

I have nothing to do with Garret or any other company.<br>All I want, is that if i change something major in my car (Like Turbo and injectors), can the vendors supply a remapped chip.<br>Also lets see, who also uses Garret, PES, Air&Water and maybe APR.<p>It comes down to wether you want to just chip a stock motor, buy a kit upgrade (K-04) or go for some serious work.<p>Standard Chip upgrade 10+Vendors<br>K-04/K03Sport Kits about 4-5 vendors.<br>Serious Power(Custom) about 2-3 vendors.<p>So when you say who is better, What do you want to do? Where do you want to go today?

I see your point

<br>I did not post my email address because I do not want to be "flamed"<p>Garrett is probably a good chip maker but I do not feel he has the experience necessary to make a relaible setup work. Making horsepower is the easy part, but if I remember correctly, the Auto/Tip is designed to handle 230 ft-lbs of Torque, and his chip produces much more. It seems reliablity is not a factor in his products. I feel any of his set-ups will grenade after a coupe of thousand miles. As a matter of fact, I think one of his K04 kits allready did. And I hate the fact that he associates his products with his first name, that way people easily confuse him with Garrett, the Turbo manufacturer. <p>I'm suprised A4.org hasnt stopped their constant "advertising" on this forum. Maybe because they are assocaited with PES, which by the way, Rally Motorsports in New Jersey designed that whole supercharger kit of theirs.

DavidG

I have to say I am actually very impressed with them all. I don't own any of their products (I have a Neuspeed chip), but I did get a chance to talk with Garrett. He seems to have been involved in a committed way with Porsche racing and knew an aweful lot about the inner workings of the ECU chip and programming. From his discussion on how he developed the PES chip, I was struck by how many hours he drove around in that car with his laptop attached to the VAG plug, taking all sorts of diagnostic data under different conditions. He seemed committed to ensuring that his program work properly without having to rely on excessive ECU adaptation and appeared to have knowledge of the theory behind the ECU program rather than taking simple, shortcut approaches.<p>As for the PES team, I met the guys who developed it, who described the whole process from start to finish and explained the philosophy behind each element. As a fellow engineer who also gets drawn intensely into an intriguing project, it was clear to me that these guys were for real and did the work they described. They even went so far as to engineer their own components, such as pulleys, when the off-the-shelf stuff was unsatisfactory. They went through great pains not to cut corners and to make installation straightforward and a simple bolt-on job.<p>If anyone knows differently, then do state your evidence before posting statements that seem to be fact but may actually be opinion or speculation. Misinformation is worse than none at all.<p>As an aside, thanks to the NY Metro Audi club for organizing the event at which I was able to meet these people back in February. I'm looking forward to the next event, whenever it may be.

Stephen

APR does not in any way use Garret chips.<br>All chips done by APR are APR's alone.<br>Just wanted to clarify on that implication made on the last post.<br>Thanks

MichaelB

This is only in response to your comment about PES and Rally. I don't know Garrett all that well, so I cannot comment on the reliability of his chips.<p>When PES first started the supercharger kit, it was going to be in conjuction with Rally, as Tony had a relationship with them. Tony had the idea for the kit, and he had enlisted George at Rally to help in the development. However, at the very (VERY) beginning (before the software was even started!) PES and Rally parted company. They had some differences as to how they thought the kit should be developed, which I won't go into. <p>The entire PES package, from the hardware to the software, was done by Tony and Mike, and the software was done by Garrett. The guys at Rally know NOTHING about programming chips. They do have experience with aftermarket engine management units like Haltech, but I think Rally would be the first to tell you that they have NO IDEA how to reprogram an OBDII chip!<p>I couldn't believe it when I read this. I was THERE, AT PES during various stages of development. I can tell you that Rally had nothing to do with this kit. Heck, we even did the dyno testing ELSEWHERE when there was a dyno right around the corner available at, you guessed it...Rally.<p>I can just see Tony at PES rolling his eyes in disbelief that someone would even suggest that Rally designed the kit when in all, Tony and Mike together put in so, so many hours developing this kit with an intense commitment to making a high-quality product.<p>BTW, Garrett does strike me as an individual who may tend to push the limits of an engines capability of power generation. HOWEVER, with the PES kit, it was Tony and Mike that really drove the development. They told Garret EXACTLY what they wanted, and what they needed changed. They did not give Garrett free reign and just say "go ahead and make a chip for this thing". It was a very tightly controlled and documented process.<p>Lastly, I know that Tony is above responding to garbage like this, so I feel I need to do it for him! This type of stuff should absolutely never be posted by someone who doesn't even put in their e-mail address. Flames or no flames.<p>Mike

Paul Ngo

Forget the dyno numbers, different dyno's will give different results. Why don't you join your local A4 club or Quattro club and test drive vehicles with different aftermarket chips. Some folks may not agree to 0-60 times or burning clutches, but third-gear runs and top-gear tests will be a good indicator to what type of performance increases to expect.<p>HTH,<br>Paul Ngo

ChuckH

It's unfortunate that some people have to post false information in a pathetic attempt at giving someone else a bad name. The joke's on you!

Lucas

I did say Maybe.

Garrett

APR does not use any of our chip programing.<p>Please don't get confused. They have their own in house dyno and do all of their own work.<p>Garrett Lim<br>GIAC