Maverick61

So then why warrant at all ???
Using your logic, it makes no sense to warrant a tire for more miles if they can get away with less - so why warrant at all

The answer is because there is a direct correlation

Your argument further falls apart because it fails to explain the differences in why some tires are warranted at 20K miles, some at 50K, some at 70K, etc.
This isn't someone sitting there making it up - oh what do you think will market the best. Because clearly the larger number markets better. So if it was just about marketing with no direct correlation to actual performance, then the companies would not have the differences between their own tires that they do. They would all "market" with high numbers

Furthermore, if you bother to compare, usually you will see that the UTOG ratings mimic the mileage warranties. So using your logic, I guess companies are just making up the UTOG numbers to market their tires as well?

snagitseven

Why have a warranty at all? I believe I answered that - competitive marketing.

Actually, if you do some research you will find that there are no industry standards for UTOG ratings. So yes, essentially, yes, they make it up.

As usual, this is going nowhere. Further disagreement just for the sake of disagreement serves no useful purpose to others reading the thread.
You are right and I am wrong. There you go. nothing else to discuss.

KevinGary

The best argument against democracy is a 5-minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill

Maverick61

It is not disagreement for the sake of disagreement - it is to present facts and logic to this thread. Your contention is not factual nor logical. As I said, your argument falls apart because it fails to explain the differences in why some tires are warranted at 20K miles, some at 50K, some at 70K, etc.
This isn't someone sitting there making it up - oh what do you think will market the best. Because clearly the larger number markets better. So if it was just about marketing with no direct correlation to actual performance, then the companies would not have the differences between their own tires that they do. They would all "market" with high numbers

As far as UTOG ratings go, while they are not the gold standard, they also are not as you contend, just made up. The NHTSA has th right to audit any company's results and fine them if the data does not match results. So companies just don't make it up and expose themselves to a bunch of liability down the road

But you are correct, as usual this is going nowhere, But hey, at least you finally agree you are wrong and I am right

jrhgto

Correct, Take for example, the Yokohama W4S tire (UHP All Season), it has NO treadlife warranty at all.
So Yokohama, must have weighed all of the business they would lose by NOT having a warranty VS having a warranty and having to possibly replace lots of tires early. SO I think its more than just a marketing decision, otherwise they would have given that tire some kind of warranty

irenesbob

Two arms-length comments:
1) I believe all Original Equipment tires have no treadwear warranty - just saying.
2) The November issue of Consumer Reports has a write-up on tire wear and warranties (page 58 of the paper magazine).

snagitseven

Excerpt from that Consumer Reports Article (italics mine):

The Truth About Tire Treadwear - Consumer Reports

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Do Tire Tread Warranties Wear Thin?

Many replacement tires, especially the all-season ones that come standard on a car, minivan, or SUV, have a prorated mileage warranty. It’s based on how long the tread on a tire is expected to last. For the tires we tested, it was usually between 40,000 and 90,000 miles.

But those warranties often don’t offer the consumer much payback if the tires wear out prematurely.The warranty is sometimes more of a marketing boast than a useful measure of longevity.

Why is that? Well, if tires wear out before the warranty mileage is used up, you’ll probably get only a fractional credit representing the miles the tires didn’t cover. And that’s good only toward the purchase of identical or comparable tires from the same manufacturer—which you may not want. You can’t use it to get better tires or tires from another brand
Here’s where the math really doesn’t add up: The credit can be applied to a manufacturer’s suggested retail price for a new tire or to a dealer’s price. And that price is often high relative to the frequent discounts offered by many retailers. In fact, you may be able to buy new, discounted tires for less than the price of warranty replacements.

On top of that, restrictions to get your prorated credit abound. Your tires may have to show even wear across the tread or the deal’s off. You may also have to show receipts that verify you had the tires rotated at the prescribed intervals, usually every 5,000 miles, since they were new.

The tires also have to be worn out, which is defined as having a tread depth of only about 2/32 inch. Tires that are worn out will perform poorly on wet roads and could pose a safety risk. (Use these tips for safer winter driving.)
Our controlled tread-life tests cut through the marketing mumbo-jumbo to tell you how many miles your tires will last before becoming worn out. Of course, your actual experience will vary according to the vehicle you drive, how and where you drive, and other factors.

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And this from the same article:
-----------------------------------

Treadwear grade

A government-required number that indicates a tire’s expected wear. A grade of 300 denotes a tire that will wear three times as well as a tire graded 100. But the numbers are assigned by tire manufacturers, not an independent third party.

irenesbob

snagit-
My read of the CR article suggested to me that it supported your side of "the argument", which is why I posted the reference.
I checked the Pirelli brochure that came with my new car and it does state that there is no mileage warranty on "original equipment" tires; mileage warranties are in effect only for "replacement" tires.

KevinGary

It certainly does! Not surprising since Snagit set forth a coherent position that most people were able to understand.

Maverick61

And I thought you were done.

Just to recap - this is what each of us said

Actually the article test results support what I said. Funny you left out these quotes from the article

Based on our testing, we found that most tires should live up to their mileage warranty claims. Three Michelin models met or exceeded their treadwear claim and also did well in our performance tests. The longest-wearing was the Pirelli P4 Four Seasons Plus, which could last about 100,000 miles.

Models that our test projects will fall short of their treadwear claim by 15,000 miles or more include the Continental TrueContact and PureContact (H, V), Sumitomo HTR Enhance L/X (T, H, V), Kumho Solus TA71 and TA11, Firestone Precision Touring, and Bridgestone Serenity Plus.

So just to recap - Consumer reports own actual tests confirmed what I said - that

Based on our testing, we found that most tires should live up to their mileage warranty claims. aka that there is correlation between the miles a tire manufacture warrants it for and its expected life. If this wasn't the case, then the test results would have been different.

The part of the article you are focusing on deals with the potential payback a tire warranty gives a customer - which never was part of the discussion.

As to those UTOG grades, I made it clear they were not the gold standard and I never said they were assigned by an independent party. However what you neglect to mention is these are government required numbers, based on governmental standards, and the NHTSA has the right to audit any company's results and fine them if the data does not match results.