D3AeighT

1st - Audi A8L ( the picture in the article, sure looked like "greyboy" )
2nd - Lexus LS430
3rd - Mayback 57/63

America's Best Sedan

1st - Chrysler 300C
2nd - BMW 3 Series
3rd - Cadillac CTS

SUV

1st - VW Touareg
2nd - Land Rover Range Rover
3rd - Porsche Cayenne

greenie

what VW was thinking!!!

CEB

...outselling the S series

Miguel R.

I traded in my A6 4.2 and got the Phaeton 2 weeks ago and love it. I considered the A8 which I thought was wonderful, however, I felt the Phaeton was more luxurious. They are different cars. The A8 is more of the driver's car but the Phaeton is the better touring sedan IMHO. Regardless, I have yet to read a review of the car that is dissapointing. It may not be considered the best, as the critics always gravitate towards the better handler, but you are hard pressed to justify your comment if it portends to the Phaeton itself as opposed to VW's strategy, etc.

greenie

are about to get! I added up the style IMO, the pricepoint and "various" articles pointing out the not-so-great selling seasons for VW. VW has suffered "monumental" losses in the words of three authors who place the blame squarely on the development of the Phaeton. I happen to love the interior of the car. Ill let it rest with that. I do not want to offend you. I merely asked what VW was thinking in light of these losses. Enjoy your car!!

03A627 2 04A842

They are not!

Miguel R.

are going to get!!!They have a market strategy to move the brand up. Simple. They are willing to take the losses now in the hopes that by the 3rd generation of the car, it will sell well. VW losses stem from the fact that the Jetta, Passat, etc. are all nearing the end of the cycle, the Passat alone has not had a new model for 7 yaers. Let's face it, the previous A8 sold miserably, even in its best years, and Audi had a more upscale image. The A8 you now own is the 1st to ever do well in the U.S., although it still does not sell like the S Class (old model and all) and I believe even the ugly 7 sells more (although I could be wrong o that). And Audi is still trying to move up to the top tier as recent surveys show that the brand is still lumped by N.A. with Acura, Volvo, Saab, etc. as a 2nd tier car. That came from the boss of Audi himself. When I had my A6 4.2 that went for 54K, people kept asking me why not a mercedes or bmw? I loved and still love Audi and did not care what others thought. Finally, as for offending me, do not worry. I could have had the A8, or 7 or S, I chose the VW because I liked it more and for me at least, the VW badge was a plus as I do not like to flash. Even with the new A8, 9 out of 10 people would be asking me the same thing, why not the Merc or BMW? You and I being fans of Audi know that Audi does not have the cache of the Mercedes or BMW. In the meantime, I am quite comfortable in my 75K VW which is quite frankly, speactacular. Enjoy your car too!

Arkay

There are many speculations about the upcoming S-class as many people still consider it the pinnacle of luxury sedans.

However, the fashion conscious crowd would easily choose the Phaeton because it is newer and let's face it, beautifully made compared to the current S-class and in Germany, the car is not just a transport, it's a statement. And they're not necessarily as "brand conscious" as American consumers, but more fashion conscious for the latest and greatest. That is what I've gathered from my time spent in Germany.

One very interesting bit of news that I've recently heard through someone at BMW NA is that Mercedes-Benz has made an announcement that they will be *REMOVING* over 400 electronic modules from their upcoming products in a bid to simplify. What a concept! This is perhaps mimicking the Japanese strategy to follow technical innovations instead of being an innovator, a safer approach. They've recently recalled their e-brake equipped cars (E & SL classes) and recalls like these hurt their image.

Plus, with the complexity of cars these days, few drivers if any will be willing to keep their cars much past their warranty periods for fear of huge repair expenses after the warranties have expired. As such, the dealers will be flooded with used luxury cars without warranties that will be hard to move, or offer manufacturer warranties with the possibility of high claim costs due to repairs.

Perhaps other manufacturers like Audi & BMW will take notice of this approach and reconsider their product planning. Interesting to see what happens over next 2-5 years...

Arkay

When I was in Germany, a colleague told me that the image of the Audi, BMW & Mercedes-Benz marques are very different in Germany compared to the American market.

BMW & Mercedes-Benz are both considered gentry luxury marques that appeal to the *same* demographics, that of financially secure and older segment. Of course, the nature of the cars are different enough that people choose them for different reasons.

But Audi, and by extension VW, appeal to the no less financially secure but younger and sportier crowd.

And there are lots of recent news about how Audi may tie up a relationship with Maserati by supplying Maserati with their Quattro drive train but getting Maserati engines as a possible basis for their upcoming Le Mans mid-engine sportscars or for other applications if Le Mans uses the Lamborghini Gallardo V10. Signalling that VW may be on its own to find its own unique luxury niche within the family should Audi move towards a more sporting path by moving towards the (in the German market segmentation) BMW/Mercedes-Benz segment of luxury buyers.

Just some thoughts on the market as a whole and a possible rational explanation for the ambitious VW Phaeton...more rational than that it was Ferdinand Piech's present to himself before his retirement from VW's helm!

FallenBMWer

The four-star hotel where I stayed in Berlin early last fall used a Phaeton for its limo service