Upper Control Arm Bushings - Problem Solved
03-02-2013, 01:50 PM
#21
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Just ordered two sets for my forward and rear upper control arm bushings.
While I'm "in the mood," what should I maybe be thinking about replacing in the rear of the car?
While I'm "in the mood," what should I maybe be thinking about replacing in the rear of the car?
03-03-2013, 08:00 AM
#22
AudiWorld Super User
Zero
Nothing in back. I have seen no evidence of wear back there on current Audis. It doesn't move in compound directions like the front does, carries less weight generally, and has less unsprung weight w/ smaller rotors and calipers.
If I were to watch anything in the longest term back there, it would be the roll bar attachment point track rods--at the end of the rods bolted to the suspension arm; more freedom of movement in that part as part of inherent design. But minor compared to the obvious underspec'ing now apparent on the upper control arms across much of the Audi product line nor 10 years+. Maybe 150-200K miles for close look, compared to 50-70K on the front upper control arms, especially the forward most one.
If I were to watch anything in the longest term back there, it would be the roll bar attachment point track rods--at the end of the rods bolted to the suspension arm; more freedom of movement in that part as part of inherent design. But minor compared to the obvious underspec'ing now apparent on the upper control arms across much of the Audi product line nor 10 years+. Maybe 150-200K miles for close look, compared to 50-70K on the front upper control arms, especially the forward most one.
03-03-2013, 10:10 AM
#23
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03-04-2013, 08:10 AM
#24
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Nothing in back. I have seen no evidence of wear back there on current Audis. It doesn't move in compound directions like the front does, carries less weight generally, and has less unsprung weight w/ smaller rotors and calipers.
If I were to watch anything in the longest term back there, it would be the roll bar attachment point track rods--at the end of the rods bolted to the suspension arm; more freedom of movement in that part as part of inherent design. But minor compared to the obvious underspec'ing now apparent on the upper control arms across much of the Audi product line nor 10 years+. Maybe 150-200K miles for close look, compared to 50-70K on the front upper control arms, especially the forward most one.
If I were to watch anything in the longest term back there, it would be the roll bar attachment point track rods--at the end of the rods bolted to the suspension arm; more freedom of movement in that part as part of inherent design. But minor compared to the obvious underspec'ing now apparent on the upper control arms across much of the Audi product line nor 10 years+. Maybe 150-200K miles for close look, compared to 50-70K on the front upper control arms, especially the forward most one.
Really looking forward to doing my front control arms with poly bushings, however!
03-04-2013, 08:41 AM
#25
AudiWorld Super User
As I've posted/modded before--
if you want to "tighten things up," consider changing the roll bars to the higher levels (sport and S8, as preferred). If you want to alter the handling to a bit more neutral and thus dial out some of the usual big Audi understeer, consider just doing the rear bar. The rear is the harder of the two, but it can be done w/out major disassembly. See my autosig link for the "how to."
Last edited by MP4.2+6.0; 03-04-2013 at 10:12 AM.
03-04-2013, 02:15 PM
#26
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if you want to "tighten things up," consider changing the roll bars to the higher levels (sport and S8, as preferred). If you want to alter the handling to a bit more neutral and thus dial out some of the usual big Audi understeer, consider just doing the rear bar. The rear is the harder of the two, but it can be done w/out major disassembly. See my autosig link for the "how to."
how much of a PITA is the rear in actuality? The front looks pretty simple?
03-05-2013, 07:50 AM
#27
AudiWorld Super User
Front very simple as you say; rear several hours; look at front U links
See the links in my signature below. It's all laid out there in lots of detail. If you do the front but not the rear, you will likely increase understeer--which is already pronounced on most Audis this one included. Thus, I suggest rear or both, but not front only. If only front, probably just change bushings if you want and call it good.
Also in front, look at the lower links--the U shaped aluminum pieces that tie the roll bar to the suspension. The bushings in those typically start to deform and may tear out a bit at <100K miles. Have changed them a couple times on the C5 A6 4.2, and got them changed at end of CPO warranty on the W12. Those seem to wear more than the roll bar bushings that are at the main bolt up points toward the center of the bar. After the front upper control arms, seems like the next suspension part with the most wear over the miles.
Also in front, look at the lower links--the U shaped aluminum pieces that tie the roll bar to the suspension. The bushings in those typically start to deform and may tear out a bit at <100K miles. Have changed them a couple times on the C5 A6 4.2, and got them changed at end of CPO warranty on the W12. Those seem to wear more than the roll bar bushings that are at the main bolt up points toward the center of the bar. After the front upper control arms, seems like the next suspension part with the most wear over the miles.
03-05-2013, 09:39 AM
#28
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See the links in my signature below. It's all laid out there in lots of detail. If you do the front but not the rear, you will likely increase understeer--which is already pronounced on most Audis this one included. Thus, I suggest rear or both, but not front only. If only front, probably just change bushings if you want and call it good.
Also in front, look at the lower links--the U shaped aluminum pieces that tie the roll bar to the suspension. The bushings in those typically start to deform and may tear out a bit at <100K miles. Have changed them a couple times on the C5 A6 4.2, and got them changed at end of CPO warranty on the W12. Those seem to wear more than the roll bar bushings that are at the main bolt up points toward the center of the bar. After the front upper control arms, seems like the next suspension part with the most wear over the miles.
Also in front, look at the lower links--the U shaped aluminum pieces that tie the roll bar to the suspension. The bushings in those typically start to deform and may tear out a bit at <100K miles. Have changed them a couple times on the C5 A6 4.2, and got them changed at end of CPO warranty on the W12. Those seem to wear more than the roll bar bushings that are at the main bolt up points toward the center of the bar. After the front upper control arms, seems like the next suspension part with the most wear over the miles.
Just another thing to add to the project list....
05-15-2013, 08:06 AM
#29
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It has been a little over 3 month since the Urethane bushings have been installed and I am still very happy with them. The bushings DID start to squeak recently and I broke down and spent 2 minutes squirting some white lithium grease on the bushings to quiet them down. This was the only grease I had nearby. I am sure there may be a better lubrication compound to solve this issue. It may be that every few months this may be needed, but I timed it and it took all of 2 minutes to resolve the issue on both left and right sides of the car, so I can put up with that. The car was raised to the lift mode and I could reach in and spray directly where needed.
05-16-2013, 01:00 PM
#30
Every poly bushing I've ever done, I've either had grease zirks on them, or added them to the bushing.
Makes it easy later to lube the bushings, and keep them silent.
I'm looking into replacement bushings/mounts that will fit the stock bars. (I have a D2 S8 now, but have owned a D3 A8l, and another D2 prior to that.)
Rear bar improvements on the A8 is the way to go. Less push in the corners is the result. Also firmer rear shocks can do wonders here too.
Makes it easy later to lube the bushings, and keep them silent.
I'm looking into replacement bushings/mounts that will fit the stock bars. (I have a D2 S8 now, but have owned a D3 A8l, and another D2 prior to that.)
Rear bar improvements on the A8 is the way to go. Less push in the corners is the result. Also firmer rear shocks can do wonders here too.