Here is a picture of Ubernugen vs. Blau strut mounts i got. Lets have everyone say what they think?
01-09-2005, 07:47 AM
#21
Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 4,355
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
what does your setup consist of? I don't get any spring bind, and I'm curious as to how our setups
<center><img src="http://aufhaus.com/quattro/coilovers/images/906.jpg"></center><p>differ.
what are you using for a top hat?
how/where does it bind?
what are you using for a top hat?
how/where does it bind?
01-09-2005, 10:57 AM
#23
AudiWorld Super User
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 21,018
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mance, got a question about this .....
"Amazing how much longer shocks live when free-floated in a fully bearing'd tube due to them rotating and deflecting loads all the way around their piston/sleeve diameter rather than in one spot constantly."
I am not sure I understand, but are you saying that the strut insert itself is capable of rotating inside the strut housing? I don't know much about this topic but it sounds interestig. Isn't the shock piston capable of rotating by itself?
tia
I am not sure I understand, but are you saying that the strut insert itself is capable of rotating inside the strut housing? I don't know much about this topic but it sounds interestig. Isn't the shock piston capable of rotating by itself?
tia
01-09-2005, 11:21 AM
#24
you're understanding is pretty accurate...
standard struts like Bilstein/Koni/Boge et al do have free-float pistons however due to the friction-fit (non-bearing'd) mounting between the threaded shaft hydraulic column and the upper spring perch its hard for them to rotate freely before something takes a "set" and then everything continues to take the same compression stroke on every cycle and wear is accelerated. Given that the strut hydraulic rod is usually forced to follow the steering pattern and associated wear/polishing of the inner strut tube occurs and an associated wear pattern also develops on the piston sealing ring. Once that occurs the hydraulic rod becomes harder to rotate and begins to wear at an accelerated rate in that static up/down wipe pattern as there is always a greater stress on the shocks internal piston "wheel side" on any car with negative camber tilt incorporated in the shock body. All springs tend to compress on the engine side more than the wheel side (hysterisis) which is constantly exerting outward pressure on the struts hydraulic rod.
Free float the shock tubes within the strut housing and the wear/wipe patterns are spread circumferentially around the piston sealing ring as well as the cartridge inside diameter. The piston is always rotating and wiping a different spot each time evenly thru strut rod/cartridge I.D and external body rotation. As long as it remains free-spinning wear is dramatically diminished.
Done correctly each strut cartridge has 4 additional bearings in the srtut tubes; 1ea thrust bearings at top and bottom of strut tubes and an upper/lower axial bearing at upper/lower cartridge body.
Free float the shock tubes within the strut housing and the wear/wipe patterns are spread circumferentially around the piston sealing ring as well as the cartridge inside diameter. The piston is always rotating and wiping a different spot each time evenly thru strut rod/cartridge I.D and external body rotation. As long as it remains free-spinning wear is dramatically diminished.
Done correctly each strut cartridge has 4 additional bearings in the srtut tubes; 1ea thrust bearings at top and bottom of strut tubes and an upper/lower axial bearing at upper/lower cartridge body.
01-09-2005, 07:32 PM
#26
Vortrag setup....I think the key is in the upper perch, I don't think Todd C. installed one...
I haven't pulled the suspension out yet (going to replace the upper mounts) but I suspect, based on what I see when I try to stick my head up there, that the spring is using the body work as its upper perch. I can hear the spring "boing!" at low speed (like anything below around 15mph). Also pretty positive that it is coming from the upper mount area, which is what led me to try and poke my head in there since I pulled the fenders.
That was just one of the MANY screw ups and oversights that occured with my car while he (Todd) wrenched on it. I mean, who puts two right hand calipers on the front "axle" of a car, then installs lines that are not the correct length which causes them to pinch roughly 50% closed? There was zero concern shown for annodizing or even painting the aluminum caliper carriers that he used to protect them from the environment, and they ended up loosing (guessing here) 15% of their mass due to corrosion. I've had to re-manufacture or repair several things on the car he installed, which is part of the reason why I haven't been able to race the car, and have not driven it since July 6th, 2003.
That was just one of the MANY screw ups and oversights that occured with my car while he (Todd) wrenched on it. I mean, who puts two right hand calipers on the front "axle" of a car, then installs lines that are not the correct length which causes them to pinch roughly 50% closed? There was zero concern shown for annodizing or even painting the aluminum caliper carriers that he used to protect them from the environment, and they ended up loosing (guessing here) 15% of their mass due to corrosion. I've had to re-manufacture or repair several things on the car he installed, which is part of the reason why I haven't been able to race the car, and have not driven it since July 6th, 2003.
01-09-2005, 07:33 PM
#27
Well poop, wrt the 43/44 item. It is nice and cheap.
I hadn't broken out one of the bearing catalogs yet that has all sorts of roller bearings in it, mainly because I haven't been able to find it since I moved two times in as many months over the summer......
01-10-2005, 06:14 AM
#29
Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 4,355
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
that's what I was thinking. when I ordered my kit from GC, they asked if I wanted the top hats for
Bilstein or Koni (for the differing nut shaft diameters).
when the kit came I was impressed that they machined them to clear the bottom of the strut bearing by 1-2mm, allowing for free movement.
(I've seen hop hats that weren't machined for a specific application, and once installed, butted up against the bottom of the strut bearing, didn't allow free movement of the whole setup... ...then "boing!", spring bind)
err, short story: GC has top hats of you're looking
when the kit came I was impressed that they machined them to clear the bottom of the strut bearing by 1-2mm, allowing for free movement.
(I've seen hop hats that weren't machined for a specific application, and once installed, butted up against the bottom of the strut bearing, didn't allow free movement of the whole setup... ...then "boing!", spring bind)
err, short story: GC has top hats of you're looking
01-10-2005, 06:17 AM
#30
Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 4,355
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
yes, my point-and-shoot digital camera is an old POS....
<center><img src="http://www.aufhaus.com/quattro/coilovers/images/903.jpg"></center><p>do I lose brownie points for that?? 
I was trying to show the top hat arrangement and clearance with strut bearing...
...here is top hat only
I was trying to show the top hat arrangement and clearance with strut bearing...
...here is top hat only