Glisse

I was finally able to drive the new 3.0TFSI supercharged KoVoMo engine with the ZF8HP transmission this week. The S5 Coupé (I'm considering an S5 Sportback) was on 19" wheels, Hankook Ventus S1 Evo2 255/35 summer tyres, Sports differential, and S sport adaptive suspension, and Dynamic steering.

I only had 45 minutes available, so took the car to a back road loop that I know well which has a mix of surfaces, tight corners, and extreme elevation changes - often all at the same time. Roads were dry. Primary impressions from the short drive were:

The engine & transmission was noticeably less crisp than the supercharged engine with S tronic, but more mid range torque and more top end power. Not quite as smooth either, but that may improve with time. Hard to tell how much it was the engine vs the transmission that was softening throttle response and gear changes. It was significantly more aggressive and responsive manually shifting whilst in Dynamic mode. So I am not sure Audi quite nailed the transmission maps. But it was certainly better than the A4 3.0TDI quattro with ZF8HP I had previously driven.

Engine/exhaust sound was okay, but doesn't vary (in tone) with revs. Quiet in D mode, much more sound in S mode. If bangs and pops are important, these were most obvious in Manual mode.

Handling was exceptional. It is a big improvement over the B8. You can feel how much stiffer the chassis is in the MLB Evo platform. The front end seems much more precise. The car is extremely agile, and feels light. The adaptive suspension works well. It is distinctly firmer than the Sport adaptive suspension I have driven in an A4, but remains compliant enough. I did not find a huge difference in ride compliance between Comfort and Dynamic, but there is a big difference in roll resistance between the two settings. It stays very flat in aggressive cornering when in Dynamic mode - most impressive. The suspension is very quiet. Steering was direct, not normally a fan of Dynamic Steering, but this felt okay and was very accurate.

Other random observations:

• Car looks smaller in real life than the pics.
• The crease lines are very sharp, and very obvious. It certainly lacks elegance compared to the B8, but it is more aggressive, almost brutal looking.
• The S sport seats are okay, good support for brisk driving, but on the flat and hard side rather than plush and comfy.
• The 19" Cavo wheels looked just enough wheel for the design (I thought they must have been 18s when I first saw the car). I can understand why Audi have been using 20" wheels on many of their show cars. These will come as an option in time.
• The car continues in the B9 vein of being very refined and solid feeling within its class. For me, the difference is very obvious vs both Mercedes and BMW. Whilst both have certain attributes I like, I find the materials and construction quality in Mercedes to be patchy at best, and the BMW to suffer from a lot of wind noise and suspension chatter. And neither the C43 or 435i xDrive (have not driven a 440i) handle as well as the new S5.

Whilst I would much prefer a crisper engine/transmission setup, any disappointment there was more than offset by the improvement in handling and road feel.

The RS5 has the potential to be epic, given there will be very little weight increase in the nose vs this S5. That TT engine version should have a bit more character, too.

plat27265

Great review on the B9 S5, Glisse! Thank you for sharing your non-journalist impressions and observations.

I wonder if the lack of crispness is because of the engine having just a single turbo charger which develops strong torque much later compared to the B8.5's supercharger. It would be certainly be interesting to find out if the lack of crispness will be addressed by the twin-turbo set-up in the B9 RS5.

Glisse

Thanks Plat.

No, never noticed any turbo lag. The twin scroll turbo tucked inside the Vee has very short path lengths and you don't really notice any spooling up effects. It is already making a lot of torque by 1400rpm, and certainly whilst in S mode the transmission will never have the engine lower than this speed except for the first second of a standing start.

More a feeling of sponginess relative to the previous engine/transmission. Very hard to say whether it is throttle mapping, transmission mapping - there is just so much electronics and software between the right foot and the engine in today's cars. And of course this was a new car, and they always feel a bit congested for the first 1000km or so.

This is all personal opinion and I am old school in that I prefer the feel of a naturally aspirated engine, etc. I find most of the current FI V6 turbocharged engines all a bit generic.

But one point I forgot to make is I have had a concern for a while that Audi has been progressively making their S models softer. This isn't - I can't over emphasise just how good the front end of this car feels

dseag2

That mirrors the feeling of the B9 A4. The handling is pretty neutral and oversteer seems to be a thing of the past. Even the A4 is a really fun car to drive.

MattMan3104

Good stuff Glisse. Thanks for sharing your impressions and observations. I too am interested in the sportback and it will be hard waiting around to test drive one.

SloopJohnB@mac.com

You're looking at $70K for the Alfa vs $80K for the audi....plus the RS5 appears to be vaporware with a 2018 delivery/release as 2019 model?? Unless Audi moves it forward.
My infö is somewhat dated Sep 2016 but still.

superswiss

Thanks for the review. The B8 was known for having too much flex in the front end, but that was easily remedied with one of the aftermarket subframe braces such as the Alu Kreuz, leading to a much more precise front end and steering. Would be interesting to get a comparison between a B8 with aftermarket brace and the B9. Sounds like they corrected one of the biggest flaws of the B8. I've had the Alu Kreuz on my RS5 since almost the beginning and the difference is very noticeable if you are sensitive to a precise front end and steering.

Glisse

No idea when the RS5 will be sold in the US, but here in Europe still on track for late summer/autumn 2017. Here the Alfa is around the same price as an S5 Sportback, actually quite a bit less if both are optioned up. Alfa comes with relatively few options, all the Germans need 20-25% added to the base price for options. Different in the US, with "packaged" pricing. Makes the Alfa a "bargain" here, and the RS5 a bargain in the US. But to see a powerful rear wheel drive car on the road in winter in Switzerland is about as common as seeing a mermaid.

Glisse

Yes, the new 5 link front suspension design must be helping, as is the stiffer MLB Evo chassis. But it was the combination of those, the S sport adaptive suspension in Dynamic, the lighter weight, and the Sport diff that made it all come together. Other B9s I have driven over the same route were good, but nowhere near as flat, neutral, and keen to turn in and rotate. The rear was getting light whilst the front was still locked in and not moving a centimetre off-line. In Comfort mode, the car felt like it wanted to run wide. The only other car I have driven over the same route that felt as good in the front was the RS5 with DRC - that was perhaps even a bit flatter, but then the ride is very stiff. And the S5 feels more agile.

Engine a different story of course, new one even further away than the old vs the NA 4.2 in terms of character, and charisma. Certainly the 2.9 version going into the RS5 should have better "feel" given comments on the 430hp version in the Panamera 4S, but perhaps depends on how Audi tune it. Also depends whether Audi will use their 48V system, meaning EPC and active roll stabilisation could be used. But suspect this adds a lot of weight. Porsche claimed they couldn't fit the 48v system into the Panamera, so are running the 48v active stabilisation system off a DC/DC converter as it doesn't require much current. Impossible to tell from the latest RS5 Nurbürgring videos what they were using, although the car looked quick.

JD15

Two questions:
1) Have you driven the S4? If so, how different is the feel from the S5?
2) Aside from the obvious difference in top-end power, can you compare the 252 hp 2.0T/DSG combo in the A4/A5 to the 3.0T/ZF8?