Well, its been a week since I got my S5 (Long)
06-05-2008, 07:50 PM
#1
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Well, its been a week since I got my S5 (Long)
Phantom/Magma, Tip, fully loaded, SS inlays
I was excited to pick up the car last week but a little perplexed that the ride felt so knobbly. I suspected the tire pressures were too high and when I checked I found them to be between 47 and 50 PSI!! After reducing the pressures to the recommended values the ride felt much better, though I have to say that it still feels to bouncy along Socal freeways. I don't remember it being that way when I drove the demo. Overall damping feels great but, for me, the suspension setup feels just a bit too firm. I would like to review options on how to get a more compliant ride on the freeway without losing the handling balance and sharp turn-in the car currently has. Any ideas?
I am sure a lot of you have questions about the Tip. I was underwhelmed with the transmission when I first got the car. It was just too eager to change up (in drive) causing the car to feel sluggish. It would change up around 2-2.5K under normal in-town acceleration. Setting it in Sport mode was completely different and much more in keeping with the nature of the car (but also more thirsty). Since the transmission is adaptive I have trained it to rev a bit more before changing up, and each day it feels a bit better. I have spent almost all the time with it set in Drive and rarely use the sport setting yet (the time will come after it is broken in).
The shift paddles are great and the transmission changes pretty much instantly upon paddle operation. Left in Drive, you can use the paddles to shift up or down, and after a few seconds it will automatically go back to Drive mode. If you set the shift lever to TIP mode, it stays in manual - nice feature.
Overall the transmission is very smooth - much smoother than the same unit in my A8.
Everything else is pretty great. Love the exhaust note - for me the sound is just right - loud enough inside the car to enjoy it without it getting in the way of listening to music/radio. The B & O system is also a nice improvement on the Bose unit in the A8 - mid range and highs are quite impressive, but the bass is a bit woolly and uncontrolled. I am not a bass freak as I mostly listen to Jazz and acoustic music, but it could definitely be better.
Only choice I kind of regret is the stainless steel inserts. The combination of SS inserts with the piano black console is attractive, but when you remember that those 4 strips of SS cost $750, it looks like poor value. If I had to do it over. I would go for the carbon and save a little cash.
I have grown to like the side assist feature. Contrary to other reports, the system does not beep at all. It just works with a set of flashing lights (whose brightness you can adjust) set into the door mirror housings - unobtrusive, yet effective. Highly recommended.
I was excited to pick up the car last week but a little perplexed that the ride felt so knobbly. I suspected the tire pressures were too high and when I checked I found them to be between 47 and 50 PSI!! After reducing the pressures to the recommended values the ride felt much better, though I have to say that it still feels to bouncy along Socal freeways. I don't remember it being that way when I drove the demo. Overall damping feels great but, for me, the suspension setup feels just a bit too firm. I would like to review options on how to get a more compliant ride on the freeway without losing the handling balance and sharp turn-in the car currently has. Any ideas?
I am sure a lot of you have questions about the Tip. I was underwhelmed with the transmission when I first got the car. It was just too eager to change up (in drive) causing the car to feel sluggish. It would change up around 2-2.5K under normal in-town acceleration. Setting it in Sport mode was completely different and much more in keeping with the nature of the car (but also more thirsty). Since the transmission is adaptive I have trained it to rev a bit more before changing up, and each day it feels a bit better. I have spent almost all the time with it set in Drive and rarely use the sport setting yet (the time will come after it is broken in).
The shift paddles are great and the transmission changes pretty much instantly upon paddle operation. Left in Drive, you can use the paddles to shift up or down, and after a few seconds it will automatically go back to Drive mode. If you set the shift lever to TIP mode, it stays in manual - nice feature.
Overall the transmission is very smooth - much smoother than the same unit in my A8.
Everything else is pretty great. Love the exhaust note - for me the sound is just right - loud enough inside the car to enjoy it without it getting in the way of listening to music/radio. The B & O system is also a nice improvement on the Bose unit in the A8 - mid range and highs are quite impressive, but the bass is a bit woolly and uncontrolled. I am not a bass freak as I mostly listen to Jazz and acoustic music, but it could definitely be better.
Only choice I kind of regret is the stainless steel inserts. The combination of SS inserts with the piano black console is attractive, but when you remember that those 4 strips of SS cost $750, it looks like poor value. If I had to do it over. I would go for the carbon and save a little cash.
I have grown to like the side assist feature. Contrary to other reports, the system does not beep at all. It just works with a set of flashing lights (whose brightness you can adjust) set into the door mirror housings - unobtrusive, yet effective. Highly recommended.
06-05-2008, 08:19 PM
#2
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breaking it in...
there was an earlier post where some ex-audi mechanic said you should 'beat the snot' out of the car to 'set the rings' otherwise your car will be drinking much oil for the rest of its days...
06-05-2008, 09:06 PM
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I agree...
Although I'm MOSTLY going to baby it through the first 1000 miles, Im going to give it a fairly decent variety of driving experiences, but only after it has warmed up to operating levels. I dont think I'll redline it, but I'll prolly try and get it past 3500 a few times to be sure, including some extended highway sessions motoring at 100+. (notice, I didnt say KM or MPH) Hehe.
06-05-2008, 11:28 PM
#5
I have to wonder why Audi would waste the time of the technical writer, translation, and
throw away all that ink and paper, just to outline how the engine should be broken in, when all you need to do is do what you really want to do;-P
The guy who has espoused the motorcycle engine break-in method has aggressively marketed himself and lots of people like the idea that they can hammer a car (or bike) immediately upon puchase;-)
Granted, engine machining technology has advanced, but you can bet some bean counter got together with some engineer and looked at the number of claims resulting from different types of break-in and use. Federal Mogul says their top rings do not need to be broken in, but the lower oil control rings need several thousand miles to fully seat.
A transmission often needs breaking in as well. Something not noted by racers who either have super-honed trannies or are willing to put up with clunks in the name of expediency. A good example would be to hook up a 10,000 trailer to a new truck and see how long the diff lasts...
I kinda figure that hundreds if not thousands of engineers over many years have figured this out better than a single guy who has done a wonderful job of promoting his point of view. Yeah, he builds and races bikes, but that has a different set of priorities from street cars. Remember he's rebuilding those engines once or twice a race season, and the goal is to have max power as soon as possible.
Here's another (motorcycle based again) point of view
http://www.rc51.org/breakin.htm
And a magazine article:
"Motoman claims his procedure works on all four-stroke engines, though he admits that most of the 300 engines he's tested power air-cooled motorcycles and snowmobiles.
Could beating on a brand-new car engine boost its performance? Are manufacturers simply hesitant to recommend a full-throttle break-in out of fear of drivers exceeding speed limits?
For answers, I rang up long-time GM engine guru Dave Lancaster, and he agrees that in smaller, low-cost air-cooled engines (which expand and contract more as temperatures change) such a technique might indeed pay off. But the microfinished bores, high-tension rings, and precision-build tolerances in today's automotive engines yield excellent ring sealing from new, so any change in power output attributable to such a radical procedure would be miniscule if measurable at all. He notes that power and fuel economy generally improve throughout the break-in period as friction diminishes in all moving parts. Ford's engine durability specialist Mike Herr concurs with all the above as do the engine R&D experts at Honda.
Motoman counters by arguing that the fine machining and high-precision build quality of modern engines serve only to shorten the window of opportunity to "seat the rings," making it even more important to do the heavy-duty accels right off the bat. But if his procedure works, why don't manufacturers perform it in the plant on a dyno, especially on performance engines like the handbuilt Corvette LS7 and supercharged Northstar? They would, but Lancaster and Herr confirm the only engines that get such treatment are those undergoing torture-testing during development to ensure that the Motomans of the world won't ring up big warranty claims.
My final problem with these Web claims is that they seem unverifiable. Since no two engines--especially smaller, cheaper ones--produce equivalent power fresh off the assembly line, it's impossible to attribute small performance differences to a break-in procedure. So it's your choice: Follow your owner's manual recommendations (which usually entail gentle driving at varying engine speeds and no towing for between 300 and 1000 miles); or pursue Web logic in hopes of gaining a racer's edge of added performance."
(http://www.motortrend.com/features/editorial/112_0603_technologue_race_performance/)
In any case, my cars have all had a conservative (but not babying after the first 100 miles) break-in, and the lowest miles car I have sold is 127K miles and running fine. My Alfa has 268K miles, sees redline every time the oil is warm enough, and sees the track a few times a year - burns no oil. Our RS4 had a fairly conservative break-in, and once past 5K miles, consumes no oil.
The guy who has espoused the motorcycle engine break-in method has aggressively marketed himself and lots of people like the idea that they can hammer a car (or bike) immediately upon puchase;-)
Granted, engine machining technology has advanced, but you can bet some bean counter got together with some engineer and looked at the number of claims resulting from different types of break-in and use. Federal Mogul says their top rings do not need to be broken in, but the lower oil control rings need several thousand miles to fully seat.
A transmission often needs breaking in as well. Something not noted by racers who either have super-honed trannies or are willing to put up with clunks in the name of expediency. A good example would be to hook up a 10,000 trailer to a new truck and see how long the diff lasts...
I kinda figure that hundreds if not thousands of engineers over many years have figured this out better than a single guy who has done a wonderful job of promoting his point of view. Yeah, he builds and races bikes, but that has a different set of priorities from street cars. Remember he's rebuilding those engines once or twice a race season, and the goal is to have max power as soon as possible.
Here's another (motorcycle based again) point of view
http://www.rc51.org/breakin.htm
And a magazine article:
"Motoman claims his procedure works on all four-stroke engines, though he admits that most of the 300 engines he's tested power air-cooled motorcycles and snowmobiles.
Could beating on a brand-new car engine boost its performance? Are manufacturers simply hesitant to recommend a full-throttle break-in out of fear of drivers exceeding speed limits?
For answers, I rang up long-time GM engine guru Dave Lancaster, and he agrees that in smaller, low-cost air-cooled engines (which expand and contract more as temperatures change) such a technique might indeed pay off. But the microfinished bores, high-tension rings, and precision-build tolerances in today's automotive engines yield excellent ring sealing from new, so any change in power output attributable to such a radical procedure would be miniscule if measurable at all. He notes that power and fuel economy generally improve throughout the break-in period as friction diminishes in all moving parts. Ford's engine durability specialist Mike Herr concurs with all the above as do the engine R&D experts at Honda.
Motoman counters by arguing that the fine machining and high-precision build quality of modern engines serve only to shorten the window of opportunity to "seat the rings," making it even more important to do the heavy-duty accels right off the bat. But if his procedure works, why don't manufacturers perform it in the plant on a dyno, especially on performance engines like the handbuilt Corvette LS7 and supercharged Northstar? They would, but Lancaster and Herr confirm the only engines that get such treatment are those undergoing torture-testing during development to ensure that the Motomans of the world won't ring up big warranty claims.
My final problem with these Web claims is that they seem unverifiable. Since no two engines--especially smaller, cheaper ones--produce equivalent power fresh off the assembly line, it's impossible to attribute small performance differences to a break-in procedure. So it's your choice: Follow your owner's manual recommendations (which usually entail gentle driving at varying engine speeds and no towing for between 300 and 1000 miles); or pursue Web logic in hopes of gaining a racer's edge of added performance."
(http://www.motortrend.com/features/editorial/112_0603_technologue_race_performance/)
In any case, my cars have all had a conservative (but not babying after the first 100 miles) break-in, and the lowest miles car I have sold is 127K miles and running fine. My Alfa has 268K miles, sees redline every time the oil is warm enough, and sees the track a few times a year - burns no oil. Our RS4 had a fairly conservative break-in, and once past 5K miles, consumes no oil.
06-06-2008, 06:03 AM
#7
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I also went from an A8 to S5 Tip.
I also have the SS inserts and although overpriced I like the look.
I find the S5's seats are actually more comfortable than the A8's. The B & O stereo seems more accurate than the A8's Bose but the bottom end on both is pretty muddy. The tire pressure monitoring system is now an idiot light which I find rediculous since my 05 A8 gave you pressures and temps. for all 5 tires.
Regarding the harsh ride I think other than changing the shocks/springs the major reason is the low profile tires which on a 4000 lb. car makes for a stiff ride. You could change to 18" wheels with wider sidewalls but the handling and the look will suffer. You could also try lowering the tire pressures a bit but you risk damaging your wheels if you hit a pothole.
I find the S5's seats are actually more comfortable than the A8's. The B & O stereo seems more accurate than the A8's Bose but the bottom end on both is pretty muddy. The tire pressure monitoring system is now an idiot light which I find rediculous since my 05 A8 gave you pressures and temps. for all 5 tires.
Regarding the harsh ride I think other than changing the shocks/springs the major reason is the low profile tires which on a 4000 lb. car makes for a stiff ride. You could change to 18" wheels with wider sidewalls but the handling and the look will suffer. You could also try lowering the tire pressures a bit but you risk damaging your wheels if you hit a pothole.
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06-06-2008, 06:28 AM
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This week I went from an S5 to an A8 and its interesting to note differences..
the dash of the S5 is so much better in its driver oriented MMI screen.
The one thing I wish the S5 had is the exact pressure AND temperature of the tires through the MMI found in the A8. Also, the A8 has more ways of adjusting the seats, although I love the S5 seats sometimes I wish I could make more adjustments. Lastly, the A8 is geared much better for the highway, where I spend most of my time while in 6th gear, I would like improved mileage.. And I am still curious as to which sound system has better lows..
I can't wait to get my coupe back next week though! I miss the 6 speed and that oh so sweet free flowing exhaust.
Audi makes some outstanding cars.
The one thing I wish the S5 had is the exact pressure AND temperature of the tires through the MMI found in the A8. Also, the A8 has more ways of adjusting the seats, although I love the S5 seats sometimes I wish I could make more adjustments. Lastly, the A8 is geared much better for the highway, where I spend most of my time while in 6th gear, I would like improved mileage.. And I am still curious as to which sound system has better lows..
I can't wait to get my coupe back next week though! I miss the 6 speed and that oh so sweet free flowing exhaust.
Audi makes some outstanding cars.
06-06-2008, 07:51 AM
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you running stock 19's with the Dunlops?
can't comment on the A8 or tip as I came from a B6S4 with 18's and I have a manual but I run the socal freeway's all time and I think the car is a delight there and everywhere around town, the ride has to be the biggest improvements to me over the s4. everyone that has been in the car is amazed of how smooth it is so I wonder what is going on with yours. agree re the carbon, I love it. I just flat out love this car, its perfect for LA. have a nice weekend driving that sucker!
2008 S5 | 6MT | Phantom | Black Cow | Carbon | Tech | Nav
2008 S5 | 6MT | Phantom | Black Cow | Carbon | Tech | Nav