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Gen2 Audi R8 V10 AWD vs RWS

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Gen2 Audi R8 V10 AWD vs RWS

 
Old 01-22-2019, 08:01 PM
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Default Gen2 Audi R8 V10 AWD vs RWS

Hi everyone, I have been doing my research and decided on going for a V10 over V8 (due to service problems). However, I am having trouble deciding between the legendary quattro or the RWS... The price difference between the two are decently big too. What are your thoughts?
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Old 01-23-2019, 06:56 PM
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Lucky you.
IMHO there are many other RWD options out there, one of the reasons to pick an R8 is for quattro.
Also the quattro model comes with magnetic suspension and has more standard color options if that is an issue for you.
Some other differences available on the quattro model include:
different wheel options
optional laser highbeams
optional diamond seat leather
option for carbon brakes

Also I believe the quattro comes standard with B&O stereo which if you want in the RWS you need the $7800 premium package which includes other things as well

Basically the RWS is more bare bones and sans quattro. It is also a tiny bit slower according to spec.

Personally if I had that kind of scratch I could not resist an R8 Performance but up at my altitude my Stage I S6 has more HP than the NA R8...if it only weighed less. LOL
Good luck...tough choice to have.

Last edited by gk1; 01-23-2019 at 07:00 PM.
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Old 01-23-2019, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by gk1 View Post
Lucky you.
IMHO there are many other RWD options out there, one of the reasons to pick an R8 is for quattro.
Also the quattro model comes with magnetic suspension and has more standard color options if that is an issue for you.
Some other differences available on the quattro model include:
different wheel options
optional laser highbeams
optional diamond seat leather
option for carbon brakes

Also I believe the quattro comes standard with B&O stereo which if you want in the RWS you need the $7800 premium package which includes other things as well

Basically the RWS is more bare bones and sans quattro. It is also a tiny bit slower according to spec.

Personally if I had that kind of scratch I could not resist an R8 Performance but up at my altitude my Stage I S6 has more HP than the NA R8...if it only weighed less. LOL
Good luck...tough choice to have.
One issue I have is the mag ride suspension... I don't think you can change that in the Quattro but I believe you can in the RWS? Also I hear the ride quality isn't as fun since the "safety net" is too much in the Quattro vs the RWS. Haven't test driven one yet.

I compared the prices with options added to both and they look about the same but the price difference is a bit too much to justify the difference in all wheel or rear wheel (minus the slightly lower horsepower). Ceramic breaks and highbeams I don't care too much. Plus ceramic is known to squeak more due to the material used to make it.

V10 Quattro:
Ara Blue Crystal
Black optic package
Carbon interior & exterior
Red brake calipers
Diamond stitch full leather package w/ contrast stitching
Audi Care

MSRP $164,900 | Optional equipment $20,424 | Total w/ destination $186,574

V10 RWS:
Ara Blue Crystal
20" Y Spoke
Carbon interior
Premium package
Audi Care
(black optics is apparently already included which is nice)

MSRP $138,700 | Optional equipment $15,124 | Total w/ destination $155,074

The price difference is about $31,000. I just don't see how the Quattro and extra bit of horsepower justifies the gap... unless there is something more that I am missing.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:51 AM
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I just leased a R8 V10 Quattro 35 days ago, and it is amazing! One of the most unexpected parts of the car is the adjustable dampers. Comfort mode makes it ride like an A4, something I just never expected in a car of this type. The suspension adjustability provides a shocking bandwidth of capability. This car is my only car, my daily driver, so ride comfort was a consideration for me, along with the ability to negotiate winter. Obviously AWD was a requirement for me, and I've been snow drift-busting for month now without issue. I've also never owned a RWD car, and the AWD gives me a little more confidence during spirited performance driving to make up for my driving deficiencies.

But....it's hard to deny the RWS is huge price savings that gets you the V10 experience with significantly less cash outlay. This car is all about the V10, and the RWS gives you every ounce of that. Carbon ceramics, carbon inlays, stitched seats....yes, they are undeniably cool features than enthusiasts want, but they really add little to the actual driving experience or ownership of the car from a practical standpoint. I'm probably one of the biggest enthusiasts there are, but I skipped those features in the interest of price. Some say "if you spend this much money, what's another $20,000 in options", but the reality is some of us stretch our budget to obtain this car, and price does matter. Yes I wish I had laser lights and a carbon-trimmed cabin, but for me....when I'm pulling the paddle at 9,000 rpms with that V10 screaming behind me any reminders of my butt not sitting on quilted seats goes out the window.

If the RWS rides acceptably to you, and you'll enjoy the pure driving experience of RWD over AWD and don't mind missing out on a few high-end features, go all in and get one. The fantastic looks,V10 and and DSG experience isn't diminished in the slightest with the RWS. But I'd highly recommend the Premium pack to access the B & O audio system if you enjoy music...it's simply phenomenal with a subwoofer that is ridiculous.
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Old 01-24-2019, 06:09 PM
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It depends on how you are planning on driving it. I had the opportunity to drive all versions of the R8 extensively, except for the RWS. I hope I get the opportunity eventually, but I drove the regular V10 coupe and spyder as well as the V10 Plus. Each one on 200+ miles canyon runs with a mix of regular driving and bolting through deserted canyons. For what it's worth, I didn't like the regular V10 with the MagRide. I agree with farmerjones that for regular driving, the suspension is very adjustable and the car is very livable. It doesn't work well in low speed city driving, though as the transmission gets rather clunky in stop&go low speed settings, but that wasn't the main detraction. The main issue I had with it is when driven hard in the canyons, the driving dynamics was very disappointing. The quattro in the R8 is not the legendary quattro. It is a haldex like system mounted the opposite way from the A3/TT. It primarily drives the rear wheels and sends power to the front wheels as needed, which in theory is a great setup for a performance car. In reality, the R8 implementation is an understeering mess. The moment you get on the throttle in a hard corner, the front end starts to pull wide. You can really feel the pull. If you manage to push through the understeer it eventually suddenly oversteers, but you need room for that. On public roads it can get really frighting as it oversteers rather unpredictably. I started out with ESP in sport mode and got surprised by unexpected oversteer a couple of times and eventually just left ESP on. The V10 Plus was better and the reason for that is the fixed suspension and the Performance mode, which sits above Dynamic mode and has three submodes for dry, wet and snow. Many have coined it the Huracan mode. It really brings on a whole new dimension.

To give you some background, I've owned RWD cars, and my current daily is a 2013 RS5. The RS5 feels much more like a proper RWD car and does an excellent job putting down power and carving an exit line from a corner w/o strange pull on the front axle. Coming from this center differential setup with the active torque vectoring sport rear differential in the RS5, the regular R8 was very disappointing to me. Don't take it from me, here is what professional race car driver Randy Pobst had to say. Full disclosure, he was talking about the previous generation R8, but in my experience the current generation R8 has much of the same issues. The previous gen R8 used a viscous AWD system.

Given how high Randy was on the 507, we figured the less powerful, heavier RS 5 had no shot. We couldn't have been more wrong. Posting a best lap of 1:42.97, it was 0.48 second quicker, but Randy's comments suggested more like 4.8 seconds. "The R8 should be half this good! This car is fantastic. I adore it. It does such a great job utilizing all-wheel-drive traction off the corner, with zero push. You just drive in there and you think it's too early, but you just floor it and you're like, man, I should've gotten on the gas sooner. And no push, no oversteer -- it just drives right out of there, beautifully carving an exit line, using all the power.
Source: https://www.motortrend.com/cars/merc...07-comparison/

If an R8 suited my lifestyle and I were to buy one, I would get the RWS despite not having driven one or the V10 Plus if it had to be AWD. My weapon of choice, though, are 2+2 GT coupes for their blend of performance, rest comfort and enough practically for occasional rear passengers and room to fit all the gear for a weekend out of town. For that reason, I have a 2019 AMG C63 S Coupe on order. An R8 would be a weekend fun car only for me, so the driving dynamics would need to be top notch. BTW, the original Huracan has similar issues and complaints regarding understeer and driving dynamics. Lambo took another stab at it with the Performante and nailed it. Now the new Huracan Evo takes a lot from the Performante and introduces LDVI, which is a central chassis ECU that is pulling and polling data from various sensors and adjusts the dynamics with the help of torque vectoring etc. Similar to what the RS5 is doing with the active rear differential and other performance cars nowadays. It's a level of dynamism that the current R8 can't match. I realize it's at a higher price point, but I would get the new Huracan Evo over any R8.

Last edited by superswiss; 01-24-2019 at 06:38 PM.
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Old 01-24-2019, 07:43 PM
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Thanks guys and congrats once again farmerjones on the upgrade! I think the general consensus is to get a RWS for its price point and driving experience compared to the AWD V10. The only thing I need to confirm is the option to switch out mag ride since I don't want to deal with having to replace those expensive pieces. And yes I would definitely get the premium package since music is almost as important as ride quality for me (huge EDM guy!).
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:03 PM
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I usually agree with superswiss a lot, but I have to adamantly disagree with him here! His characterizing 4 key areas of the R8 performance is the polar opposite of mine.

1.) Suspension with the adjustable dampers is a dream in the city. I have no idea what he refers to as "doesn't work in the city at low speeds". The suspension in comfort is A4-ride quality, and in dynamic is actually stiffer than the fixed suspension on the Plus model we get. I understand for tracking the car sometimes a fixed suspension can be more consistent, but I can't image very many complain about the adjustable dampers. Apparently some reviews say they don't handle speed bumps perfectly, but I don't live in an area to offer first-hand experience with that (and can't image how a car handles a speed bump would influence my decisions on what suspension to buy). In my option, the mag ride is one of this cars most shinning achievements, and many of the review overwhelming support that sentiment.

2.) The transmission being "clunky in stop and go traffic" is completely opposite of my experience It's every bit as smooth as my TT is in town. If you put it into sport mode then the shifts get to be more aggressive when downshifting, and it can be more harsh...but that's why comfort mode exists. The shifts are basically imperceptible in slow city driving, again...like an A4 in my experience.

3.) The AWD system is like an A3. That's incorrect. The R8 does not need wheel spin to shift power like an A3 does. The R8 runs a default 30/70 power split, but can send 100% of the torque to either axel (if such a theoretical situation occurred). With the computing power on board the R8 predicts wheel spin and adjust torque splits in advance. Floor the accelerator, crank the wheel suddenly, pull high G-forces...just a few example of actions that cause the AWD to preemptively shift power before any meaningful traction loss is needed. An A3 does nothing of the sort. Mechanically similar, they do not perform the same way in real world driving. Note the R8 has a separate cooling circut just for the front differential because of the massive amount of continuous power routed through the front wheels, again....nothing like the "temporary AWD" of an A3.

4.) Understeer. WHAT? I can't fathom what superswiss is talking bout or what he expereinced on his afternoon drive, but this is not a problem with this car. I spent the afternoon on a rain-soaked Circuit of the Americas Track in Austin in the R8 for over 100 miles of laps, and understeer was the last thing I experienced. In fact, this one of the hi lights so many drivers mentioned on our track day...how could there be so little understeer on a wet track with 600+ horsepower? It was the smart AWD working, along with the torque vectoring of the front wheels via braking of the huge, power disc/pistons.

Superswiss described the car as "frighting as it oversteers rather unpredictably." I again can't not disagree more. This car is rock-stable, making it nearly boring to drive, one of the biggest criticism of the car. There is no way Audi will turn loose regular Joe's out onto a soaking-wet track with R8s and let them exceed 150 mph as we chase each other around the track in a car that is "unpredictable". I don't want to be too critical of superswiss's experience, and I'm glad he shared his experience...but I'm not sure why it doesn't match up with so many others.

Don't' confuse the "old" R8 handling with the "new" R8 handling. They are completely different cars with 100% different AWD systems, and it's a mammoth different.

I've worked up to this R8 ownership for months, and I swear I've read or watched about every review on this planet of the R8. I've never understood Randy Pobst's comments about the R8 and it's understeer, because you can't hardly find another professional car review that shares his experience. Maybe it was that track, or the temperate, or the tires, but his description of the car is not common. Other reviewers like Chris Evans or Sabine Schmitz or countless other reviews make virtually zero mention of understeer or oversteer...the AWD of this car just makes that virtually impossible. Also, the R8 doesn't need any fancy torque vectoring rear diff like the RS5, because it's balanced so much better. The RS5 has to have that in the rear to counteract the heavy front end that wants to understeer. There are many reviews of how the RS5 handling is a let down, with endless front end washing out, which is why the active rear differential basically exists. Remember the R8 has a locking rear differential to put down the power as well.

Anyways....it's super enjoyable to share my experience with my new R8! As you can guess it's just thrilling to be behind the wheel of this every day. Certainly it's important to get peoples different perspectives, so it's great superswiss chimed in here. It's probably very important that a prospective owner gets a chance to drive one personally to help better understand the car's behavior. Of course you don't get to test drive on a track very often (which I did with the Audi Driving Experience which was really helpful). Certainly the Plus model is the more track-oriented car, but you'll not in Euro a huge majority of Plus cars sold are with the adjustable dampers (not available in North America). To be honest, no mater if you choose, RWS, V10 or Plus....you would be all smiles every time you take a drive.



Last edited by farmerjones; 01-24-2019 at 08:25 PM.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by superdl View Post
... since music is almost as important as ride quality for me (huge EDM guy!).
You and I would get along very well! With windchills int eh -20 degrees range last night I wanted to take the R8 out for a drive, but the roads were horrible. So I sat in the garage for 30 minutes and jammed out to some BT, Sultan + Shepard, EDX and Hardwell. Seriously....the sub in these cars just pound with a clarity and range I've not heard in very many cars ever before...I know the V10 makes awesome noises, but sometimes you just gotta crank up the EDM.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by farmerjones View Post
You and I would get along very well! With windchills int eh -20 degrees range last night I wanted to take the R8 out for a drive, but the roads were horrible. So I sat in the garage for 30 minutes and jammed out to some BT, Sultan + Shepard, EDX and Hardwell. Seriously....the sub in these cars just pound with a clarity and range I've not heard in very many cars ever before...I know the V10 makes awesome noises, but sometimes you just gotta crank up the EDM.
My goodness I really appreciate your thorough opinions and insight. If you like music like me, we are already brothers hahaha. I got two things to mention though before I forget... I recently noticed that my 2017 TT has issues with the windows when it gets real cold (lately temps have been dropping to almost single digit which doesn't happen too often). The window won't go down like it typically does when you open and close the door so it kind of gets "stuck." I saw that this seems like a common problem for most TT owners. Does this problem carry over to the R8? Also, I just checked what the cost would be for leasing and the price is almost identical whether I choose the RWS or AWD... Only difference is if I wanted to purchase the car... I don't lease very much so I don't quite understand this.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by superdl View Post
......The window won't go down like it typically does when you open and close the door so it kind of gets "stuck."...........I don't lease very much so I don't quite understand this.
Luckily for me last year I built a heated garage, so the frozen windows on the R8 are an unknown. I still have the TT for one more month, so i've been driving it a lot to pile on the miles and save up R8 miles for future fun. Yes, my TT windows freeze down terrible, but the seals and glass haven't broken yet from slamming the door, so.... To be honest the R8 looks like it will suffer the same fate, but since I'm only a month into ownership I haven't yet parked the R8 outside for long periods of time to find out.

If you want to know more about leasing, the financial details about my lease or other questions send me a private message and we can talk more. I worked in the auto industry for a long time, so I'm confident I can answer any leasing question you could possible throw at me.
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