AndrewM (azdaspeed3)

I show some interest in a Mazdaspeed 3 at some local dealers and now I'm getting non-stop emails and phone calls asking me "If I give you XX price, will you come in today?" "If I offer it to you at XX, will you buy it today?" "What time can you come in this week? I'll make sure to be here."

Now, I understand that they're just doing their jobs. They're taught to secure the sale right away because people who take time to decide can decide not to buy.

But why must I feel so sleazy for just looking at a car? Why can't I encounter a salesman who will let me go through this thing at my own pace? It seems like that might do them (and me) some good.

Anybody know a good DC-area dealer/salesman for Mazdas?

exS4||wp0ZZZ

to baltimore. that is where my guy is.

BlueDog

I'll make up a name, address, phone number and even email.

When I bought my A4 back in 01 from the dealer in Frederick, they never once asked me for info. They didn't even have to go make the copy of my license to let me test drive, they just wanted to see it. That bought my business after having just walked out of HBL being treated like I had the plague.

AndrewM (azdaspeed3)

Luckily, it's just my Hotmail account, which I really only use as a guinea pig address to give fools that I know will spam me.

I know that car sales is a tough business, but the way they act is so off-putting for someone like me. I know exactly what I want, I know the prices, etc. I don't need to be told about all the great standard features like ABS brakes.

Wind-n-Water

This is how I bought my A4. By doing it via email, they take away all the pressure tactics and tricks from a dishonest car sales mans. I'm sure there are plenty of honest ones out there, but do you want to gamble your $$ & your hassle to find out?

Okay, here's what I did.

First, read <a href="http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html">this</a>. It was invaluable for me to really understand what the game is from their end. (They have a bunch of <a href="http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/index.html">other articles</a> with general good sound advices)

Get your test drives and checking the car out in a dealership, all out of the way. Do NOT negotiate while at dealership. If a particular sale man/woman was courteous and helpful to you while you were there, get their business card w/ email and use them as you contact for that dealership.

I then pulled up and found ALL the dealers within 150 miles from me (how far I was willing to travel to buy the car).

I surfed up each one's web page and try to find a REAL internet sales manage/POC. I send them an email (individually, u don't want them knowing who else ur dealing with) and followed up a day later with a phone call.

In the email, I stated:
- my profession: <i>so they know you're not a kid wasting time just looking for test drive</i>,
- "I am ready to buy within 2 weeks": <i>you're a customer ready to act</i>
- "I am soliciting bids from ALL dealers within x miles circle from me": <i>you are a smart shopper</i>
- what you want: <i>state explicitly what car/model/trim line, and options you MUST have (use their option codes if able), what options you definitely DO NOT want, what colors you definitely DO NOT want, what colors you desire,</i>
- your location and willingness to buy even from a distant dealer IF they win the bid,
- You want the OUT-THE-DOOR price, the price that would be on the BUYING ORDER,
- thanks them for their time &amp; effort, and that you look forward to doing business with them: <i>be courteous, professional, but in control. It IS you $$ after all.</i>

On the phone call, repeat &amp; re-affirm the same thing. Do NOT give any $number$. If they pry, push back, or want you to go in so they could serve you personally; just politely but firmly remind them you want to do everything over email and that they'll meet you when you bring them the cashier's check for delivery. Again, do not give them any $price$ number. If they ask, just tell them you want their BEST price in writing (email). I found 50% lost interest right away and doesn't want my business.

A few days later I followed up with an email like this....
--------------------------
<i>Hi Ellie-

Thanks for your response earlier this week.
As I received more prices from dealers, I realized that the only way for me to compare apple-to-apple, is to get the bottom-line / out-the-door price.

Additionally, to open up the chance for each dealer...
If you have multiple vehicles matching my option/color(ext/int) preference, please provide the out-the-door price for each of them, that you would like to submit.

Let me provide the requirements again just to be safe:

new 2004 A4 1.8T Quattro 6-spd

MUST HAVE option pkgs:
- (PPX) Premium
- (XLP) Lighting
- (PPS or PSW) Sport

would LIKE ONE *or* BOTH of:
- (PAW) Cold
- (RXM) XM Infotainment

DON'T want colors:
- white
- black
- canvas beige matallic

Willing to consider all remaining Ext/Int colors.

Don't worry about differently optioned vehicles, my spreadsheet will normalize for the options included.

Please see attached text below for my response to a recent classical "sales man" question from another dealer. You have not given your customer (me) that type of treatment, and I appreciate that. I want you to know exactly what my buying decision process will be based on, it's in the text below.

Again, thank you Ellie.
I look forward to buying the vehicle from you.
-D

-------- &lt;attached text&gt; -------------
"What price do we have to sell it to you for to get you to purchase here?" -John

Oh, this is an easy question to answer. Your BEST price. I already have multiple dealers submitted their bid. If your best price wins, I buy the car from you. Straight up and simple.

Please submit your bottom-line/out-the-door price bid with all included items explicitly stated. I don't need, nor care to know the prices for each of your advertising/process...etc costs. Just the bottom line and the included item/option pkgs please. Effectively the price in the Buying Order, because that will be the amount on the certified check I will bring with me for delivery.

For dealers who don't have the vehicle in their lot, I also need to know EXACTLY when the vehicle will be available for delivery. Please DO make sure each and all the Audi optional pkg items are listed, so my spreadsheet can properly 'score' your bid.

Now, just as I need to respect the confidentiality of *YOUR* bid price by not sharing it with other dealers; the reverse also holds true. I will NOT share ANY other dealer's price with you. It's the only fair way to you.

To ADDITIONALLY protect you from being "shopped" by (me) the buyers, I will NOT come back to any of you to re-negotiate for a LOWER price. Basically, I take the first (and only) offered BEST PRICE from each dealer, and decide directly from there. No drag out rounds of biddings and negotiating.

thank you
-D</i>
------------

You'll find that you'll stop hearing back from some dealers. Once you have enough bids that you could start making a selection decision, you'll want to use a spreadsheet for that. I found it took about 1-1/2 wk from initial contact to this point, and took another wk for me to be able to schedule taking delivery (I had to drive 3 hrs up to DC). So if you time it right, you could take advantage of their incentive to move certain # of cars by end of each month. But those bid will likely have a short fuse on them, so you got to be ready to take delivery and have your funding secured.

Speaking of finance... get that squared away from an OUTSIDE lender BEFORE you contact the dealers. Credit Unions usually have great rates. Get the banks to PRE-QUALIFY you and have it in writing. You want EVERYTHING to go exactly as planned when you show up &amp; avoid last minute surprises at dealership... because that's THEIR turf. If dealer try to get you to finance thru them, tell them you are DEFINITELY interested IF they could beat your great rate that you already have in writing.

AndrewM, if you still reading and interested... email me and I could send you my spreadsheet. But basically the math I did was: I take the no-**** bottom line price and back out ALL the post sales tax fees that every dealer has to charge, like DMV tag/title (find out the fee amount from DMV page). I then back out the tax to get to the "bottom line" that they tell you in the dealership ("oh yeah, of course there's additional tax and DMV fees!"). I then divide that by the published INVOICE price (kbb.org) of the vehicle AS EQUIPPED, this lets me know how many %percent% over invoice they're selling it, and THIS %percentage% number is how I compare 1 bid from another bid. Thus I could compare the price of 2 vehicle of vastly different option equipage. Of course, it's up to you to decide between the intangibles of what options you like.

MAKE SURE you get them to include the VIN on each vehicle they submit a bid on!!

(Note that I knew my nearest 2 Audi dealers at the time, were both very poor with service. Therefore I had nothing to loose by buying the car elsewhere. If you have a dealership with good reputable service dept, then factor that in and weight it in your final selection decision...)

If you have read all the way to this end, then you aren't afraid of doing extra leg work to save potentially $thousand$ of you money. I found it actually to be FUN to turn the table, to weed out and find those honest sales person willing to sell a car to you at a fair price with out hassling you! And since you'll be sitting in the comfort of you computer desk and taking your time thinking each offer over, the whole experience is much more enjoyable compared to all the nightmares described in that article I linked to above (go read it!).

good luck!
:-)

Fairfax 4.0T

Washington Consumer Checkbook has a car buying service. You tell them what you want, and they come back with written offers from area dealers. Not only that, once you get those offers in writing, most dealers will match so you can buy the car from the dealer most convenient to you. It's a good way to go.

Jim<ul><li><a href="http://www.checkbook.org/auto/carbarg.cfm">http://www.checkbook.org/auto/carbarg.cfm</a</li></ul>

BLou R32-Bmore

YGM

Wind-n-Water

Tho that article:
edmunds.com -&gt; tips &amp; advice -&gt; "<a href="http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html">Confession of a Car Salesman</a>"
is still a very interesting and insightful read, that I would recommend.

AndrewM (azdaspeed3)

Just read the whole thing. No wonder the process feels so slimy, it is.

Wind-n-Water

they're being squeezed from the top by their bosses, which is 1 of the concluding remark of the story.