Simple question
08-14-2003, 04:43 AM
#1
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Simple question
this has been beaten to death i've been reading the 3 past days about this... but my answer still not found.
i was reading on T28 / GT25 / K04 / Stage III and Stage III+
my question comes which kit will serve me better, im going for the sleeper look i have $4000 to spend, now this money will also haft to cover for dyno and installation.
but for which turbo?
and yes the car is a daily driver, but only city its a small town so not much stop and go.
what can this cars internal handle at what hp should i start thinking about a rebuild, and what about exhaust and intakes also intercoolers.
i seen alot of sites with chips and everything else but not the true internals pistons and things like that.
i was reading on T28 / GT25 / K04 / Stage III and Stage III+
my question comes which kit will serve me better, im going for the sleeper look i have $4000 to spend, now this money will also haft to cover for dyno and installation.
but for which turbo?
and yes the car is a daily driver, but only city its a small town so not much stop and go.
what can this cars internal handle at what hp should i start thinking about a rebuild, and what about exhaust and intakes also intercoolers.
i seen alot of sites with chips and everything else but not the true internals pistons and things like that.
08-14-2003, 05:48 AM
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What year is your car, miles, current mods?
Are there any measureable goals you have? i.e. HP, 1/4 mi time, or to be comparable to a specific car? Do you want big top end power or great low end response? BTW - the motor can handle the kits that you mention just fine...
You will need an exhaust and an intercooler is a good idea, but not completely necessary depending on your budget. $4k will actually limit your modding if you want to get a big turbo kit. (Kit+ exhaust+clutch+install)
You will need an exhaust and an intercooler is a good idea, but not completely necessary depending on your budget. $4k will actually limit your modding if you want to get a big turbo kit. (Kit+ exhaust+clutch+install)
08-14-2003, 06:01 AM
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Re: What year is your car, miles, current mods?
i wont be running the car on 1/4mile im only researching now i dont have the vehicle im on the process of selling my prelude for it.
But heres an idea the mileage is no more than 45k miles.
I already have a borla exhaust, i need an intake and chip.
big turbo prefferred not necessary, i also want to keep things in there cool my biggest worry, do you guys have a water cooled system?
But heres an idea the mileage is no more than 45k miles.
I already have a borla exhaust, i need an intake and chip.
big turbo prefferred not necessary, i also want to keep things in there cool my biggest worry, do you guys have a water cooled system?
08-14-2003, 08:55 AM
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Watercooled what? Turbo - yes ours are watercooled.
With 45k miles - you can do any of these w/o engine work. Will it be a stick or a auto trannie? will it be pre-2000 or will it be 2000 or 2001? Will it be FWD or AWD?
If a chip, intake and exhasut is not enuff, IMHO - you have two mainstream choices:
K04 kit - 225-240Hp ~$1700+install
PES T-28 or APR Stage III kit - 270-300HP and ~$4k + install. Both should have other goodies installed with them and will need a stronger clutch sooner or later, in my case is was sooner.
This all depends on what year car you get and what you want to accomplish, 1/4 mi or not. Is 235 HP enuff?
You should also think about wheels/tires, brakes, suspension, short throw shifter, intercooler, etc. (not to mention cosmetic stuff - you said sleeper) In other words, you may want to get just a chip or the K04 kit and spend the rest some of these mods.
My last point is that if you get a 2001 you can get a GIAC X chip which is almost as good as a K04 setup. Maybe get a ride in a modded A4 to get an idea of what you want...
If a chip, intake and exhasut is not enuff, IMHO - you have two mainstream choices:
K04 kit - 225-240Hp ~$1700+install
PES T-28 or APR Stage III kit - 270-300HP and ~$4k + install. Both should have other goodies installed with them and will need a stronger clutch sooner or later, in my case is was sooner.
This all depends on what year car you get and what you want to accomplish, 1/4 mi or not. Is 235 HP enuff?
You should also think about wheels/tires, brakes, suspension, short throw shifter, intercooler, etc. (not to mention cosmetic stuff - you said sleeper) In other words, you may want to get just a chip or the K04 kit and spend the rest some of these mods.
My last point is that if you get a 2001 you can get a GIAC X chip which is almost as good as a K04 setup. Maybe get a ride in a modded A4 to get an idea of what you want...
08-14-2003, 08:59 PM
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don't forget you WILL need a clutch, and that adds up... remember that these are turbo cars from the
factory... when you throw a turbo on a non turbo engine, like the honda world, you are dealing with engine internals that were not intended for the compression ratios/heat/etc and hence you have to upgrade the internals...
the 1.8T is a turbo block out the factory door, so the internals are much sturdier... there are folks running aftermarket internals, but not with a standard kit (unless they rebuilt for some reason, then why not?)
stock internals have been up to 500hp on the bottle, so they can hold any hp that your $4G will get you...
the 1.8T is a turbo block out the factory door, so the internals are much sturdier... there are folks running aftermarket internals, but not with a standard kit (unless they rebuilt for some reason, then why not?)
stock internals have been up to 500hp on the bottle, so they can hold any hp that your $4G will get you...
08-15-2003, 02:58 AM
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Ok K04 kit quetion
Totally understand that reason why i didnt wanna bother with turboing my prelude.
K04 kit its what everyone is telling me to get seeing the car is going to be used as a daily driver.
but i heard bad things about that kit what do you guys suggest also the cheapest place to find a T28 turbo which is my goal.
and do i def need a new clutch for that?
K04 kit its what everyone is telling me to get seeing the car is going to be used as a daily driver.
but i heard bad things about that kit what do you guys suggest also the cheapest place to find a T28 turbo which is my goal.
and do i def need a new clutch for that?
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08-15-2003, 05:50 AM
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answers...
you COULD use the stock clutch on ANY turbo kit, but it isn't gonna last too long, and since you are going to have a used car, the clutch will be of question anyway... so I would save the cash for a clutch. Obviously, less power and you driving nice will make the clutch last longer, but let me tell you high rpm AWD luanches can be a lot of fun!
I personally know a fair number of people that make the PES T28 kit or the APR Stage 3 kit their daily drivers, that is NOT a problem at all.
The K04 kit can be a fine daily driver as well... there are lots of people safely and sucessfully running a k04. The thing is it just isn't amazingly fast... although coming from a prelude, you should be very happy with the torque of a k04.
I would suggest...
get the car... do exhaust and a chip.... I would get a GIAC chip first. Then do suspension, maybe rims, and a clutch. Save the cash for a bit again and get the PES t28 or the APR stage 3 turbo later on down the road... Personally, unless you stock turbo fails and you need a replacement right away, I would skip the k04.
also, just buying the turbo without the rest of the kit, while possible, is a LOT more of a headache... buying the kit gets you the manifold (which can be hard to source alone) and the software (expensive to custom tune). Audis are very computer oriented, so the software (AKA chip) can be very complex.
If you get a GIAC chip from PES now, then upgrade to a PES T28 kit later, I wanna say you can trade in your old chip for a $200 discount or something...
I personally know a fair number of people that make the PES T28 kit or the APR Stage 3 kit their daily drivers, that is NOT a problem at all.
The K04 kit can be a fine daily driver as well... there are lots of people safely and sucessfully running a k04. The thing is it just isn't amazingly fast... although coming from a prelude, you should be very happy with the torque of a k04.
I would suggest...
get the car... do exhaust and a chip.... I would get a GIAC chip first. Then do suspension, maybe rims, and a clutch. Save the cash for a bit again and get the PES t28 or the APR stage 3 turbo later on down the road... Personally, unless you stock turbo fails and you need a replacement right away, I would skip the k04.
also, just buying the turbo without the rest of the kit, while possible, is a LOT more of a headache... buying the kit gets you the manifold (which can be hard to source alone) and the software (expensive to custom tune). Audis are very computer oriented, so the software (AKA chip) can be very complex.
If you get a GIAC chip from PES now, then upgrade to a PES T28 kit later, I wanna say you can trade in your old chip for a $200 discount or something...
08-15-2003, 06:20 AM
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Re: answers...
For the chip i rather wait till when i upgrade the turbo, but the exhaust should i try in get a 3" one or with the 2.75 i know for most turbo applications they recommend 3".
My prelude had its bottom end rebuilt so it was pushin some nice numbers 223hp so coming from a prelude i knew a little bit about power
For turbo im getting kit only i dont like getting all the parts separate to much of a hassle.
Heres what someone suggested...
K04 setup $1500+install - clutch - exhaust - flywheel - suspension - intercooler.
$4300 right there someone said and the intercooler is a must what suggest would u say ..
get the one that comes with a kit or go elsewhere for it like a greedy, apr or awe?
My prelude had its bottom end rebuilt so it was pushin some nice numbers 223hp so coming from a prelude i knew a little bit about power
For turbo im getting kit only i dont like getting all the parts separate to much of a hassle.
Heres what someone suggested...
K04 setup $1500+install - clutch - exhaust - flywheel - suspension - intercooler.
$4300 right there someone said and the intercooler is a must what suggest would u say ..
get the one that comes with a kit or go elsewhere for it like a greedy, apr or awe?
08-16-2003, 04:16 PM
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well...
223 hp is nice, but your torque numbers on the prelude were likely low... not dissing the prelude at all... just saying torque is great...
your options for a FULL 3 inch turbo back exhaust are very few... the factory cat is a 2.25 outlet, so a 3" downpipe is not gonna do you much with the stock cat... 3" is probably not needed on a k04, but it would be good for a larger turbo (APR or PES)... check out <A HREF="http://www.matrixengineering.cc/">matrix engineering</a> as I hear that they have a full 3" back system... having installed my 2.5, a 3 is gonna be TIGHT... you will need a 3" downpipe and cat to make it truely worth it...
I agree with those suggstions... clutch is needed, flywheel is nice (I love my 12lb unit), suspension is REALLY nice.... you really would benefit from intercooler...
but you would also benefit from some nice 17" rims and nice tires... and don't forget the little things like engine mounts, BPVs, blah blah blah.... I would say get everything save the intercooler, THEN if you have enough cash, order that...
all the ICs are good, although I do like the APR design in the endtanks, assuming you can get a Z flow, and the greddy fit and finish looks really good too....
ko4 - 1500-1700
clutch + Flyhwheel - 1000
exhaust 600-1600, depending on if you have to go custom, get a cat (or skip it and get a test pipe)
so you are at 3100-4200 right now, not counting ANY labor... so then you need suspension, and you want a good suspension... shocks and springs are atleast $400 for shocks, $200 for springs... and again labor (although not hard to do...)
so don't buy it all at once.... it may cost more than you think...
your options for a FULL 3 inch turbo back exhaust are very few... the factory cat is a 2.25 outlet, so a 3" downpipe is not gonna do you much with the stock cat... 3" is probably not needed on a k04, but it would be good for a larger turbo (APR or PES)... check out <A HREF="http://www.matrixengineering.cc/">matrix engineering</a> as I hear that they have a full 3" back system... having installed my 2.5, a 3 is gonna be TIGHT... you will need a 3" downpipe and cat to make it truely worth it...
I agree with those suggstions... clutch is needed, flywheel is nice (I love my 12lb unit), suspension is REALLY nice.... you really would benefit from intercooler...
but you would also benefit from some nice 17" rims and nice tires... and don't forget the little things like engine mounts, BPVs, blah blah blah.... I would say get everything save the intercooler, THEN if you have enough cash, order that...
all the ICs are good, although I do like the APR design in the endtanks, assuming you can get a Z flow, and the greddy fit and finish looks really good too....
ko4 - 1500-1700
clutch + Flyhwheel - 1000
exhaust 600-1600, depending on if you have to go custom, get a cat (or skip it and get a test pipe)
so you are at 3100-4200 right now, not counting ANY labor... so then you need suspension, and you want a good suspension... shocks and springs are atleast $400 for shocks, $200 for springs... and again labor (although not hard to do...)
so don't buy it all at once.... it may cost more than you think...