To the "hard core driver's" of this forum (very long)
10-08-2006, 05:22 AM
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To the "hard core driver's" of this forum (very long)
Hello all,
Just got back from pushing my car (or driver's) limit.I wanted to see the difference in handling when the ESP is on versus off.
Some of my friends and I at times would go to our "secret" little hideaway spot late at night and drive pretty hard through it. One person would go to the end and another at another end with walkie talkies and communicate to make sure it's safe. But we usually do it so late at night that not a car passes.
Tonight was perfect, 59 degrees and moisture in the road. I wanted to see how good my TT really is in wet. Everything in my car is stock still except for a neuspeed chip and drilled rotors. I went through a series of turns and towards the end, there is a wicked 35-45 mph left hander that immediatly turns right to another street. As I was approaching the left turn, instead of making the car drift like a rear wheel drive car, I pointed in the direction I wanted to go and go with the turn.
About halfway through the apex, my car started to slide and I lost traction on all four wheels (whis was with ESP on) and began to drift but on all four wheels about to hit the curb. I countersteered and throttled it a little as I began to slide in the opposite direction so I drifted into the right hander and cleared the curb (thank god the TT is small).
I tried it again (intentionally this time) on my second run and noticed that with the ESP off, my tires felt like it had more traction when the ESP was off. This occurence was during drifting and I step on the accelerator to catch traction.
I ask this now, would you all rather leave it on when going fast or off? On normal dry hot conditions, I tried turning hard on a street and it felt like my wheels were being restricted from spinning and a huge loss of power is felt. What is better to you all? On or off?
And lastly, is there a difference in stability between the top up or down on raodsters?
This is my first time on a quattro but I have always been a bigger fan of 4 wheels.
If any of your trackday, I would love to meet you all sometime and perhaps we can have a "spirited run" through the canyons or head out to the track.
I am in the los angeles area.
Howard- (dookati@msn.com)
very proud new owner of an
01' 225 tt roadster quattro
Just got back from pushing my car (or driver's) limit.I wanted to see the difference in handling when the ESP is on versus off.
Some of my friends and I at times would go to our "secret" little hideaway spot late at night and drive pretty hard through it. One person would go to the end and another at another end with walkie talkies and communicate to make sure it's safe. But we usually do it so late at night that not a car passes.
Tonight was perfect, 59 degrees and moisture in the road. I wanted to see how good my TT really is in wet. Everything in my car is stock still except for a neuspeed chip and drilled rotors. I went through a series of turns and towards the end, there is a wicked 35-45 mph left hander that immediatly turns right to another street. As I was approaching the left turn, instead of making the car drift like a rear wheel drive car, I pointed in the direction I wanted to go and go with the turn.
About halfway through the apex, my car started to slide and I lost traction on all four wheels (whis was with ESP on) and began to drift but on all four wheels about to hit the curb. I countersteered and throttled it a little as I began to slide in the opposite direction so I drifted into the right hander and cleared the curb (thank god the TT is small).
I tried it again (intentionally this time) on my second run and noticed that with the ESP off, my tires felt like it had more traction when the ESP was off. This occurence was during drifting and I step on the accelerator to catch traction.
I ask this now, would you all rather leave it on when going fast or off? On normal dry hot conditions, I tried turning hard on a street and it felt like my wheels were being restricted from spinning and a huge loss of power is felt. What is better to you all? On or off?
And lastly, is there a difference in stability between the top up or down on raodsters?
This is my first time on a quattro but I have always been a bigger fan of 4 wheels.
If any of your trackday, I would love to meet you all sometime and perhaps we can have a "spirited run" through the canyons or head out to the track.
I am in the los angeles area.
Howard- (dookati@msn.com)
very proud new owner of an
01' 225 tt roadster quattro
10-08-2006, 05:27 AM
#2
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ESP off, always. I rarely use it only when going for a casual transportation type drive
Now with the Stage Three I don't see any casual drives anymore, wish I could disable it permanently. Takes more skill but allows more control.
10-08-2006, 05:50 AM
#3
I can build you a circuit that automatically switches off ESP every time you start the car.
the button would still work normally, it's just a circuit that switches off ESP after a time delay, after the car is started,
Wev'e had this ESP discussion previously, and I've mentioned this for years, but I've never actually done it.
Wev'e had this ESP discussion previously, and I've mentioned this for years, but I've never actually done it.
10-08-2006, 06:01 AM
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I'd definitely be interested...except I forgot about winter and snow...
Maybe a small toggle switch where in one position the regular ESP switch works as intended but in the other it does like you mention above. Sounds a bit silly in theory but actually could be quite practical. Basically I'd leave it one way in summer and the other in winter. We may need to talk.
Trent
Trent
10-08-2006, 06:02 AM
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My car doesnt have ESP. When I get in cars that have it, I forget, and the ESP has almost caused me
to wreck twice, because it did the opposite of what I was expecting to happen.
10-08-2006, 06:04 AM
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When I bought my BMW new in 99 the salesman still had bandages on
I never verified the story but he said he totalled a brand new Mercedes because he wasn't aware that ESP/traction control was added to that particular model. He was full of crap for the most part (duh, he's a car salesman) but he really didn't have a reason to make up that story.
10-08-2006, 06:22 AM
#7
I always defeat it >
only time I might leave on is a freeway in the rain; otherwise - while I won't say it's too unpredictable for my driving style - it definitely causes more unsafe situations than it corrects by cutting power when I expect to have it, or by braking when I'm already compensating.
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10-08-2006, 07:52 AM
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Depends on what you're trying to do and what your driving style is...
I feel more in control when the ESP is off. I can feel the road better, I know how the car will handle and react more accurately, and I know what I'll have to do if I go into an unexpected slide.
That being said, I pretty much always leave it on unless I'm driving hard. Especially in the wet/snow. It's saved me a couple times. The only time I turn it off is when I pull out into a busy intersection and don't want power cut off.
I don't think ESP in NEEDED, especially in dry conditions, but it is a nice option to have when the weather is really slippery.
That being said, I pretty much always leave it on unless I'm driving hard. Especially in the wet/snow. It's saved me a couple times. The only time I turn it off is when I pull out into a busy intersection and don't want power cut off.
I don't think ESP in NEEDED, especially in dry conditions, but it is a nice option to have when the weather is really slippery.
