Test drove a 2018 TT versus a BMW 230 and M240
06-08-2018, 05:48 AM
#1
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Test drove a 2018 TT versus a BMW 230 and M240
I tested convertibles since I'll be looking for a replacement for my Mk 2 roadster within a year. I'm visiting Socal to boogyboard which I do about 5 times during the summer. The BMWs were dealer loaners with about 3000 miles on the odometer. BMW dealers in SoCal sell their loaners as used cars with remaining warranty because they do not want to pay BMW the CPO premium and don't discount the car much from MSRP. This is a really bad deal because you can get an off-lease 2016 CPO with less than 10K on the odometer for about $10K less than these loaners. The dealers were adjacent to each other, so I drove all 3 on the same route within an hour of each other.
All are excellent cars. The 230 did not have the track handling package option that provides the brakes and suspension of the M240. The 230 had faster acceleration than my Mk 2 braked better, and a smoother ride. All the cars cornered well (salesman's fingerprints are still in the dash). The M240 is a beast but had a much firmer ride than my Mk 2, even in "comfort" mode. The Mk 3 felt almost as fast as the M240 with the comfortable ride I know and love. I could buy any of the and be happy, but my preference is the TT if CPO prices get better (more bout this later)
Pros and cons:
BMW offers many more paint colors (and not just shades of black to white), seat colors and top colors. I love the car in its light (Estoril) blue with red or gray seats or burnt orange with brown seats far more than anything Audi offers. The Audi paint choices are dismal but I like Tango red or Scuba blue the best.
The BMW trunk is much smaller than the TT which is a big deal for me. Yeah you can put stuff in the BMW back seat but then you have to put the top up every time you stop somewhere, assuming it does not blow away. My boogy board fits in the TT and not in the BMW.
The BMW does not come with a spare. You get run-flats which I hate and are often useless if you run into trouble in the rural west. If you get the regular tire option, you do not even get the "pump and goo" that the Mk 2 has. I have an "almost full size" spare in my Mk 2 and it still has more useful trunk space (still fits my boogie board) than the BMW. I would have to lay out $600 for the compact spare kit which is not offered as an option in the US but is available on-line and makes the BMW trunk almost useless.
The TT has much better cabin electronics but that is not a big deal for me. Folks rave about the TT interior but they both look good to me.
The BMW does not have an oil dipstick. This irritates me. An idiot light comes on to add oil but if it comes on and you are in Nowhere Utah you are going to have a hard time finding synthetic oil within 25 miles so I would also carry oil in the trunk. Also, oil is a significant engine coolant in the desert so I like to keep my oil topped off. No can do on the BMW.
The TT has done away with the troublesome flap motors of the Mk 2.
If you like having a unique ride, and I do, the poor sales of the TT make it a very rare car on the road and it has very distinctive styling. The 2 series looks like every other BMW convertible except their Z. The Z has a hard top that adds weight and gobbles up the trunk so it is not an option for me. The nextgen Z being co-developed with Toyota will go back to a soft top but the base model will likely be underpowered.
So why consider a 2 at all? Right now the main answer is price. A new M240 which Car & Driver lightning lap says is slightly faster than a Mk 3 TTS on the track is about the same price as a base TT. My preferred route is buying a used car with less than 20 k on the odometer and preferably less than 10K. Preferably a CPO. For some reason, used Mk 3s are very scarce at this time. Cars.com shows about 20 nationwide while there are about 15 times more BMWs to choose from. This is keeping Mk3 used prices artificially high. Presently low mileage Mk 3 CPOs start around $39K, about $10K more than a 230 and $5K more than a M240. The TT is not worth that premium price IMO. I'm going to hold off buying for a while. I'm hoping the expiration of 3 year leases of the 2016 Mk 3 that should occur in the next 6 months will drive the price down about $5K.
All are excellent cars. The 230 did not have the track handling package option that provides the brakes and suspension of the M240. The 230 had faster acceleration than my Mk 2 braked better, and a smoother ride. All the cars cornered well (salesman's fingerprints are still in the dash). The M240 is a beast but had a much firmer ride than my Mk 2, even in "comfort" mode. The Mk 3 felt almost as fast as the M240 with the comfortable ride I know and love. I could buy any of the and be happy, but my preference is the TT if CPO prices get better (more bout this later)
Pros and cons:
BMW offers many more paint colors (and not just shades of black to white), seat colors and top colors. I love the car in its light (Estoril) blue with red or gray seats or burnt orange with brown seats far more than anything Audi offers. The Audi paint choices are dismal but I like Tango red or Scuba blue the best.
The BMW trunk is much smaller than the TT which is a big deal for me. Yeah you can put stuff in the BMW back seat but then you have to put the top up every time you stop somewhere, assuming it does not blow away. My boogy board fits in the TT and not in the BMW.
The BMW does not come with a spare. You get run-flats which I hate and are often useless if you run into trouble in the rural west. If you get the regular tire option, you do not even get the "pump and goo" that the Mk 2 has. I have an "almost full size" spare in my Mk 2 and it still has more useful trunk space (still fits my boogie board) than the BMW. I would have to lay out $600 for the compact spare kit which is not offered as an option in the US but is available on-line and makes the BMW trunk almost useless.
The TT has much better cabin electronics but that is not a big deal for me. Folks rave about the TT interior but they both look good to me.
The BMW does not have an oil dipstick. This irritates me. An idiot light comes on to add oil but if it comes on and you are in Nowhere Utah you are going to have a hard time finding synthetic oil within 25 miles so I would also carry oil in the trunk. Also, oil is a significant engine coolant in the desert so I like to keep my oil topped off. No can do on the BMW.
The TT has done away with the troublesome flap motors of the Mk 2.
If you like having a unique ride, and I do, the poor sales of the TT make it a very rare car on the road and it has very distinctive styling. The 2 series looks like every other BMW convertible except their Z. The Z has a hard top that adds weight and gobbles up the trunk so it is not an option for me. The nextgen Z being co-developed with Toyota will go back to a soft top but the base model will likely be underpowered.
So why consider a 2 at all? Right now the main answer is price. A new M240 which Car & Driver lightning lap says is slightly faster than a Mk 3 TTS on the track is about the same price as a base TT. My preferred route is buying a used car with less than 20 k on the odometer and preferably less than 10K. Preferably a CPO. For some reason, used Mk 3s are very scarce at this time. Cars.com shows about 20 nationwide while there are about 15 times more BMWs to choose from. This is keeping Mk3 used prices artificially high. Presently low mileage Mk 3 CPOs start around $39K, about $10K more than a 230 and $5K more than a M240. The TT is not worth that premium price IMO. I'm going to hold off buying for a while. I'm hoping the expiration of 3 year leases of the 2016 Mk 3 that should occur in the next 6 months will drive the price down about $5K.
Last edited by Vegas-roadster; 06-16-2018 at 06:44 AM.
06-08-2018, 01:35 PM
#2
AudiWorld Member
I bought my spotless cpo 17 TT coupe in November for $37K with 8000 miles. like you i test drove the 230 and found it an absolute mess at 80mph. the TT is rock solid.
if you want to buy a bmw, buy a m package 128. those are sweet and pure.
if you want to buy a bmw, buy a m package 128. those are sweet and pure.
06-08-2018, 03:24 PM
#3
Interesting comparison impressions. Thank you for posting. I am not in the market for a convertible (in fact I am selling my MX-5 convertible to get into a TTRS in a week or so) but I think the TT convertible is a very interesting alternative that doesn't often get a lot of consideration. Like me with the TTRS, one of the reasons I am buying it is for the utility and generous (for its size) space. It's small, relatively light and compact but still has plenty of room for my wife and I to go on trips together and that was something that I was looking for in my next sports car. I also looked for lightly used CPO options but there are very, very few and getting one in the color and with the options I wanted would probably have taken a very long time. So today I put a deposit on a new one that is arriving in a week or so and as one of the last 2018's to be produced I was able to get a very good deal on it.
Keep looking, be patient and good luck in your search!
Keep looking, be patient and good luck in your search!
06-08-2018, 08:26 PM
#4
AudiWorld Senior Member
FYI....no TT convertibles have adjustable shocks on it in North America, so that's one less thing for you to worry about.
"Idiot" oil lights come on to advise you to top off your oil soon. There is no need to carry oil while on a trip. If the light came on you could simply stop off at your convenience and buy what you need to add. It's not dangerous to drive the car for a while when the "add oil" light comes on, it just is indicating it's ideal to top of it off in the near future. There is a second warning if the oil level becomes dangerous low and could cause engine damage...don't confuse those two things. Digital oil gauges are far more convenient, and even John Deere agricultural equipment and man 18-wheeler semi trucks have been using them for a long time now.
When it comes to values yes.....3 year leases that start to expire should allow a larger selection and maybe a better price. But note....the cheap BMWs are great for used car buyers, but it shows the horrendous resale value BMW is experiencing, usually because of there silly-aggressive leases with inflated residual values. Audi has not done this, and in the long run will likely benefit (as will Audi owners). Your used CPO TT may cost more than the BWM now, but it will also be worth more money 5 more years from now....likely resulting in a true cost of ownership that is equally or even in the Audi's favor. Pay more now, and it's worth more later.....it's a numbers game.
"Idiot" oil lights come on to advise you to top off your oil soon. There is no need to carry oil while on a trip. If the light came on you could simply stop off at your convenience and buy what you need to add. It's not dangerous to drive the car for a while when the "add oil" light comes on, it just is indicating it's ideal to top of it off in the near future. There is a second warning if the oil level becomes dangerous low and could cause engine damage...don't confuse those two things. Digital oil gauges are far more convenient, and even John Deere agricultural equipment and man 18-wheeler semi trucks have been using them for a long time now.
When it comes to values yes.....3 year leases that start to expire should allow a larger selection and maybe a better price. But note....the cheap BMWs are great for used car buyers, but it shows the horrendous resale value BMW is experiencing, usually because of there silly-aggressive leases with inflated residual values. Audi has not done this, and in the long run will likely benefit (as will Audi owners). Your used CPO TT may cost more than the BWM now, but it will also be worth more money 5 more years from now....likely resulting in a true cost of ownership that is equally or even in the Audi's favor. Pay more now, and it's worth more later.....it's a numbers game.
06-09-2018, 07:01 AM
#5
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
I'm confused
FYI....no TT convertibles have adjustable shocks on it in North America, so that's one less thing for you to worry about.
"Idiot" oil lights come on to advise you to top off your oil soon. There is no need to carry oil while on a trip. If the light came on you could simply stop off at your convenience and buy what you need to add. It's not dangerous to drive the car for a while when the "add oil" light comes on, it just is indicating it's ideal to top of it off in the near future. There is a second warning if the oil level becomes dangerous low and could cause engine damage...don't confuse those two things. Digital oil gauges are far more convenient, and even John Deere agricultural equipment and man 18-wheeler semi trucks have been using them for a long time now.
When it comes to values yes.....3 year leases that start to expire should allow a larger selection and maybe a better price. But note....the cheap BMWs are great for used car buyers, but it shows the horrendous resale value BMW is experiencing, usually because of there silly-aggressive leases with inflated residual values. Audi has not done this, and in the long run will likely benefit (as will Audi owners). Your used CPO TT may cost more than the BWM now, but it will also be worth more money 5 more years from now....likely resulting in a true cost of ownership that is equally or even in the Audi's favor. Pay more now, and it's worth more later.....it's a numbers game.
"Idiot" oil lights come on to advise you to top off your oil soon. There is no need to carry oil while on a trip. If the light came on you could simply stop off at your convenience and buy what you need to add. It's not dangerous to drive the car for a while when the "add oil" light comes on, it just is indicating it's ideal to top of it off in the near future. There is a second warning if the oil level becomes dangerous low and could cause engine damage...don't confuse those two things. Digital oil gauges are far more convenient, and even John Deere agricultural equipment and man 18-wheeler semi trucks have been using them for a long time now.
When it comes to values yes.....3 year leases that start to expire should allow a larger selection and maybe a better price. But note....the cheap BMWs are great for used car buyers, but it shows the horrendous resale value BMW is experiencing, usually because of there silly-aggressive leases with inflated residual values. Audi has not done this, and in the long run will likely benefit (as will Audi owners). Your used CPO TT may cost more than the BWM now, but it will also be worth more money 5 more years from now....likely resulting in a true cost of ownership that is equally or even in the Audi's favor. Pay more now, and it's worth more later.....it's a numbers game.
Relative to value, the present resale value situation is a historical aberration. In the past, a CPO base TT was always much less expensive than a BMW 235/240M and I expect that to be the case again in 6-12 months. If I wanted a 3-4 year old Mk 2, I can still buy a low mileage CPO for the low $30s if I shop the US. I want a Mk 3. Mk 3 2016 CY TT sales in the US were about 50% higher (and the majority were leased) than prior and following years, so the TT CPO market will be relatively flooded when those leases expire. In fact, the driving force for cost parity of a used TT versus a 235/240M is that Audi has boosted the TT prices by a much higher % over the past few years such that a new 240M is about the same price as a base TT, and a new 230 is much less expensive than a base TT. So the Mk 3 is not retaining a better % value, it is just that the price of a TT when new is much higher than before.
06-09-2018, 09:00 PM
#7
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Well I stand corrected. Only the TTS has mag ride. So according to the TT owner's manual, only the TTS suspension changes with driving mode.
Last edited by Vegas-roadster; 06-09-2018 at 09:27 PM.
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06-10-2018, 09:54 AM
#8
I owned an M235ix and while it was “ok”, I never really bonded with it for a number of reasons. The TTS steering and transmission are much better, the suspension is more settled and the interior layout and quality is far superior. I did love the BMW engine. I have no regrets letting the BMW go and getting the Audi.
06-10-2018, 12:06 PM
#9
I also strongly considered a 2 series BMW this time around but even with a large price difference in favor of the BMW I still went with the TTRS. A lot of that was down to the interior quality including the superior seats and the virtual cockpit. And then there's the fact that the TTRS sounds so much better and is a hatchback, which I think is one of the best and most useful configurations for a car to have. I feel like I am getting what I paid for with the TTRS, even at its higher price. The BMW's have some cheap bits and even at the lower price it felt somewhat overpriced, if that makes sense.
06-15-2018, 05:39 PM
#10
AudiWorld Member
I also strongly considered a 2 series BMW this time around but even with a large price difference in favor of the BMW I still went with the TTRS. A lot of that was down to the interior quality including the superior seats and the virtual cockpit. And then there's the fact that the TTRS sounds so much better and is a hatchback, which I think is one of the best and most useful configurations for a car to have. I feel like I am getting what I paid for with the TTRS, even at its higher price. The BMW's have some cheap bits and even at the lower price it felt somewhat overpriced, if that makes sense.