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Thread Starter
Club AutoUnion
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 833
Likes: 332
From: West Michigan
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OK, I knew that my A8 would be a high-maintenance car, but I should put a blonde wig on this thing. Have had the car 10 months and have replaced a major airbag wiring harness, replaced the trunk motor, the drivers-side door closing motor is going and now for the past few months, the engine "clacks" for a second or during the first start of each day.
I suspect I have a leaky hydraulic lifter (these engines use hydraulic lifters, right?) and the oil is draining over night. Do I want to know what replacing one might cost?
I suspect I have a leaky hydraulic lifter (these engines use hydraulic lifters, right?) and the oil is draining over night. Do I want to know what replacing one might cost?
Last edited by enGage; Feb 27, 2012 at 02:31 PM.
AudiWorld Super User
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 19,020
Likes: 209
From: Wilbur by the Sea
Cam Chain Tensioner Going Bad
It operates on hydraulic oil pressure. It has some type of check valve device. Once you turn your car off, the check valve is leaking by, it is relaxig when the car is off, then the cam chain (the one cam drives the other cam) is loose until oil pressure builds up. This can cause the plastic runner to age prematurely.
The part is $600 for the D2 (I think it's the same part number for the D3), and it's a bitch to replace. I just did one a few months ago. Did it when the timing belt was off.
Lots of pictures here:
http://forums.quattroworld.com/a8/msgs/55496.phtml
Good luck!
The part is $600 for the D2 (I think it's the same part number for the D3), and it's a bitch to replace. I just did one a few months ago. Did it when the timing belt was off.
Lots of pictures here:
http://forums.quattroworld.com/a8/msgs/55496.phtml
Good luck!
AudiWorld Super User
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,251
Likes: 91
From: Moronville, Tennessee (Middle TN)
There is a TSB out there stating that some rattling noise is normal on 4.2 v8s at startup! Hope you have not started the teardown!
Sorry I cannot find it now but if you search you can find it I hope.
I had a Mercedes engine that did this from the lifters "deflating"; I kept upping the viscosity thinking that thicker = better (it never gets below 15F here, so the manual said 20W50 was OK and even SAE30 straight weight). Once I finally tried the recommended 5W30 the noise went away -DOH!
-Tom
Sorry I cannot find it now but if you search you can find it I hope.
I had a Mercedes engine that did this from the lifters "deflating"; I kept upping the viscosity thinking that thicker = better (it never gets below 15F here, so the manual said 20W50 was OK and even SAE30 straight weight). Once I finally tried the recommended 5W30 the noise went away -DOH!
-Tom
Thread Starter
Club AutoUnion
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 833
Likes: 332
From: West Michigan
no tear down yet. In fact if it is an issue ill have either the dealer or out local independent shop that specializes in German cars fix it.
It would be nice if it was normal or could wait until its timing belt time.
It would be nice if it was normal or could wait until its timing belt time.
AudiWorld Super User
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,251
Likes: 91
From: Moronville, Tennessee (Middle TN)
Think positive! Chin up!
And don't forget to tell us how much your top end rebuild costs!
I'll look for that TSB now
Thread Starter
Club AutoUnion
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 833
Likes: 332
From: West Michigan
I emailed my Service Rep on Friday and now today, for the first time in months, the car started without a single clack. Kept the door open and garage door closed so I could hear well and nothing - nice quite start.
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AudiWorld Super User
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,251
Likes: 91
From: Moronville, Tennessee (Middle TN)
Here is a 6-page forum post where the lfter noise is researched in excrutiating detail
I cannot find any text for the lifter TSB but I found an interesting software update TSB hich addresses a rattle at startup. Not sure if it applies to our cars but interesting anyway.
TSB 2017369/3 says:
Technical Service Bulletin Transaction No.: 2017369/3
24 Rattling from intake manifold Release date: Dec 17, 2008
Condition
REVISION HISTORY
Revision
Date
Purpose
3
-
Revised Title to add Repair Group
Sporadic hard metallic rattling sound from intake manifold only after first cold start, audible for 1-2 seconds.
Technical Background
Early activation of the vacuum solenoid valves for the variable intake manifold by the Engine Control Module
(J623) during cold engine starts may cause the internal intake flaps to vibrate and create a brief rattling sound from the intake manifold.
Production Solution
New software in Engine Control Module (J623) resolved the intake manifold rattling issue.
Tip: Please explain to the customers that this new software is the latest software level with improved driving characteristics, which includes the following changes:
* The exhaust flap (if equipped) is always open, and no diagnosis of the Exhaust Flap Valve N321 is possible. Up to 1,700 rpm the engine is a bit louder, as the exhaust flap is always open.
* Faster throttle overrun cutoff, with more direct accelerator pedal and reduced overrun after releasing the accelerator.
* To prevent the clutch from slipping when accelerating from a stop, the engine torque is slightly reduced when vehicle speed is below 20 mph and the engine speed is higher than 4600 rpm. There is no noticeable performance difference.
Service
SVM Update Instructions
1. If you encounter a vehicle with a tuned ECM or TCM, your dealership must do the following before performing any procedure that updates ECM or TCM programming:
Note:
Any Update Programming procedure (flash) may overwrite any tuned ECM or TCM programming. A tuned ECM or TCM is described as any ECM or TCM altered so as to perform outside the normal parameters and specifications approved by Audi of America, Inc.
a. Notify the owner that their ECM or TCM was found to have been tuned.
b. Notify the owner that any damage caused by the tuning of the ECM or TCM (including any adverse emissions consequences) will not be covered by Audi of America, Inc. warranties.
c. Obtain the owner's written consent (see attached Control Module Tuning form) for any requested repair - under warranty or outside warranty - that requires flashing that will automatically overwrite the tuned program.
2. Check the software part number and software level in the Engine Control Module (J623).
3. Prior to beginning the SVM process, insert a USB memory stick into the VAS 5051 tester to capture the diagnostic log electronically.
4. Connect the VAS 5051A and VAS 5051B to a 110V AC power supply. The VAS 5051A and VAS 5051B must be connected to 110V AC power supply at all times during the procedure.
5. Update the Engine Control Module (J623) using SVM action code as listed in the table below if necessary.
Note: Only VAS 6017B adapter can be used for this update. Usage of VAS 6017 or 6017A may result in complete control module failure
If the vehicle has a tuned ECM or TCM, ensure the Control Module Tuning form has been filled out by the owner.
* Tip: The SVM Process must be completed in its entirety so the database receives the update confirmation response. A warranty claim may not be reimbursed if there is no confirmation response to support the claim.
* After updating the programming of the ECM, it is not necessary to set the Readiness Code.
For further SVM update instructions and troubleshooting, please refer to the SVM Operating Manual; ElsaWeb TSB 2011732.
Warranty
When procedure applies to vehicles under warranty, use the following:
SAGA
Claim Type:
110
Service Number:
2470
Damage Code:
0039
Labor Operations:
2470 25 99
Update Engine Control Module with SVM
70 TU
Diagnostic Time:
Diagnostic time reimbursement follows guidelines printed in Section 2.2 of the Audi Warranty Policies and Procedures Manual
Claim Comment:
As per TSB #2017369/3
All warranty claims submitted for payment must be in accordance with the Audi Warranty Policies and Procedures Manual. Claims are subject to review or audit by Audi Warranty.
Required Parts and Tools
* Approved charger.
Additional Information
The following Technical Service Bulletin will be necessary to complete this procedure:
* 2011732; Software Version Management (SVM) Operating Manual
All part and service references provided in this TSB are subject to change and/or removal. Always check with your Parts Dept. and service manuals for the latest information.
I cannot find any text for the lifter TSB but I found an interesting software update TSB hich addresses a rattle at startup. Not sure if it applies to our cars but interesting anyway.
TSB 2017369/3 says:
Technical Service Bulletin Transaction No.: 2017369/3
24 Rattling from intake manifold Release date: Dec 17, 2008
Condition
REVISION HISTORY
Revision
Date
Purpose
3
-
Revised Title to add Repair Group
Sporadic hard metallic rattling sound from intake manifold only after first cold start, audible for 1-2 seconds.
Technical Background
Early activation of the vacuum solenoid valves for the variable intake manifold by the Engine Control Module
(J623) during cold engine starts may cause the internal intake flaps to vibrate and create a brief rattling sound from the intake manifold.
Production Solution
New software in Engine Control Module (J623) resolved the intake manifold rattling issue.
Tip: Please explain to the customers that this new software is the latest software level with improved driving characteristics, which includes the following changes:
* The exhaust flap (if equipped) is always open, and no diagnosis of the Exhaust Flap Valve N321 is possible. Up to 1,700 rpm the engine is a bit louder, as the exhaust flap is always open.
* Faster throttle overrun cutoff, with more direct accelerator pedal and reduced overrun after releasing the accelerator.
* To prevent the clutch from slipping when accelerating from a stop, the engine torque is slightly reduced when vehicle speed is below 20 mph and the engine speed is higher than 4600 rpm. There is no noticeable performance difference.
Service
SVM Update Instructions
1. If you encounter a vehicle with a tuned ECM or TCM, your dealership must do the following before performing any procedure that updates ECM or TCM programming:
Note:
Any Update Programming procedure (flash) may overwrite any tuned ECM or TCM programming. A tuned ECM or TCM is described as any ECM or TCM altered so as to perform outside the normal parameters and specifications approved by Audi of America, Inc.
a. Notify the owner that their ECM or TCM was found to have been tuned.
b. Notify the owner that any damage caused by the tuning of the ECM or TCM (including any adverse emissions consequences) will not be covered by Audi of America, Inc. warranties.
c. Obtain the owner's written consent (see attached Control Module Tuning form) for any requested repair - under warranty or outside warranty - that requires flashing that will automatically overwrite the tuned program.
2. Check the software part number and software level in the Engine Control Module (J623).
3. Prior to beginning the SVM process, insert a USB memory stick into the VAS 5051 tester to capture the diagnostic log electronically.
4. Connect the VAS 5051A and VAS 5051B to a 110V AC power supply. The VAS 5051A and VAS 5051B must be connected to 110V AC power supply at all times during the procedure.
5. Update the Engine Control Module (J623) using SVM action code as listed in the table below if necessary.
Note: Only VAS 6017B adapter can be used for this update. Usage of VAS 6017 or 6017A may result in complete control module failure
If the vehicle has a tuned ECM or TCM, ensure the Control Module Tuning form has been filled out by the owner.
* Tip: The SVM Process must be completed in its entirety so the database receives the update confirmation response. A warranty claim may not be reimbursed if there is no confirmation response to support the claim.
* After updating the programming of the ECM, it is not necessary to set the Readiness Code.
For further SVM update instructions and troubleshooting, please refer to the SVM Operating Manual; ElsaWeb TSB 2011732.
Warranty
When procedure applies to vehicles under warranty, use the following:
SAGA
Claim Type:
110
Service Number:
2470
Damage Code:
0039
Labor Operations:
2470 25 99
Update Engine Control Module with SVM
70 TU
Diagnostic Time:
Diagnostic time reimbursement follows guidelines printed in Section 2.2 of the Audi Warranty Policies and Procedures Manual
Claim Comment:
As per TSB #2017369/3
All warranty claims submitted for payment must be in accordance with the Audi Warranty Policies and Procedures Manual. Claims are subject to review or audit by Audi Warranty.
Required Parts and Tools
* Approved charger.
Additional Information
The following Technical Service Bulletin will be necessary to complete this procedure:
* 2011732; Software Version Management (SVM) Operating Manual
All part and service references provided in this TSB are subject to change and/or removal. Always check with your Parts Dept. and service manuals for the latest information.
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Thread Starter
Club AutoUnion
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 833
Likes: 332
From: West Michigan
I hear ya brother. I think I need an intervention.
I appreciate you post about the rattling intake manifold. Actually, that makes more sense because the rattling never last more than about a second and it seems to me that it takes longer to fill a hydraulic lifter.
I'll run this by my dealer.
I appreciate you post about the rattling intake manifold. Actually, that makes more sense because the rattling never last more than about a second and it seems to me that it takes longer to fill a hydraulic lifter.
I'll run this by my dealer.