took the allroad to the local Jeep dealer yesterday when turning in our leased Grand Cherokee...
02-13-2008, 09:21 AM
#1
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took the allroad to the local Jeep dealer yesterday when turning in our leased Grand Cherokee...
lease rep actually had the nerve to say, "Nice car, but it won't do as well in the snow as the Jeep." My wife and I just bit our tongues and sat silent, awestruck and chuckling to ourselves.
3+ years ago, when moving out of my A4 and into the Grand Cherokee, I remember being extremely disappointed in the Jeep's ability in the snow, even with upgraded "off-road" tires. The A4 ran circles around it. Having limited experience in the allroad in the mountains here in Colorado, even with nearly bald "all-weather" tires, the Jeep doesn't even compare.
No real point to my post I guess...just wanted to share that story. It wasn't even worth getting into a discussion with the Jeep rep, just let it go.
3+ years ago, when moving out of my A4 and into the Grand Cherokee, I remember being extremely disappointed in the Jeep's ability in the snow, even with upgraded "off-road" tires. The A4 ran circles around it. Having limited experience in the allroad in the mountains here in Colorado, even with nearly bald "all-weather" tires, the Jeep doesn't even compare.
No real point to my post I guess...just wanted to share that story. It wasn't even worth getting into a discussion with the Jeep rep, just let it go.
02-13-2008, 12:14 PM
#5
well maybe
a modded jeep with a 6" lift on 40" tires with lockers front and rear would make it through snow that was too deep for the allroad.
but in any other situation, I'd prefer the allroad.
but in any other situation, I'd prefer the allroad.
02-13-2008, 02:16 PM
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Tires...
Come on now, the AR isn't *that* good in the snow. Too much cool-aide being passed around in this forum...good thing you bit your tongue. I have a used up set of Icebears on mine now and frankly it stinks. When the Icebears were new, though, it was a competent handler.
Contrary to your experience, I used to have an A4 and a '99 jeep grand cherokee in 2WD was better than my A4 in the snow. Granted the A4 had Dunlop summer tires and the jeep had a set of Goodyear all-seasons. The point is that quattro wasn't showing the love and doesn't overcome the most important component in determining ultimate grip.
From a pure engineering standpoint, quattro w/ torsen works well in dry and wet traction conditions. But it compromises quite a bit in truly slick conditions. The torsen tends to hunt for traction (vs locking) which isn't the best thing from a control perspective (in other words, it isn't predictable). I've never liked EDL. At a minimum, give me any limited slip or even better, one of the more sophisticated electronic diffs. Solution for EDL? Keep your speeds up.
So you may ask why I drive an AR over a jeep? Lots of reasons. My AR is a 6 speed. I prefer the german handling and build quality. I like the wagon and find the package more versatile.
For general use, tires are far more important than the AWD/4WD systems we're comparing. All the videos of audis performing non-real world feats are what they are...staged marketing demonstrations that worked quite well. Next time I need to climb a ski slope or run around with bare rims...
Contrary to your experience, I used to have an A4 and a '99 jeep grand cherokee in 2WD was better than my A4 in the snow. Granted the A4 had Dunlop summer tires and the jeep had a set of Goodyear all-seasons. The point is that quattro wasn't showing the love and doesn't overcome the most important component in determining ultimate grip.
From a pure engineering standpoint, quattro w/ torsen works well in dry and wet traction conditions. But it compromises quite a bit in truly slick conditions. The torsen tends to hunt for traction (vs locking) which isn't the best thing from a control perspective (in other words, it isn't predictable). I've never liked EDL. At a minimum, give me any limited slip or even better, one of the more sophisticated electronic diffs. Solution for EDL? Keep your speeds up.
So you may ask why I drive an AR over a jeep? Lots of reasons. My AR is a 6 speed. I prefer the german handling and build quality. I like the wagon and find the package more versatile.
For general use, tires are far more important than the AWD/4WD systems we're comparing. All the videos of audis performing non-real world feats are what they are...staged marketing demonstrations that worked quite well. Next time I need to climb a ski slope or run around with bare rims...
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02-13-2008, 02:33 PM
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i can only speak to my experiences...
you may have very valid points and to be not so fair, my A4 was outfitted with Dunlop Graspics. The Jeep, even with upgraded M&S "off-road" tires didn't seem nearly as confident. That could also be attributed to my lack of any real winter driving skills/training.