Interesting, just got this from Audi.
12-17-2003, 12:10 PM
#23
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It would be...though my trannie allows 20mph or less drops to first
Maybe I am lucky I dont know but it lets me get into first at 20 or lower...
If the new trannie can hold up with extra power then it would be great for future tuning :-)
If the new trannie can hold up with extra power then it would be great for future tuning :-)
12-17-2003, 12:17 PM
#25
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Not quite...
265 DIN hp = 261.3 SAE BHP.
That's not the telltale figure though. The Euro S4 is rated at 400 Nm of torque (US is 350 Nm) which works out to 295 ft-lbs.
The Euro car is more potent.
That's not the telltale figure though. The Euro S4 is rated at 400 Nm of torque (US is 350 Nm) which works out to 295 ft-lbs.
The Euro car is more potent.
12-17-2003, 12:30 PM
#26
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The HP difference, as I said, was partially attributed to the exhaust and..
partially to the DIN rating.
I never said anything about torque.
The real question is why is a stock US S4 not any faster than a stock Euro S4?
I have worked with Audi since 1997 and even asked this question when in Ingolstadt. I was told the motors are identical, that the ECU parameters are slightly different due to emissions requirements, and that the HP and TQ differences are purely how they are represented.
But that's just what Walter Stroebel, an Audi engineer, told me. Guess he could be wrong!
Mike S
I never said anything about torque.
The real question is why is a stock US S4 not any faster than a stock Euro S4?
I have worked with Audi since 1997 and even asked this question when in Ingolstadt. I was told the motors are identical, that the ECU parameters are slightly different due to emissions requirements, and that the HP and TQ differences are purely how they are represented.
But that's just what Walter Stroebel, an Audi engineer, told me. Guess he could be wrong!
Mike S
12-17-2003, 12:42 PM
#28
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I understand about the horsepower discrepancies...
which could definitely be attributed to the exhaust, but 45 ft-lbs is ALOT. No way an "exhaust change" will make that much power.
More likely, the US motor is somewhat underrated, but I've maintained this for a while.
One would have to surmise that some of those software "tweaks" are similar to the tweaks chip tuners use. As disco said, the Germans are more inclined to put better fuel in their cars unlike cheap/dumb Americans (you know there are plenty of S4's out there with 87 in the tank) which allows them to run more aggressive timing and perhaps more boost.
I agree that the engines themselves are identical.
You seem to know a lot of engineers. ;-)
More likely, the US motor is somewhat underrated, but I've maintained this for a while.
One would have to surmise that some of those software "tweaks" are similar to the tweaks chip tuners use. As disco said, the Germans are more inclined to put better fuel in their cars unlike cheap/dumb Americans (you know there are plenty of S4's out there with 87 in the tank) which allows them to run more aggressive timing and perhaps more boost.
I agree that the engines themselves are identical.
You seem to know a lot of engineers. ;-)
12-17-2003, 01:04 PM
#29
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I work as a corporate photographer and Audi is a client. So, yes, I know a lot of Audi engineers and other people at Audi US and AG.
Know enough to have direct numbers to the Ingolstadt R&D facility. Enough to get RS4 gears and synchros installed, under a durability test, in my S4 (and have the paperwork to prove it) at no charge.
I am a very inquisitve person, so when I have the chance to spend a week doing a photo shoot with the Audi/Joest ALMS Team for Time-Life Pictures, yes, I ask a lot of questions. Same thing with Champion. Same thing when I go to Ingolstadt.
I agree, the TQ discrepancies are major, but as you said, the 2.7TT in the S4 is far underrated. A 3500LBS car with 250HP/Tq does not run 13.8 in the 1/4 mile, period.
The ocatane issue brought up by 2K2S4 is valid, and not valid. As you likely know, the Euro E228 octane rating is totaly different then our RON+MON/2. Basically, there octane ratings are not comparable, and their 98 actually equals about 95.
That being said, 95 octane is far better than 91. And, as you likely know as an engineer, the TüV verifies all hp/nm numbers, along with top speed and acceleration figures (among others).
What likely is happening is the same motor, with the same boost, is actually making more power on Euro fuel and being rated accurately in German literature.
Only a guess, but it's an educated one based on all of our brainstorming.
TC,
Mike S
Know enough to have direct numbers to the Ingolstadt R&D facility. Enough to get RS4 gears and synchros installed, under a durability test, in my S4 (and have the paperwork to prove it) at no charge.
I am a very inquisitve person, so when I have the chance to spend a week doing a photo shoot with the Audi/Joest ALMS Team for Time-Life Pictures, yes, I ask a lot of questions. Same thing with Champion. Same thing when I go to Ingolstadt.
I agree, the TQ discrepancies are major, but as you said, the 2.7TT in the S4 is far underrated. A 3500LBS car with 250HP/Tq does not run 13.8 in the 1/4 mile, period.
The ocatane issue brought up by 2K2S4 is valid, and not valid. As you likely know, the Euro E228 octane rating is totaly different then our RON+MON/2. Basically, there octane ratings are not comparable, and their 98 actually equals about 95.
That being said, 95 octane is far better than 91. And, as you likely know as an engineer, the TüV verifies all hp/nm numbers, along with top speed and acceleration figures (among others).
What likely is happening is the same motor, with the same boost, is actually making more power on Euro fuel and being rated accurately in German literature.
Only a guess, but it's an educated one based on all of our brainstorming.
TC,
Mike S