Edm_l1mpin

Short version - looking for second car, hey those A4's are nice and I can afford a used one, man why do they seem overpriced outside of Ontario / Quebec.

Long version - have some extra dough and decided it was time to get a second car. Have a 98 Grand Prix bought new and I'm dying a slow death not having a standard. Started looking at new cars in the $20K range that had options like ABS, sunroof, ... The types of cars available were the base Matrix and Civic. To get the options I wanted the price came closer to or above $25K which seemed crazy. Did a quick scan on Canada Trader for used cars in the $20K range and there was a huge choice - things like Preludes, Integra GS-R, ... and then a saw a few of these Audi A4's - wholly @#$% - why had I never noticed these cars before - beautiful looking cars - quattro - ...

So the search began - checked many websites for prices / specs / options ... One thing most sites said that was on my side was Audi's drop in value faster than many sports cars (eg. BMWs). But cars available out in Alberta all seemed $4 - $10K higher than what they should. This was compared to the VRM site and prices advertised by dealers (which should be higher than private) in Ontario and Quebec. The only local dealer in Edmonton was trying to sell 1999 1.8T with 50-70K on them for $29-$30K. Granted - these were certified cars (2 year warranty) and there was room to haggle (maybe to $26K). I took a quick test drive at the dealer and was convinced that I had to have one. However, since 80% of used A4 cars being sold in Alberta are dealer cars, all the private sellers think they can get the same inflated price for the cars.

After a couple months of casually scanning I saw one high km A4 down in Calgary (loaded 98 1.8T with 130k on it for $17K). Phoned they guy, said it was mainly highway kms - so go to next step - have him pick a mechanic in Calgary (Stevo's) for an inspection which I would pay for. A few delays latter I'm heading down that Saturday to the mechanic where he dropped off the car - he was late to show up so I had 20 minutes with the mechanic first. The car had the crap driven out of it, one of the front wheels was ready to fall off (4" of play!!!), winter tires (it was July) were ready to explode, 3 of 4 wheels badly scraped, the front end was all repainted (he said it wasn't in any accidents on the phone), the battery was dead, various scrapes and dents. The mechanic checked the glove box for the registration (to see if it was registered as a previously damaged car) and only found several speeding tickets He flat out said don't buy this car, at least 3-4K in repairs to get it back to where it should be. The only good news was the compression on the engine was still great - so even with the abuse the engine was strong. So - it seemed like a wasted $200 and a drive to Calgary.

I told him how much I was going to pay and he laughed and said that was way too much - I told him it was several thousand less than I've seen most cars advertised and he said that he brokers cars ... He said most of the cars he gets are lease backs from Ontario and weekly he gets an updated list. He also said that with the non-public auctions he has access to, he can always return the car as well. He would charge me 5% of the cost plus I would pay the auction and shipping fees (plus GST). The guy seemed very trustworthy so later in the week I faxed him specs for the car I wanted. In short, 1998-2000 A4, 1.8T std, with sunroof and preferably sprt pkg, and preferably a dark colour (blue, red, green) - not white or black. I do realize that colour greatly limits selection - but I'm stubborn. I called about 4 weeks later (mid August) and he said he was still looking, but now is a good time to buy because the 2004's are coming out which lowers the price of used cars a bit. Now mid September and no word. I told him that I would give him till the end of September before I started looking more seriously myself.

My current choices are:
1 - very few prospects for a private sale in Alberta for the specific car I want
2 - broker in Calgary don't seem to be looking too hard
3 - I can likely negotiate with the Edmonton dealer for a 1999 model in the $24-25K range + GST (big bonus of being certified but still $5k higher than I think it should be)
4 - a couple dealers in Ontario indicate they will ship cars out here. They have 2000 models in the $21-$22K range plus the shipping, GST, etc.

Anyway, good on you if you read this far. My stress level is slowly increasing with each A4 I see out on the roads and figure a month from now I'll have my A4 one way or the other. Frustrated I couldn't get this done sooner to make it out to the track event here a few weeks ago. But reading these posts for the past few months has just convinced me that it is the car I must have. I won't be into the major mods a lot of you do, but chipping will be done after a few months for sure, and maybe things like clear headlight corners and some nice wheels (when more $$$ come my way).

If anyone had any thoughts on which option to pursue and/or places to deal with to buy my audi_two_b please let me know. Thanks

36valves

It's a known fact that West coast cars are worth more than east coast cars for a few reasons:

1. We don't use as much salt during winter, so rust is less of a problem. All the underbody nuts and bolts do rust if exposed for long enough.

2. There are by far way more Audis sold in Ontario than in Alberta, so obviously there are more used ones over there, which lower their prices a bit.

I have a few comments regarding your post:
- Are you comfortable enough to buy a car sight unseen? I'm not. Sure you may get lucky, but you also may not. In that case you could be screwed especially it's an independent broker.

- With all the high mileage lease back, you never know what that car's been through. This is especially important for turbo cars. Did the previous owner allow for proper warmup and cooldown after a long hard drive? Shutting off the car after a hard run repeatedly can kill the turbo, I wonder how many turbo cars owners/drivers out there know about it.

For me, I'd rather pay a little more and find a car that's been properly cared for. I realize mine is probably out of your price range, but contact me if you are interested. I'm in Calgary.

Edm_l1mpin

Thanks for the reply - points all well taken and agreed with. My one comment is that most of the lease backs are not high mileage (in the 30 - 70K range for 1999-2000), but still points well taken. I'll give you a quick e-mail on the price of yours, but aside from the lower price I like the look of the pre 2001 models (especially the squared off trunk).

Xel

and look for A4's in Ontario you will be able to find them for as low 14's. Yes they will be high milage and so on so forh, but cheap:-)

A4's here in BC are about 5-8 grand more than in Ontario :-) but condition is always better too. Personally, I wouldn't mind buying an A4 from Ontario, but I would have to fly there and choose the car myself. So if I buy a 2 way ticket, if I finally chose the car and drive it back I will spend money on gas and food, and then when I get here in BC I will spend some more money and time on inspection and regestering the car which will equal to couple grand and 2 weeks of my time. Does it sound like a good deal now:-)?

Hugh B

40 valves is a B5 old style car. Very clean.
Hugh

NS2000X

...make a trip to Ontario, Toronto specifically, they have by far the largest concentration of used A4's across Canada. Plus although bound to use more salt than you guys out West, Toronto has a lot milder winters than us Eastern Ontario residents (I've lived in both regions).
Plus what better way to get aquinted to your new A4 than a cross country trip.

NS2000X

shelltox

Your experience in Calgary sounds very interesting. I think we could be talking about the same guy. He called me back about 2 wks after I saw the car and offered me at $15K which I downright refused.

Would appreciate if you can email me and we'll share more. Pretty much we're both in the same shoes heading in the same direction.

eh-4Q1.8

Ditto on the opinion of 40valves car. His car is a "must see" if your in the market.

36valves

Thanks guys ;-)