ski ya later

NOT! you can only get fade for 2 reasons (Iam sure you know this, since you know the way I drive)and neither of these reasons are caused by the caliper not being strong enough. If you are getting fade it is not the calipers problem, it is either the wrong pads for the temp range you are into, or the fluid is boiling because your heatsink is not working effectively (ie:rotors).where does any of this become the calipers problem??

MikTip

If one can afford the big Alcon brakes, then your in!

I can afford any brake setup there is available on the market today. Money is not problem.

I purchased the Wilwoods, because at the time they were the only thing available for my Audi without having to convert to 5 bolt hubs or customs brackets.

What I find here in AudiWorld are people who for some strange reason like to knock the Wilwoods, and its always someone who has never had any first hand experience with the Wilwoods. Then when questioned as to why they believe Wilwoods
"suck" (in their opinion) I get half *** answers
like "well I heard", or "someone said".

Everyone's entitled to their "opinion", but making statements that something "sucks" and never having even touched a set of Wilwoods, really makes me wonder about your credability!

I've owned my Wilwoods for almost a year. They've been on the track, SCCA, weekend street racing, etc. Several different pad compounds, etc. To date, not a single problem! Just because I own Wilwoods means I'm not capable of driving my Audi to its limits? I have to have a set of Alcon's!
Any one with Alcons, has "paid the price" and therefore MUST be a driver who heavily uses his brakes and "knows" how to drive! Is that the thinking here?

So, by me going out an spending $3300 on brakes,
I've arrived!

How much cash did you spend on your brakes ftodc? $3300? Why not?

How come you cant afford Alcons? Lets hear it!

You go out buy and set of Alcon's today, send me the reciept, and then I'll buy a set! Deal?

PS- I carry a wallet.

jussnb

You make less & less sense with every post. Quite entertaining.

jussnb

simply stating that there are a lot of people around here who know way more than me. You probably have more Audi & tuning experience than I do. But face it, you're trying to convince everyone that your brake setup is the best thing since sliced bread, even though you have no proof to back it up except for "they work well for me."

There's definitely something to be said for that, but the truth is that I have talked with more people who have had NEGATIVE firsthand experience with Wilwoods than people who have had POSITIVE firsthand experience.

You asked about Audi experience...and I will tell you that my A4 is my first Audi. But I have an assortment of mods that only a handful other street-legal cars in the world (to my knowledge) can claim to have. I realize that simply purchasing performance mods doesn't make you an expert on them...but I know them pretty well & I'm always learning more.

I know enough about brakes to know that my stock setup is horrible. And I'm looking at my auctions. But I educate myself well about products before I buy them, and I am confident that I will know whatever kit I buy inside & out.

But I have a lot of CAR experience - more than most people I know, in fact. I have owned a total of 9 cars ranging from Land Rover Defenders to Honda Civic Sis to VW GTIs to A4s. And I have left none of them bone stock. Maybe I don't know Audi performance like an expert YET, but I probably know more about performance tuning on a wide range of cars than most people.

And there you have it.

jim n

What is your position, background and education in engineering?
Just curious since jussnb says you've got all this amazing experience in Audi tuning and I've not had the personal experience to meet you.

MikTip

Re: Entertain us with names, dates and specific details.

jim n

Okay, sorry for the personal attack on your driving but I'm guessing that there is some reason that you have not reached the limit of your brakes yet, while myself and others I know using the same kit have.
The calipers, discs and the pads you have used are no different than I used or than others who have these kits have.
The disc and the pad alone are not the only part of the equation in cooling, either. Your rotors show 975f but what temps are your calipers at? What is their limit? The better a caliper's design is in heat disappation (via better quality alloys used in casting the caliper, ceramic coatings, drilled titanium piston inserts, cooling passages cast in them, etc.) the better it will help to prevent fade.
The pistons in the Wilwood caliper are a very thin-walled stainless steel construction. As soon as that piston gets hot, it immediately transfers that heat to the fluid because the caliper itself is not designed to prevent it in any way.
My own experience has shown me that my heavy, fast car needs a far better quality brake set up than the Wilwood kit. Money as no object, one must look at why the race teams who are in Road Racing use Race-quality Brembos (Pete Cunningham's Realtime Acuras), Race-quality AP brakes and Alcon Brake systems (Audi S4 comps). I haven't seen many Wilwoods except on perhaps very light cars that don't have much speed potential.
I don't think I or any others here are trying to say you can't afford better, we're just trying to say that the Wilwood kit is not a very good kit for the heavier Audi applications if you expect to track your car and drive it hard.

MikTip

You say-"you're trying to convince everyone that your brake setup is the best thing since sliced bread, even though you have no proof to back it up except for "they work well for me." Lets go for a ride in my Audi.

I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.

I'm "defending" the Wilwoods. I dont claim anything other than they are an upgrade alternative to OEM brakes. Costing only $800, a very reasonable, "lower costing" alternative to the $3300 setups.

I'm defending them because no one single person on this forum has come forward, with actual, "hands-on" experience, with specific details of why the Wilwoods are so bad! Its all rumor! If their so bad, why are mine doing so well? If their so bad, why is Wilwood still in business?

I'd very much like to know the specific areas in which these Wilwoods have problems.

You say "I have talked with more people who have had NEGATIVE firsthand experience with Wilwoods than people who have had POSITIVE firsthand experience" Ok, I want names, dates and places of where & when the Wilwoods failed, with specific details? Can you provide that?

You ever remove & replace your own brakes? You do your own maintenance? How about custom fabrication on your own car?

You ever driven an Audi with Wilwood brakes?

So how do you actually know the Wilwoods are no good?

jussnb

looking for brakes early this year and posted up some questions. I read no less than 4 posts from people on this forum who actually had Wilwoods at one time and got rid of them because of their bad experiences. The feedback that I got was that the rotors and brackets were too flimsy for a car that weighs as much as my 2.8 A4 and those undersized/underbuilt components resulted in poor performance and actual damage of the brakes in one instance.

Face it, man...if the Wilwoods were as good as you say EVERYONE around here would have them. Especially at the $800 price point. But the fact that there are few sets out there is a flashing red light to me. People like inexpensive stuff that works great. But the fact that nobody wants these brakes tells me that there's something wrong.

Yes, I have done my own brake work (rotors & pads) and yes I do my own maintenance. I don't change my own oil, though, because I worked a deal with my dealership when I bought the car so they do it for me. But I do everything else.

No I don't do custom fabrication. Why the heck would I? There are a number of talented companies & people out there who are much better at it than I am, and I would feel better buying products from people who do that kind of stuff for a living. My Big Valve Heads, Headers, and all of the other engine mods I have are classic examples. I would never be able to do that level of work, and I'm not ashamed to admit it. More power to you if you can.

MikTip

Only found 2 people who actually owned the Wilwoods, and experienced problems first hand!

One, he modified his setup, and felt he may have caused the problem. But didnt really know why the problem was there? Odd.

The other stated his suffered from too much flexing. But also stated they worked fine.

What was interesting, were the posts later on, trying to repeat what they read earlier. They had exagerated the original story or mixed it the details to make it sound worse than originally posted!

From what I gather of the 2 Wilwood owners, the calipers dont have dust seals, and shouldnt be driven in winter.

One person claimed they seen a set of Wilwoods overheated at a track, but had no "details".<ul><li><a href="https://www.audiworld.com/forum/m/performance/msgs/27708.phtml">https://www.audiworld.com/forum/m/performance/msgs/27708.phtml</a</li></ul>